Elk scale question

[kossetx]

I can't post a pic right now but I just got a B&C LE elk scaled Teddy R special Ergo Hunter. Fabulous knife. My question is are all elk scales natural on the surface or are they sometimes jigged to look natural. The elk is so uniform in texture and color over the entire length it makes me wonder if it's jigged. The Ergo Hunter has a pretty good sized handle to have such uniform elk scales.

Not complaining, just curious. I'm happy to own it.

Pete

 

[MT_Pokt]

Ive not known Buck to jig bone or antler to look like elk. Elk grow some big ol’ trees, so it’s not too much of a stretch for it to be natural.

On the other hand; I know there are folks out there who steam press curved antler to flatten them.

If the pith is curved, it’s more than likely natural. If the pith is even thickness, it’s more likely to be artificially flattened. Not that there is anything wrong with it. Some will be stabilized like wood so they stay flat.

 

[DeSotoSky]

Is the term 'jigged' being used correctly. To me jigging is the process of machining an attractive pattern into an otherwise relatively smooth bone surface. It could be applied to any material but I normally think of bone. I think Elk antler is naturally smoother in surface finish than say Sambar antler.

 

[kossetx]

Just curious, have a better term?

 

[jb4570]

Is the term 'jigged' being used correctly. To me jigging is the process of machining an attractive pattern into an otherwise relatively smooth bone surface. It could be applied to any material but I normally think of bone. I think Elk antler is naturally smoother in surface finish than say Sambar antler.

Well Elk like all natural material varies a lot. I have some Elk scales that are as nice as any Sambar stag. But, Elk is rarely that way. It is more often like what Roger described, smoother and lighter in color.
Koss, here is a photo of the B&C Elk Ergo I got when they were first offered.



Koss, let me know if you would like me to add a few photos of Elk scale variation.
JB

 

[Christiantrevor]

I was told that elk scales were often dyed to darken and even the coloring.

 

[Tin Sue]

The fact that it is "so uniform in texture and color over the entire length", as you state, would actually be the opposite of what you would expect to see from being "jigged" which would result in a textured or uneven surface. When you state smooth and uniform, perhaps you are referring to the handles being sanded down and/or polished which would result in a smooth and uniform surface.

 

[kossetx]

The fact that it is "so uniform in texture and color over the entire length", as you state, would actually be the opposite of what you would expect to see from being "jigged" which would result in a textured or uneven surface. When you state smooth and uniform, perhaps you are referring to the handles being sanded down and/or polished which would result in a smooth and uniform surface.

I disagree. Many jigged knives are very uniform. Especially Buck jigged knives. However I do have a remer stone jigged 110 that does somewhat imitate antler with the exception of color.

Guys, what I'm asking here does anyone know if elk antler can be modified to look like antler bark. I'm not saying buck did it. I'm saying my scales are so nice it made me wonder if it was being done.

 

[PStone]

...The elk is so uniform in texture and color over the entire length it makes me wonder if it's jigged. The Ergo Hunter has a pretty good sized handle to have such uniform elk scales...

Pete

It sounds to me like you got an amazing set of natural elk handle scales!!! Enjoy them!

 

[jb4570]

Koss, it is possible to modify any material to the way you want it. I do not know if Buck has done that or paid a supplier to do that in the past. I think it would add way to much cost to make every handle look different and I don't see any of Bucks stag handles look like they were made on a cookie cutter type machine.

Here are several different Buck knives most in Elk.
the top 2 and the bottom 1 are Sambar, #2 & #3 are Elk and look better than the Sambar IMHO.


Bottom Duke is Ivory JB

 

[300Bucks]

The American Elk , as stated, can vary from white bone to narly bark. Buck has used artificial scales called animal names on some 300s. The series with impala horn are actually dyed cow bone ground to look African. Some Camillus contract California Toothpick folders have totally artificial antler. Most import folders with appearance of antler are artificial. If it sells it works.

Habbie's continent calls moose - elk. So when talking to European knife folks say 'American Elk'. 300

 

[kossetx]

Bunch of nice knives there JB.

 

[sportingspecialist]

Here are some pictures of an Elk rack.

From what I've seen, it appears that Buck may clean or slightly modify Elk antlers in order to use them for scales.

 

[JD Bear]

That's impressive. Very nice example...

 

[Tin Sue]

I have a large Case brand lockback with "second-cut stag" which is obviously a second inner cut that is made after the outer rough gnarly bark portion is removed during the first cut. It is very flat, but certainly not smooth to the touch, and it does appear to be lightly textured (I guess this would be termed jigging). It certainly would not be mistaken for what we typically think of as stag, but it is not all that unattractive. I'll try to dig it out and post a photo when I have time. While I don't think Buck would intentionally use such handles on their products without notification as to what it actually is, who knows what a supplier might add to a shipment.

 

[300Bucks]

Tin's description is right on. To answer Koss, yes all it takes is a brown Sharpie. They actually can get sun bleached in a short time and weathered antler will be colored and epoxied to give better presentation. Tricks of the trade.

Elk and good jigged bone are my two favorite scale materials. These would be more the normal for elk scales on todays Buck folders. A complaint I give is that many examples have 'mismatched' bark and color from side to side on folder scales. A bunch of Bucks I have seen will have much more natural 'barking' on one side. Sometimes even deep grooves uncomfortable to the hand. I don't know the process of selection, whether much effort or time is expended trying to match sides. I do think in elk scales the sanding belt blends the surface. I do not oil mine but use clear wax. (Begins with R-------)

Effects of oil

Here's a photo I have shown before of a "stag" supplier. I bet if you could dig around there would be elk antlers. Most elk scales are bought as cut pieces that a knife maker can select the face they want to use. Most elk are bought in US and Canada and are sheds that are picked up by folks hunting for them in spring to earn some extra income. Some people have trained dogs to go with them and search and even retrieve antlers to them. Large elk racks can be just marked by barking. At the National Elk Refuge at Jackson Hole, WY, local Boy Scouts collect the racks and a big auction is conducted for their benefit. Lots of antlers are ground up for Asian medicines. I guess the biggest sheds give the most "up lifting" effect. Antlers in velvet are the most sought for this purpose.

American elk have their own look, most opinions say the most desirable knife scales come from Red Deer and can be very dark in color. Check out old Sheffield folders. There are deer farms all over the world that sell meat, hide and antlers. American Whitetails, Mule deer and moose antlers are less desired as small knife scales as they have more soft pith in the center. Red Deer antlers have very little. And as Tin describes can be used by cutting 'slabs' along the antler piece length. Below is a photo of a past factory storage area. 300

 

[Boggs]

Just curious, have a better term?

I think a better term might be “carved”.....

When a supplier sells handle material to imitate stag often the term “carved stag bone” is used though the material used is cow bow carved to provide the appearance of the ridges associated with stag...

 

[kossetx]

Tin's description is right on. To answer Koss, yes all it takes is a brown Sharpie. They actually can get sun bleached in a short time and weathered antler will be colored and epoxied to give better presentation. Tricks of the trade.

Elk and good jigged bone are my two favorite scale materials. These would be more the normal for elk scales on todays Buck folders. A complaint I give is that many examples have 'mismatched' bark and color from side to side on folder scales. A bunch of Bucks I have seen will have much more natural 'barking' on one side. Sometimes even deep grooves uncomfortable to the hand. I don't know the process of selection, whether much effort or time is expended trying to match sides.

I almost quit buying le's for that reason. My last le 112 cured that'd or now. The elk on it is perfect.

Effects of oil

[/QUOTE

I have a condition called " liver excess". Nothing 3-4 showers a day doesn't cure. My most used elk stag knife looks like that due to the oil in my skin.