Do you guys anneal stock before profiling/grinding?

stevenkelby

stevenkelby

Joined
Feb 27, 2010
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I'm curious, I want to buy some S30V and some 10V from the usual suppliers to finally make some proper knives (by stock removal).

I have been reading all I can find here on annealing and it seems most steels come in a semi-annealed state.

Do you guys anneal the stock you buy? How?

I read that it's necessary to heat the steel to cherry red then let it cool slowly, is that right? For both carbon and SS?

I don't have a forge or anything but do have a fireplace that I can get very, very hot if I load it up with enough red gum :)

Is it worth sending the steel stock to get annealed professionally?

Or should I just use it as it comes? I have a whole heap of great belts that I bought ages ago, zirconia and trizact but am scared of the 10V.

Any advice much appreciated, as always.

Steve.
 
G'day Steve,

Iv never worked with s30v or 10v before. But the stuff I get locally (D2, 1075 and RWL34) I have never annealled.

Matt
 
Hi Matt,

Thanks, I am considering D2 as well.

Some very nice pieces in your sig, I guess annealling must not be required.

:)
 
It is unnecessary as it comes soft enough to work.
More so, its probably not possible to anneal those steels in a fire.
 
The steels you mentioned will not respond well to a makeshift annealing and probably won't need it anyway.
 
Thanks guys, I was just wondering if it's possible to get the 10V any softer, to make it easier on the belts.

Sounds like it's not worth it and the old fireplace probably won't get hot enough. I guess no one bothers sending steel off for annealing.
 
Justin King said:
The steels you mentioned will not respond well to a makeshift annealing and probably won't need it anyway.
Click to expand...

Not only is it not necessary with those steels, attempting to anneal in a makeshift manner is going to make those steel unworkable, more likely, as they will probably work harden.
 
stevenkelby said:
Thanks guys, I was just wondering if it's possible to get the 10V any softer, to make it easier on the belts.

Sounds like it's not worth it and the old fireplace probably won't get hot enough. I guess no one bothers sending steel off for annealing.
Click to expand...

NOTHING is going to make 10V easier to work with; it contains so much Vanadium.
 
Danbo said:
NOTHING is going to make 10V easier to work with; it contains so much Vanadium.
Click to expand...

So I've heard :)

I'm only making little blades though...

Obviously I know nothing about annealing, but I have read a fair bit about heat treating and tempering, I'll be sending the blades off to Hills, Peters or Bos.

I was hoping that annealing would reduce the RC of the steel as far as possible to give the belts and drill bits an easier time.

With 9.75% vanadium, will it not make much as much difference what the RC hardness is, (with respect to drilling and grinding,) with 10V compared to a more "normal" steel?

Are there any steels that people bother annealing before grinding, or do you just take it as it comes?
 
I anneal most hot-rolled stock, it often has hard spots in it that eat blades, bits and belts.
The cpm steels usually come soft enough to be workable, it isn't the hardness that eats tools in this case, it's the carbides. Picture dried epoxy with sand in it, the epoxy itself is pretty easy to file away but the grains of sand will resist your file and dull it. This is how carbides affect cutting tools.
 
Justin and Danbo are right, you'll do more harm than good by trying to anneal high-alloy steels like that in an open fire. You're looking at name-brand, high-end steels, they will come to you from the mill/supplier about as easy to work with as they're ever going to get. The mill understands that folks will be cutting and grinding this stuff to make tools, knives etc and anneal it for you.

One thing you will probably notice that really eats belts is hard, dark grey mill scale on the surface. This can be dealt with by soaking the bar in vinegar or another mild acid overnight to loosen the scale and make it much easier to grind off, or avoided altogether by having your supplier surface-grind it off for you. Surface-ground or precision-ground steel is worth every extra penny, if you can get it.

Do as much work before HT as you can with those vanadium-bearing steels, including finish sanding upp to at least 400 grit. The pro HT shops you mentioned will keep them very clean for you. You do not want to be hand-sanding steels with a lot of vanadium after HT, the tough hard carbides will just mock your efforts.
 
Got it, thanks for the tips guys. If I end up with mill scale I'll vinegar it off but will consider precision ground steel. It seems Alpha don't offer that, but USAKM does on some steels.

I'll continue the research!
 
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