DIY Buff Compounds

AdamSmith

AdamSmith

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Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
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Recently I've been making up my own buff compounds. One has been pretty spectacularly successful, two others made similarly are ok but not great. Has anybody got notions of the usual ratios of the non-abrasive ingredients (waxes, lards etc), and of binder to abrasive?

Would really love to hear others experiences.
 
Never bothered to. Most are a mix of tallows and waxes with well graded silicon carbide or other abrasives. Steric acid and beeswax are the most common ingredient added to the abrasives.
 
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I'm interested in this too... I want to make some diamond buffing compound which you can't get currently.
 
AdamSmith said:
It is diamond compounds that I've made up. They've made a tremendous difference in finishing high vanadium grades (CPM-10V, S90V, CPM-M4 and Magnacut, so far)
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That's exactly why I wanted it! That's awesome.

This is the only video I've found on it but haven't tried it yet

 
I watched that before I made the first one. It was helpful in showing it is possible, but for ideal binder formulation, not very.

I've done the same thing he did so far: just use beeswax. My first bar of 7 micron diamond was great. The next two of 400 grit and of 1 micron, are too sticky: too much beeswax for not enough abrasive. Still useful, but I'm going to recast them to adjust proportions.

I'm going to try adding some tallow to the next bars, and keep track of measurements this time (the first three I don't have weights of ingredients). I'll post results.

I'm going to go on looking for more information on normal practice for commercial compounds, on binder formulation.
 
I have seen that video and the info seems OK.
Diamond powder can be bought in 1000 carat/200gm lots for about $1.00 a gram. That would make up a good size batch of buffing compound.

An FYI to those not familiar ... White Diamond buffing compound has no diamond in it. It is white rouge, which is a fast cutting polish below red rouge in fineness. It is good to remove fine scratches. Actually, while it is called white rouge, it is not a rouge (iron oxide), but is aluminum oxide.
 
AdamSmith said:
I watched that before I made the first one. It was helpful in showing it is possible, but for ideal binder formulation, not very.

I've done the same thing he did so far: just use beeswax. My first bar of 7 micron diamond was great. The next two of 400 grit and of 1 micron, are too sticky: too much beeswax for not enough abrasive. Still useful, but I'm going to recast them to adjust proportions.

I'm going to try adding some tallow to the next bars, and keep track of measurements this time (the first three I don't have weights of ingredients). I'll post results.

I'm going to go on looking for more information on normal practice for commercial compounds, on binder formulation.
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Yeah I tried researching what the regular industrial bars of compound use for a binder but couldn't find anything.

You can make wax softer by mixing mineral oil with it fwiw
 
Interesting regarding the steric acid. I may try "adding some to taste". I know what I'm aiming for in terms of behavior. The 100% beeswax just makes things a bit too sticky, provides a bit of a barrier between the abrasive and the steel if there is too much of it. I definitely need to dial back the binder to abrasive ratio, but I think something soft and non-tacky like the steric might make a big difference as well.

I definitely will be tracking weights with the next round. I can work out the what the ratios were for the last two, but I really don't know what it was for the first one (which is the one that is working really well, of course).
 
With diamond powder, I would think the minimum binder tat will work is what you want. I would also make it firmer/dryer. Perhaps adding some very fine AO or SC in the mix will make it solider and dryer. The extra polishing abrasive won't hurt either.

I have to look in my lapidary supplies. IIRC, I had a jar of 5 micron diamond. Might be a fun experiment.
 
AdamSmith said:
Interesting regarding the steric acid. I may try "adding some to taste". I know what I'm aiming for in terms of behavior. The 100% beeswax just makes things a bit too sticky, provides a bit of a barrier between the abrasive and the steel if there is too much of it. I definitely need to dial back the binder to abrasive ratio, but I think something soft and non-tacky like the steric might make a big difference as well.

I definitely will be tracking weights with the next round. I can work out the what the ratios were for the last two, but I really don't know what it was for the first one (which is the one that is working really well, of course).
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You made any progress on this Adam?
 
I use the Venev Diamond Stropping pastes on strops. I wonder if they would work on a buffing wheel....something to try this week! They are a waxy paste that soaks into leather when heated up with the heat gun.
 
I have some hard felt 3" buffing wheels I got for my generic foredom; I will try the diamond paste on them this week. Black Magic on a worn cork belt works really nicely on simple steels, but I haven't tried it on S90V, Magnacut, etc yet. Hopefully later this week too!
 
Taz said:
I have some hard felt 3" buffing wheels I got for my generic foredom; I will try the diamond paste on them this week. Black Magic on a worn cork belt works really nicely on simple steels, but I haven't tried it on S90V, Magnacut, etc yet. Hopefully later this week too!
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That's more of a paste though right? I'm wanting a diamond compound in bar form for buffing wheels... I have paste but it's a pain to apply to buffing wheels haha
 
I made up some new compound yesterday, keeping track of the amounts. I've been working with the 7 micron in the shop this morning, and it is working really well (even better than the first batch of 7 micron). So:

7 micron:
Beeswax: 21.2 grams
Stearic Acid 10.3 grams
diamond powder 100 grams
yield was around 3 1/2 cu in of compound (for sizing your mold). I used icicle pop silicon molds, worked well. I'm sure the tenths of grams don't matter, but fwiw that is what the components weighed, actual.

.5 micron (I haven't used this, but it seems right at the blend and pour. I'll post actual results once I've used it)
Beeswax 25 grams
Stearic Acid 12.5
diamond powder 80 grams.

I didn't weigh out the diamond additions, but I did weigh one of the packages, and it was consistent with the declared weights from the vendors.

At this point I'm using the diamond even on steels where aluminum oxide works ok. I just plain like it a lot better than any conventional compound I've ever used (for steel polishing, soft materials are a different matter).

The stearic does seem to make the compound a bit less sticky in use.

REK's comment about maximizing the amount of abrasive per amount of binder is exactly right, (in my experience now, with different ratios). We only want enough of the binders (molten) to allow it to pour, no more.
 
AdamSmith said:
I made up some new compound yesterday, keeping track of the amounts. I've been working with the 7 micron in the shop this morning, and it is working really well (even better than the first batch of 7 micron). So:

7 micron:
Beeswax: 21.2 grams
Stearic Acid 10.3 grams
diamond powder 100 grams
yield was around 3 1/2 cu in of compound (for sizing your mold). I used icicle pop silicon molds, worked well. I'm sure the tenths of grams don't matter, but fwiw that is what the components weighed, actual.

.5 micron (I haven't used this, but it seems right at the blend and pour. I'll post actual results once I've used it)
Beeswax 25 grams
Stearic Acid 12.5
diamond powder 80 grams.

I didn't weigh out the diamond additions, but I did weigh one of the packages, and it was consistent with the declared weights from the vendors.

At this point I'm using the diamond even on steels where aluminum oxide works ok. I just plain like it a lot better than any conventional compound I've ever used (for steel polishing, soft materials are a different matter).

The stearic does seem to make the compound a bit less sticky in use.

REK's comment about maximizing the amount of abrasive per amount of binder is exactly right, (in my experience now, with different ratios). We only want enough of the binders (molten) to allow it to pour, no more.
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excellent! so do you feel that is a good ratio so far on the 7 micron bar? does it apply to the buffing wheel well?
 
Forgot to try the Venev pastes out! I got one of those 3" variable speed bench buffers for Christmas, so I may try it out on that instead of the generic Foredom setup.
 
REK Knives said:
excellent! so do you feel that is a good ratio so far on the 7 micron bar? does it apply to the buffing wheel well?
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I'm probably happy with this ratio for the 7 micron (ie won't bother changing it further). Both this recipe and the original beeswax-only apply really well to the wheel (and can be used very sparingly). This version has the compound sticking to the blade a little less, it runs as a dryer compound (which is good). The previous compound run where I made the 400x and 10,000x bars had too much beeswax. They still ran ok, but nothing like as nicely as this recipe. I'm probably not going to bother with the 400x in future, the 7 micron takes care of 20 micron grinding scratches very easily, even in the hard high vanadium steels.

The 7 micron finish reads like a full mirror finish, you can just barely make out the buffing scratches with close examination. I'm curious to see how the .5 micron will deal with the 7 micron finish. Will know shortly.

This is based on 6" stitched cotton wheels running at 3600 rpm. I have not used the hard corrugated buffing wheels yet. So far, I don't have a role for them.
 
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