- Joined
- Apr 5, 1999
- Messages
- 460
Dear Members,
I was just asked to talk a little about the subject; Real or Fake Emersons, and how to tell the difference.
First let me say this; I could go on for several pages about all the details but I'll try to be brief.
Here is our current dilemma. In the past the easiest way to tell a fake Emerson was by the price. A $250.00 knife selling for $9.95 was obviously a fake no matter what, and the quality of the knife reflected its' price/worth.
There were many obvious differences, different screw types, torx, metric screws (a dead giveaway), plastic handles, plastic backspacers, different G-10 textures, ribs versus knurling on the thumb button, washed out grind lines, very pronounced and full length swedges, look alike logo but detailed differently, in the wrong location and almost always dated year 2000, different thumb grooves on thumb ramp, etc. etc. etc.
However, as the Chinese became better at cloning, their copies got better (only a little). They graduated up to even producing copies of our box, our warranty and even my picture. The lines between fake and copy were nudging even closer. However, the price was always the giveaway.
But leave it to some to seize their moment and this I cannot blame the Chinese for. There were American knife sellers that saw a chance to make some real money. They started raising the prices for Emerson counterfeits till they reached a level in parity with the lowest discounted prices for the knives that could be found on the internet. Since price was always the dead giveaway, making them the same price as a real Emerson made that go away. The unsuspecting buyer now would think, "Hell it's a good price but it's $169.00, so it must be the real deal."
So now we, just as Leupold, the scope manufacturers (my friends), started getting counterfeit products in for warranty repair. The sad thing is that the owners of these knives are always sure that they are real, since they paid up to $180.00 for some of them. I have to make the call to tell them the truth because they will never take my staff's word that their knives are not genuine. (They still use metric parts and plastic.) Recently, we had a gentleman return 4 knives that he had purchased, prefacing his conversation with me by saying, "Emerson Knives are shit. I want a full refund from you." Turns out, the guy he had brought them from was an internet dealer in New York that had just mysteriously vaporized. He called me every name in the book and claimed that a true businessman would stand behind his product and not resort to a cheesy lie, just to get out of warranty or refund service. "I'll never buy another Emerson Knife", were his last words.
Fortunately, most of these unlucky customers are eventually convinced about their knives being a counterfeit. Sometimes after we have to supply them with photos and parts comparisons just to prove it to them. We even had one guy claim that the knife we had, wasn't the knife he had sent in, even though he had emailed me a picture of it before he sent it to us. Same logo, same scratches on the blade, same screws, same broken tip - same knife. "You can photoshop anything," were his words.
Believe me, I can truly empathize with someone who has shelled out substantial money only to find out he's been hoodwinked.
Now mind you, I can spot a fake just by looking at it on the table, however I can't expect the general public to be as aware of all the differences to the degree I might be.
But, the only things I can offer as a remedy are education and advice to buy from a reputable dealer. Get references - not from the dealer. With so much networking available and these forums, there are plenty of people that know the knives and plenty of people that know the dealers. A few clicks and people are happy to help with both info and recommendations.
Finally though, if a deal is too good to be true, well, it's not true.
Go to our website and on the top tool bar you'll see our counterfeit warning.
Click there for a little more info.
Hope this answers some of your concerns.
My Best Regards,
Ernest R. Emerson
I was just asked to talk a little about the subject; Real or Fake Emersons, and how to tell the difference.
First let me say this; I could go on for several pages about all the details but I'll try to be brief.
Here is our current dilemma. In the past the easiest way to tell a fake Emerson was by the price. A $250.00 knife selling for $9.95 was obviously a fake no matter what, and the quality of the knife reflected its' price/worth.
There were many obvious differences, different screw types, torx, metric screws (a dead giveaway), plastic handles, plastic backspacers, different G-10 textures, ribs versus knurling on the thumb button, washed out grind lines, very pronounced and full length swedges, look alike logo but detailed differently, in the wrong location and almost always dated year 2000, different thumb grooves on thumb ramp, etc. etc. etc.
However, as the Chinese became better at cloning, their copies got better (only a little). They graduated up to even producing copies of our box, our warranty and even my picture. The lines between fake and copy were nudging even closer. However, the price was always the giveaway.
But leave it to some to seize their moment and this I cannot blame the Chinese for. There were American knife sellers that saw a chance to make some real money. They started raising the prices for Emerson counterfeits till they reached a level in parity with the lowest discounted prices for the knives that could be found on the internet. Since price was always the dead giveaway, making them the same price as a real Emerson made that go away. The unsuspecting buyer now would think, "Hell it's a good price but it's $169.00, so it must be the real deal."
So now we, just as Leupold, the scope manufacturers (my friends), started getting counterfeit products in for warranty repair. The sad thing is that the owners of these knives are always sure that they are real, since they paid up to $180.00 for some of them. I have to make the call to tell them the truth because they will never take my staff's word that their knives are not genuine. (They still use metric parts and plastic.) Recently, we had a gentleman return 4 knives that he had purchased, prefacing his conversation with me by saying, "Emerson Knives are shit. I want a full refund from you." Turns out, the guy he had brought them from was an internet dealer in New York that had just mysteriously vaporized. He called me every name in the book and claimed that a true businessman would stand behind his product and not resort to a cheesy lie, just to get out of warranty or refund service. "I'll never buy another Emerson Knife", were his last words.
Fortunately, most of these unlucky customers are eventually convinced about their knives being a counterfeit. Sometimes after we have to supply them with photos and parts comparisons just to prove it to them. We even had one guy claim that the knife we had, wasn't the knife he had sent in, even though he had emailed me a picture of it before he sent it to us. Same logo, same scratches on the blade, same screws, same broken tip - same knife. "You can photoshop anything," were his words.
Believe me, I can truly empathize with someone who has shelled out substantial money only to find out he's been hoodwinked.
Now mind you, I can spot a fake just by looking at it on the table, however I can't expect the general public to be as aware of all the differences to the degree I might be.
But, the only things I can offer as a remedy are education and advice to buy from a reputable dealer. Get references - not from the dealer. With so much networking available and these forums, there are plenty of people that know the knives and plenty of people that know the dealers. A few clicks and people are happy to help with both info and recommendations.
Finally though, if a deal is too good to be true, well, it's not true.
Go to our website and on the top tool bar you'll see our counterfeit warning.
Click there for a little more info.
Hope this answers some of your concerns.
My Best Regards,
Ernest R. Emerson
