DMT Aligner System - Update (First attempt)

[cm_bushman]

I have a DMT Aligner on the way, and after reading through some threads on it, I was just looking for some further opinions on the system, and what kind of results I can expect with respect to my edges and it's reliability. I know the limitations of the system as far as inconsistencies at the tip and choil, but I can live with some slight unevenness. Until I can nail down freehand sharpening (and get some quality stones), it was really the only option with my current budget. I chose the Aligner over the Lansky due to the stones, as I will mainly be working with high-wear steels.

How important is it to get the XC and EEF stones? I have heard several members recommend getting both as soon as possible. Will the time to re-profile be dramatically different with the XC, and how much will the quality of the edges improve with the EEF?

I'm also concerned that the lowest setting won't satisfy my desire for thin edges on my high Rc blades, what do you guys think of the lowest Aligner setting with (~3") EDC folders? Is it thin enough to maximize performance from a hard M4 or M390 blade? From what I can tell, the inclusive angle will likely end up around 32-34 degrees on most of my blades, or 16-17dps. What difference, if any, will I be able to tell between a factory edge like Benchmade's and an edge like this on the stock Aligner stones (C-EF)?

Also, any tips for a total neophyte sharpener on re-profiling and touching blades up? I've seen the "six passes" video, but I have no idea how much it would take to re-profile.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I have a DMT Aligner on the way, and after reading through some threads on it, I was just looking for some further opinions on the system, and what kind of results I can expect with respect to my edges and it's reliability. I know the limitations of the system as far as inconsistencies at the tip and choil, but I can live with some slight unevenness. Until I can nail down freehand sharpening (and get some quality stones), it was really the only option with my current budget. I chose the Aligner over the Lansky due to the stones, as I will mainly be working with high-wear steels.

How important is it to get the XC and EEF stones? I have heard several members recommend getting both as soon as possible. Will the time to re-profile be dramatically different with the XC, and how much will the quality of the edges improve with the EEF?

The bolded part above is why you might benefit from using the XC, at least. The Aligner's hones are relatively small, and in combination with high-wear steels, you'll want all the aggressiveness you can get. Otherwise, the going will be very slow. You might also consider, at some point in the future, using a bench-sized hone. Extra abrasive real estate is what will dramatically speed things up. With a bench-sized hone, you could likely do most/all of your re-bevelling using just a Coarse DMT. A Coarse/Fine DMT Duo-Sharp (interrupted surface) in 8" or larger is about as versatile as anything you'll find. And the Aligner clamp works GREAT with bench hone sharpening.

Whether you choose to use the EEF is pretty much personal preference. If pursuing polished edges, it's more important to include it (in addition to diamond stropping and/or UF ceramics, following the EEF hone).

I'm also concerned that the lowest setting won't satisfy my desire for thin edges on my high Rc blades, what do you guys think of the lowest Aligner setting with (~3") EDC folders? Is it thin enough to maximize performance from a hard M4 or M390 blade? From what I can tell, the inclusive angle will likely end up around 32-34 degrees on most of my blades, or 16-17dps. What difference, if any, will I be able to tell between a factory edge like Benchmade's and an edge like this on the stock Aligner stones (C-EF)?

Even at relatively wide edge angles (35° - 40° inclusive), the system is still quite capable of significant improvement over 'factory' edges. How good it ends up is dependent on how thoroughly and completely apexed the finished edge will be. That's up to you. Based on what I've recently heard about Benchmade's factory edges (said to often be rather thick and/or blunt), it may not be much of a stretch to improve upon them anyway.

It's hard to assume what actual edge angles will be, without actually taking measurements and/or calculating for it (do the trig). Guided/clamped systems are notoriously inaccurate, in terms of the stated angle 'settings' for the clamp. Depends entirely on blade width and blade positioning in the clamp, and the variation from the set & 'marked' angle can be huge at times.

You may find it difficult to get low angles on smaller/narrower blades, without finding a way to extend their edge a little further out from the front of the clamp. I've used an improvised 'shim' (piece of zip-tie) to do this when sharpening a SAK's main spear blade:

Also, any tips for a total neophyte sharpener on re-profiling and touching blades up? I've seen the "six passes" video, but I have no idea how much it would take to re-profile.

It'll take a LOT more to re-profile. The 'six passes' demo'd by DMT basically just illustrates how to add a microbevel to an edge. That's obviously dependent on the existing edge already being in pretty good shape. As for other tips for using your Aligner, just keep hangin' around here and when specific issues or questions come up, don't be shy about posting them here. Lots of Aligner-users here, and I'm sure any questions you have will be answered in detail.


David

 

[stitchawl]

If you want thinner edges than the clamp's stone setting allow, use the clamp alone with bench stones, letting the clamp's adjusters ride on the table along side of the stone. Raising the stone in relation to the clamp will allow you to get a 4 degree inclusive edge if you so desire... but I don't recommend that for serious cutting.

I use the clamp in this manner, with wet/dry sandpaper, more than i use it with its designated stones.


Stitchawl

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

If you want thinner edges than the clamp's stone setting allow, use the clamp alone with bench stones, letting the clamp's adjusters ride on the table along side of the stone. Raising the stone in relation to the clamp will allow you to get a 4 degree inclusive edge if you so desire... but I don't recommend that for serious cutting.

I use the clamp in this manner, with wet/dry sandpaper, more than i use it with its designated stones.


Stitchawl

This is a very good point (clamp + bench stone => more useful at lower edge angles). I confirmed this for myself after re-bevelling a ZDP-189 Kershaw Leek, clamped in my Aligner clamp and used on my 8" Duo-Sharp. As it turned out, the edge I produced was really too thin for my own good. In a nutshell: brittle steel + very acute edge angle + very pointy tip profile = broken tip on my blade.


David

 

[aquaman67]

I started with (and still use) the DMT Aligner.

I would say if you're going to reprofile super steels, you'll want the EC stone.

As for the EEF, it's really just for polishing the edge, IMO. It's not going to make an edge that much sharper. If you want polished edges, then get it.

 

[cm_bushman]

Okay guys, I got my Aligner yesterday, and I really like the system. I find that most of the problems that others cite in reviews (thumb screw getting in the way, wobbly arms, weak clamp, etc.) are all easily fixed or non-existent in this example. The lowest angle is definitely an improvement over the stock BM edge, and I think the stones are top-notch, even before breaking in. I noticed the unevenness in the edge along the tip and heel, even in a small (3") blade. Hopefully I can tough these up separately, because even after the rest of the blade is sharpened, the tip has perhaps a half-inch of edge left untouched.

I tried sharpening my M4 Mini-Grip and I've got it up to shaving roughly, but I'm hoping to get hair-popping edges from the Aligner. I'm trying to work both sides evenly, and get the blade as sharp as I can before moving up in mesh. My main problem is simply that I don't know what to look for as far as a burr goes, and so when to switch sides and move up through stones. What should a burr look like and about how long should it take to achieve now that I have the edge thinned (used a sharpie to confirm this)? I have tried anywhere from six to 20 passes, and I still arrive at the same mediocre edge.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

May sound strange, but you might move up to the Fine/EF hone anyway, to hunt for and/or create the burr. Sometimes, I've had trouble with coarser diamond hones creating an obvious burr on some steels. I think they simply scrub much of it away too quickly, and that can make seeing and/or feeling for them a little more difficult. Dialing back the abrasiveness of the diamond hone, to something not as aggressive, sometimes makes it easier to create and then see the burr as it forms. I often don't even start with an EC diamond, or sometimes even the Coarse, because I've found it easier to form and detect a burr with somewhat less aggressive hones.

I wouldn't rely on counting passes, in hopes of achieving the apex this way. More often than not, when counting passes and still not being able to confirm the apex, it's usually because the apex isn't there yet. That's why it's important to carefully watch for the burr. That's the only guarantee the edge has thinned enough to fold over, which is the definitive indicator the edge is as thin as it can get. A Sharpie marker gives a very rough cue that you're close, but if inspecting closer under good magnification & bright light, you'll often see a hair-thin stripe of black ink along the edge, where the bevels still haven't been touched by the hones. It's sometimes amazing how long it takes to get that last bit of bevel ground away, near the apex. At that point, you're grinding the nearly-full width of the bevel, so the working speed of the hone slows down exponentially.


David

 

[Tymah123]

The real key to getting a hair popping edge is stropping. I use the DMT aligner and like it, I even adopted a Lansky stand for it and that helps A LOT as well. But the final touch is always a good strop. One of the longest re-profiling sessions I had was about 3hrs for the ESEE 6. Not sure if my my stones are getting worn out or what, I did do a lot of sharpening with them already... Good luck with your journey!

 

[aquaman67]

Congrats and I'm sure you'll refine your technique.

Did you practice on a lessor knife before you strapped in you M4 Mini Grip?

 

[cm_bushman]

The real key to getting a hair popping edge is stropping. I use the DMT aligner and like it, I even adopted a Lansky stand for it and that helps A LOT as well. But the final touch is always a good strop. One of the longest re-profiling sessions I had was about 3hrs for the ESEE 6. Not sure if my my stones are getting worn out or what, I did do a lot of sharpening with them already... Good luck with your journey!

Thanks, and I've stropped on my pants a bit, but not on my leather strop yet (I was very tired last night, so I just did a trial run), I'll take the strop to it tonight and let you know how it turns out. So far, M4 has really taken to a strop with the factory edge, so I can only assume it would be a big help with the new, thinner one.

Congrats and I'm sure you'll refine your technique.

Did you practice on a lessor knife before you strapped in you M4 Mini Grip?

No, I jumped right in, I know it was somewhat of a risk, but I couldn't wait to see how it would treat the M4. It's lightyears faster than the Arkansas stones I had been using.