Do you really think a bali is good for defence?

K

Kid Couteau

Joined
Nov 21, 2000
Messages
346
Hi All:

Now I am not trying to honk anyone off but I just want to throw out ideas.

For myself I dont think that a bali would make a really good defensive weapon.

( Please bear in mind that to me the best defensive knife is a bowie )

Cons of bali

There is no guard to speak of

you have to be skilled to use it

a fixed knife is faster to draw

before you could throw it, if you wanted to, you have to latch it

most have short blade reach

Now pros for bali

concealable

open with one hand

no need for sheath

could be used for a flail if blade broke

What do you think people

( maybe I should send my cons to government and maybe they would put the bali as a tool instead of a weapon )

Yeah right I am too old to think like that.

See you
Knifesmith



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I like throwing knives, they're quiet.
 
Hmmm...

sharp edge...

pointy tip...

Yeah, I think you could use that as a weapon if need be.

And that describes not a balisong, but my car keys.

A balisong has those same characteristics and, if necessary, could be pressed into service as a weapon.

The issue of guard is an interesting on. Some styles depend on a guard. Others find utility in not having one.



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Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com
 
actually, you can throw it unlatched. you just hold the bite handle in, flip the safe back while putting your arm back into throwing position, then thrust and release
 
I carry balisongs because they are the most dependable folder you can get. Therefore good utility knife. It could be used as a weapon if need be but as Chuck pointed out so can a lot of things. I don't carry it for defense and in fact I don't carry anything for defense alone (some long zip ties might be good though).

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Mykl
Balisong, the folding fixed blade.
 
The reason I carry my Bali is for defense. Though most see it as an offensive weapon it can be like any weapon, a defense. Thank goodness though I have never had to use it to cut anything but boxes, ropes and ect...

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Things may never get better, but they can always get worse.
 
Been watching Jet Li, have we Myk?

Any knife can we used effectively for defense, as long as you treat it by its own merits and not for the merits of another weapon.

Balis are light and fast. These are ideal qualities for a knife fight if you can take advantage of them. The short range just means you have to chose your attacks more carefully. They can also intimidate, which can have bearing in a fight. They imply skill, whereas a Bowie implies big-a$$ knife.

Generally, throwing your "only" weapon is frowned upon.

Also, balis DO have a gaurd, after a fashion. One of the advantages of a bali is its versatility. If you feel the situation calls for a gaurd, don't latch the handles. Open your bali, but hold the bite handle with your index finger so that it covers the other fingers. This gives you a crude finger gaurd. It makes stabbing a little more complicated, but actually frees up slicing moves. I've been told this is a prefered grip in the Phillipenes (although I'm not sure how much I trust the source).
 
Knifesmith,
The balisong is one of the best fighting/defense folders in existence! It is the strongest folder, with it's three pin, double handle system. It is one of the few folders that you can be absolutely sure is locked open or closed in a panic/defense opening siutation. You can use it as kubotan/yawara/pocket stick weapon for non-lethal self-defense and instantly escalate to cutting and stabbing with a flick of the wrist. It is extremely fast opening and if your interest is soley self-defense you can learn 2 or 3 simple openings, like the dagger drop, which don't take a lot of manipulation. I am basing the above opinions on 20 years in the FMA, constant knife ownership and training and 15 years of LEO experience and Defensive Tactics training.
Oh yeah, most fighting/defense folders that I know of come with a 3 inch or shorter blade, so I'm quite comfortable with the 4+ inch blade on most sturdy balisongs.
 
( please read as it is meant, friendly )

I was worried that this might happen.

First off everybody is entitled to use whatever they want and I am not saying that the bali is no good for defense.

I just feel that a fixed knife is better.

I love balis. They are fun to play with and make good utility knives.

However when it comes to, I guess I should have said fighting knives instead of defense,
I find the bowie better.

Here's why:

A bowie has longer reach and for my personal style having a guard is necessary.
The extra reach also gives you more leverage against a smaller knife when used correctly.

Second a bowie does not have to be opened therefore it is faster.

Yes I will agree that a lot of people seem to think that a bowie screams bad guy wannabe but I prefer to see the good points.

More on the guard.
Take a bowie with a good guard and thrust it into a big piece of pine when your hands are wet now do the same with a bali, your hands will probably slip onto the blade because there is no guard to protect you.

Lastly, for those who think that a bali is intimidating ( here I go again runnin at the mouth ) to a real knife fighter he/she will realize that when the bali is in motion its less dangerous and will move in with a good straight thrust, deflecting the flailing handles with the hilt and cut you right on the wrist causing you to drop your expensive knife into the dirt.

That said I am not trying to make enemies here.
Some will agree with me and many will not.

Let us please just be friends agreeing to disagree and keep on flipping.

Knifesmith

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I like throwing knives, they're quiet.
 
I carry two knives almost religiously. A Spyderco Centafante, and of course my Benchmade 42. If ever I had to draw a knife to save my life it would be the Spyderco. Would the 42 be better in a knife fight?, without question yes. The difference is I have caried the Spyderco much longer than the 42, and it is what I go for first. Another reason is the spyderco is so much more simple, a flick of the thumb and your ready to rock and roll. I can whip my bali out and open it to cut a piece of cheese flawlesly hundreds of times, but faced with another man who wants to kill me I can't say that I wouldn't panic flip the knife, lose grip, toss it up in the air and stab my own self. There would probably be too much going on between pissing my pants and shaking uncontrollably to flip a bali to defend myself. I don't carry either one of my knives for self defence in mind. I only use them a tools. And I hope my blood is the only blood they draw.
 
True, the Bowie is much bigger but this leads to a problem. How are you gonna stuff that blade somewhere on your body without looking like a psycho? I can throw a bali in every pocket (and often do) and no one will ever know it's there. Now I ask you, have you ever tried to carry a Bowie in the middle of summer in florida? I don't think you'd make it too far before the cops start to ask questions. And if you're talking home defense, I prefer my 9mm Smith. Now with the 9mm you have range, speed, and best of all most times you don't even have to fire it to prevent the crime.
 
well my standard carry line-up is as follows:
left pocket: kubotan/2" knife
right pocket: lighter/2" OTF knife
back left: BM42S (not at school)
back right: BM42 (not at school)

overkill? yeah, maybe. but I like to have a knife for every purpose. if I'm in a crowded environment and I need to cut open a box or pop the top of my watch off to clean the insides, I use the OTF. if I need to poke some holes, I use the kubotan with the knife part out. If I'm at home or no-one is around (or not many people), I'll use either of the BM42's (depending on the job).
Now if I was in a combat situation with one person who wasn't armed, I'd either go for the kubotan or use a closed bali. if they had a knife and were obviously going to strike (by either striking or saying they were going to), I'd pull out the 42. If there were more than one person or they had some skill, i'd either run or pull out the second 42. I like having lots of options and back-up; it overall just works better.

now if no-one were to notice that I was carrying a ginormous fixed-blade and I knew I was going to be in a combat situation, i'd go for a bowie. Unless you can intimidate any would-be attacker with some flashy bali moves, you'd be stuck with a smaller knife.

Just give me a good 28" sword
wink.gif
 
Ha ...

Someone says on Spyderco here .. let me share a good story on it .. not to diminish the bali as a good defense knife but to stress that:
  • a good defense knife is one you have [bold]with[/bold] you [bold]when[/bold] you need it. I work in normal office building, so having a 7" blade Bowie is out. I have one bali for daily use (people just don't mind seeing me working with it and even playing with it.. lucky me
    biggrin.gif
    ) and one hidden as surprise factor, as my enemy to be might have known that I have a knife but not TWO ! Back to the point (I borrowed it from Fred Perrin, who taught the French Special Forces!:cool
    smile.gif
    the knife must be with you when you need it.
  • Toughness. a bali is the toughest folder by design. Given the same material (pin, handle, liner, etc.) it will make the strongest folder, so that we can rely the defense on it. Why folder? Please kindly see my first comment.

I agree that we should not make this forum hot with emotion, but knife defense should be taken very seriously with cool consideration.
Let me share the Spyderco story here .. //www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum52/HTML/001187.html

I also follow the tactics somewhere else in this forum though I don't post as often.


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Chris
"To use or not to use your Balisong - that is the question"

Indonesian Balisonger
 
I can not see the Balisong as a Defensive weapon. But it is the Philippines contrabution to the martial arts.

If a defender were to use a Balisong, he would become the aggressor and the attacker would become a victom. The Balisong is a deadly weapon in the hands of someone who is trained, as are all long baynett style bladed knives.

For me, it's just not my belief or style to turn the attacker into a victom. I believe we should evaluate the force they intend to use on us, and do a sidestep, so as to get out of the way. You then have a choice to allow them to use their aggression against themselves. Or just let the inertia take a harmless course without you in the path.

In a way, you have to be a little prophetic, because you have to know where they are going and where they are going to end up at, and make sure your not in their path
smile.gif
Or divert there agression away from you. Thanks, JohnR7

No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; Isaiah 54:17

 
John,

I can't agree more on the philosophical side of defense ..

I think what was asked is that when it is required, does a bali make a good defense.

The requirement might include:
  • Running away isn't an option
  • life of loved ones is threatened
  • caught in the middle of chaos/riot as happened here in this country back in 1998

I prefer to hand over my wallet but again, depending on situation, I might end up sticking my bali into his / her hand. Furthermore, sometimes it is too late if we do the small 'preventive' action and perhaps it would better to go straight to business..

but .. it is a matter of personal choice..

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Chris
"To use or not to use your Balisong - that is the question"

Indonesian Balisonger
 
Is this a question "which one of the two?" or, are you trying to compare apples to oranges?

A balisong can be large, less conceilable. You can put a hilt on it if you want it and are ready to pay for it. Even if such a bali isn't in current market, it isn't the limitation of the balisong "style."

A large, bowie bladed balisong will suit you? You can keep the knife in open position if you have a sheath to fit.
Some cons still remail. Long handle is necessary for a balisong than a fixed handled bowie. It will pull the balance point toward butt end, maybe worse. Needless to say the extra weight. Less sturdy as expected with a folding knife. And, the hilt will be something less effective than that of a fixed bowie. I forgot to say it requires larger pocket on your pants with tighter belt.
Pros, you have better chance to draw the knife unconceived than a fixed bowie unless you choose open position sheath.


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\(^o^)/ Mizutani Satoshi \(^o^)/
 
First, I want to apologize if my earlier post seemed offensive, Knifesmith. It wasn't intended thus. Just trying to answer your question of how effective a bali could be for defense, not disparage you for preferring a Bowie. Personally, it seems to me an honest question and one that doesn't require a comparative answer, a practicallity concern, or a moral validation. Had the question been SHOULD a bali be used thus instead of CAN...well.

So, for the record:

Is a bali an effective weapon? Yes. In the right hands. I could be wrong, but it seems to me that's what it was originally designed for. It also happens to be fantastically effective for non-violent uses.

Would I personally want to use it in a fight? Maybe.

Might I prefer something else if the need really came up for a weapon and practical carry wasn't an issue. Likely. Smith gets his Bowie, Darth can have his sword (katana?), and I'll take 0a Katar or a Rapier--barring cost, of course. (I'll assume my longbow is out of the question.)
smile.gif


Is it ultimately better to avoid violent confrontation altogether? I'll go out on the proverbial limb and say "Yu-huh" with the understanding that there are almost always exceptions to the rule.

Think that covers everything for me
wink.gif


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Life often sucks, but always remember: God is good, and arrows are reusable.
A country boy can survive. :)
 

Hey Darth, you carry 4 knives on a daily basis? No offense meant of course, but what purpose does that serve? Do you live in an area prone to crime?
 
Bakedpotato82, I don't know about Darth's reasons, but I carry 4 or more on occasion. I live in a relatively safe area, it is just a factor of utility. I always have my Spyderco Viele and G-10 Harpy on me as well as a Micra and really small SAK(neither of which I count as a knife), that is my everyday carry to school, usually don't get attacked between buildings in my car or at the mall for lunch, but hey, you never know. Sometimes I add a balisong or 2 horizontally across the back or in a neck sheath, and sometimes I substitute my Military or AFCK for the Viele, just depends on where I am and what I feel like that day.

Some people just like their knives and carry what feels good, sometimes it's just a matter of not being able to figure out what you want to carry that day. I used to know a guy in Indiana that carried 5-7 every day, I just considered him as normal as anyone.
 
I think a Bali is a good blade for defense, but I do carry other folders. The other folders that I carry are: Rekat Sifu (main fighting blade), Spyderco Harpy (for cutting seatbelts in an accident), a CRKT KFF, and a Benchmade 940 (for general cuuting chores). Oh yeah, some good pepper spray for first line use, then the blade.
 
>>I think what was asked is that when it is required, does a bali make a good defense.

What would make the best defense, would be a spear headed type blade. The problem with this is that your not going to get your knife back. Then stick it into a large muscle mass area, like the thigh & leave it there. Every movement the person makes will be extreamly painfull.

If you use a bayonett style blade and hit an organ with it. There is no where near as much of a chance that it will stop the person. Usually it just makes them more angry. Also, it's a LOT more difficult to defend yourself when it goes to court, if you hit a organ, because it's a lot more difficult for the doctor to fix it at the hospital.

If you stab them with a bayonett blade four or five times in a organ, there is a good chance they will not live. Then you could find you are having to defend yourself on murder or some similar charge. Which requires quite a bit of money to do. In some cases as much as a million dollars, at least that is what OJ Simpson had to pay
smile.gif
Then he lost all the rest of his money in the civil court case.

So, if they don't put you in jail, there is a pretty good chance they will get all your money and worldly possessions. Thanks, JohnR7 www.BalisongKnife.com
 
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