Do you judge a product on intrinsic qualities alone - Where do you draw the line?

[Moxy]

I see this pop up more and more now and I'm curious as to where the brunt of the community stands.

When you have a knife in your hands can you be purely unbiased and judge the item on its physical merits alone, and pay no heed to the reputation or image of the knife or maker?

Personally, I can't. At least not 100%. But it's close, maybe 97%.

Let me explain what I mean with some examples. I love my Strider SnG. It's a solid blade with no issues what so ever. Maybe there have been some lemons sold, or their QC isn't the best, but mine is flawless and I love it. I only judge them on my personal experience. I don't care if Mick is full of #$%&. I don't know the guy, I am indifferent to him, if I ever met him I'd shake his hand and tell him I love the knife and thats it. On the other hand, as much as I agree Ernie Emerson's philosophy, I think his products are overpriced for what you get. I owned one, and have handled many more. Although I liked the designs, the execution was poor in my opinion. I love his personal philosophy and his opinion towards the community, he doesn't jump on the bandwagon and stays true to his products, he listens to his customers, and his customer service is top notch (I hear). I would love to meet him. But all that doesn't influence my opinion of his knives. Then you have Chris Reeve. Needless to say, his products are damn near flawless. I'm sure many other feel the same way. But there has been some negative drama associated with him personally since Blade Show. I don't know Chris Reeve personally, I've never met him. From the media I've seen I'd say his got a good philosophy and is a brilliant knifemaker. I have no reason to dislike him, and I love his products. I can't see anything changing that.

There's a popular knife enthusiast on YouTube that said something along the lines of "40% of the reason I love Emerson Knives has nothing to do with his products". I just find that unfathomable. No offense to him personally. Another really popular YouTube knife reviewer witnessed (or may have been involved in) the confrontation with Chris Reeve recently at Blade Show, I wont say his name but he is a member here, and has since sold off all his CRK products and will never support CRK again with his business. I can understand not wanting to support someone if you have a personal reason to dislike them, but to go as far as selling off your whole collection of his knives you love?! I don't know about that. Maybe if it happened to me I'd feel differently, I can't say.

The short of it is, I only appreciate something for it's physical qualities. It's crazy, in my opinion, to forgive poor build quality because you like the maker, or to sell off a knife you love just because you dislike the maker.

I try to avoid any stupid drama. It's irrelevant and isn't healthy for the community.

However, I say 97% because I'll never support fakes or ripoffs. I dislike Microtech since they clearly ripped off ZT at one point, but I'm not going to sell off my Ultratech for that reason alone. But it drives me crazy to see clear ripoffs spilling out of China. Be careful on Ebay folks. Hypothetically, if I ever got my hands on a fake I would toss it reguardless of anything else.

But other than that, it's all intrinsic. If I personally like the knifemaker or the image the knife has, then that is just icing on the cake.
What do you think?

 

[Kwon Kwang]

Intrinsic qualities are the primary reason why I will buy and enjoy a knife. I also don't enjoy drama. However, if I find in my conscience that I don't want to support a certain maker like Strider for moral reasons, I won't buy their products. If I think a product has low quality standards or low-end materials at a high price point, I'll avoid it like the plague.

Though we probably disagree on Strider, I think we're pretty much on the same page regarding intrinsic qualities.

 

[Skimo]

I see relative value, several makers/companies simply don't meet my standards, Strider being a prime example.

 

[Sonnydaze]

I like Strider folders and CRK's. I have a lasting fondness for the nicer Spyderco knives. All three have a spotless Customer Service department. THAT, and ONLY THAT, makes the difference to me.
Knives, to me, integrate the artistic design abilities with mechanical know-how and good blade-steel.
I don't join clubs; I don't deal in personalities.

Sonnydaze

 

[mtangent]

I was ignorant of any CR controversy until reading your post.
If I had an unpleasant experience, & a favourite knife reminded me of it, I would get rid of the knife.
There is a huge number of good knives to replace it with.

 

[evilgreg]

I have no problem with people buying a product because of the brand recognition factor that they want to be part of, but I also don't see any reason to disparage folks for making buying decisions based on the behavior of the makers.

It's just as reasonable to me for someone to buy a Hinderer just so they can get the "ooh he's got a Hinderer" joy of showing it off on the internet as it is for someone to decide not to buy a CRK knife because Chris Reeve was spotted being nasty to CTS at a knife show, or to not buy Striders because Mick Strider has been repeatedly been shown to be a deceitful, dishonorable type of guy.

If we could only buy knives on intrinsic value basis, we'd all have one random cheap machete, one Mora and one Opinel--$40 total worth of knives that could do everything.

 

[Moxy]

I like Strider folders and CRK's. I have a lasting fondness for the nicer Spyderco knives. All three have a spotless Customer Service department. THAT, and ONLY THAT, makes the difference to me.
Knives, to me, integrate the artistic design abilities with mechanical know-how and good blade-steel.
I don't join clubs; I don't deal in personalities.

Sonnydaze

Could not have said it better myself.

 

[marcinek]

Does my opinion of a knife maker's character affect whether or not I buy an knife from him? Yes. Strongly.

That said, to me, everybody is to free to buy or not buy any knife they want for whatever reason. If those reasons don't happen to mesh with mine, they aren't, as you say, "crazy," "irrelevant," "unhealty," or "stupid drama." They are just reasons different than mine, and perfectly acceptable.

Of course, that's not to say those reasons aren't up to lively debate here...that's what we do.

 

[ToddM]

I try very hard to mostly judge my knives or prospective knives on their qualities alone, materials, fit and finish, ergonomics, blade steel/shape etc, clip orientation, blade retention, aesthetics, etc. I'd say I shoot for 90% of my choice from that alone. However that's never all of it there are other factors and there are exceptions. I'm more likely to buy a knife from a company that has a great reputation for customer service and support after the sale, better warranty (that they live up to!), is American made, has a good sheath, is available at a local store so I can handle/inspect it.

Quality control reputation plays into it as well, you see a lot of love/hate on Striders, lot of unhappy QC stories in the past, seems they have improved though. The first one I had the fit and finish was no where near worthy of the price tag, the second I bought from a buddy as a hard user has been great once I "adjusted" it for better ergonomics. As a result I'm not a big strider fan nor hater, I understand their marketing and their customer base but I don't feel they are worth MSRP to me.

My opinion of a companies/makers policies also come into play. For example while I fully applaud Hinderer giving first preference and a discount to Mil/Leo/EMS/etc. as it should be! I can't support Hinderer allowing authorized dealers to sell a mid-tech at 200%+ of his MSRP to the general public. Especially when he's changed his policies to keep those that can order direct from reselling for profit yet has no problem with his dealers doing the exact same thing to the rest of us. I can't remember another knife company or maker allowing that to happen in the past, even if demand would support it. It doesn't matter how good the knife is, or if it's worth the secondary market price, I won't buy it on principal. It bothers me that Benchmade won't resharpen serrated blades, and they frown from users disassembling knives.

Resale means little to me, usually I modify in some way most of my knives (reduce sharp G10 handle edges etc.) and I use them so they get sharpened/re-profiled down to around 40 degrees inclusive, so that impacts resale a lot anyway. However, if it's a knife I'm buying that I've never handled and am not sure if I'll really mesh with ergonomically it's a factor because if I decide buying it was a mistake I can recoup most of that purchase price.