Endura eats kevlar!

Just out of curiosity I took one of the older pulletproof vests (NIJ 2A) at work and did a little penetration test with my endura.
To my surprise the knife went straight through with very little effort.
I know most vests doesn´t protect very well against bladed instruments but this was quite a surprise. Or is it that the Endura is a superior knife
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There was a therad about this in the R&T forum with tests done with mainly custom or custom production knives.
And the Endura seems to be just as good...
 
Belstain

Belstain

Joined
Sep 17, 1999
Messages
320
try slicing accross it sideways and see how well your endura performs when it is actually cutting the kevlar instead of slipping between the strands

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I'm a Schizophrenic and so am I
 
It was my understanding that regular Kevlar vests offer little protection against stab wounds. Some of the police I know now have "stab resistant" vests, but it seems to me that there are hard plates inside that actually provide the stab protection.
 
Bullets move very fast, but they are blunter than knives, and Kevlar is very tear resistant. But it's a polymer fiber which, in an orderly universe, will be cut by a sharp knife, since steel is harder than polymer.

It's probably not a good idea to speak too loudly of the capacity of sharp steel to cut Kevlar, lest somebody accuse us of selling Evil Cop-Kiler Knives, or at least nefarious tire-slashers.
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- JKM
www.chaicutlery.com
AKTI Member # SA00001



[This message has been edited by James Mattis (edited 08-29-2000).]
 
Belstain; the knife cut though the kevlar. It didn´t slip between the fibers. I took a close look and you could actually see that the fibers had been cut straight off without any sign of tear. My own vest that I use currently is made out of Dyneema and is supposedly a lot more stab resistant. I saw a demo at the manufacturer and none of those who tried managed to get more than just a 1/10" of the tip through, even with a brand new frost puukko. The vest I penetrated is probably around 10 years old so I guess there have been some improvements in the years passed.
 
A Frosts (Mora, Sweden) puukko ...

Is the Finnish word, "puukko" coming into Swedish usage, as it is in English, for woodcrafty knives in the Norwegian, Swedish, or Finnish tradition?


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- JKM
www.chaicutlery.com
AKTI Member # SA00001
 
Not really. We just call them "Mora-kniv". Puukko (pucko) translates into "idiot" or mildly retarded (mentally) in Swedish (no kidding).
Finnish language has nothing to do with Swedish even though we are close neighbours.
A Swedish person understands nothing a Finn says and vice versa. But I think you know that already.
Mora-kniv pretty much covers any working knife made by frost, and those with red handle in particular(!).
 
... which is why I was surprised to see a Swede call a Mora-kniv a Frosts puukko.
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Swedish is in the Indo-European family and shares a bunch of vocabulary with English - like "kniv/knife" for instance - and there's more in common between Swedish, English, Spanish, Greek, and Hindi than there is between any of them and Finnish.

But English is unregulated, so "puukko" is working its way in as a word for any woodcrafty knife in the European North Country tradition.


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- JKM
www.chaicutlery.com
AKTI Member # SA00001
 
I just did a comparison of a number of vests in levels IIA, II and IIIA (U.S. N.I.J. ratings.) What I found was that NONE are really cut-proof with the exception of stab-resistant armor designed for prison use. The stab-resistant vests are not for concealed wear and are quite heavy. I also found that certain vests which will pass the 'ice-pick test' are penetrated quite easily with a sharpened blade. I don't know about anyone else out there but I've never seen an ice-pick on the street. Plenty of knives though.

Almost any good quality body armor will offer SOME protection against stabbing and slashing.

The only armor I've seen that offers dependable protection against stabbing/slashing is armor with what amounts to titanium chain-mail built in.

The best protection against an edged weapon is distance. The '21 foot rule' is my 'vest.' Of course it's not a perfect world so I spend plenty of time practicing with my OC, ASP and firearm.

Ben

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"If you're upside down and burning, you probably went too fast."


[This message has been edited by Fozzy (edited 08-30-2000).]
 
I just tried my military issued flak jacket and my knife went through it like butter. But it's not too surprising... I've always thought those things were useless, and CERTAINLY not worth their weight to carry.

Don't forget that FLAK kevlar jacket are intented to stop small overhead and grenade flak, not a bullet. A military body armor suit will not stop a bullet from any distance! Nor will our kevlar helmet stop a rifle round, unless it somehow deflects it at an angle.

You gotta wonder what it's all good for? Rocks and branches as far as I'm concerned.
 
Unless you know the origins of a 10 year old vest, it is best not to depend on it for the protection level it affords as stated by the manufacturer(s). Daily wear with perspiration, UV rays, humidity, etc. could affect its structural integrity. Maintenance, rough handling and (im)proper storage factor in as well. While many vests will not provide much or any at all protection against knife attack, one that is beat up and well worn is no much better.

L8r,
Nakano
 
That reminds me of a darwin award, a Russian soldier/police oficer/security guard (can't remember which) took his knife out, gave it to his partner, and told him to stab him in the chest to see if his vest would protect him. It didn't. He died.
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Someone else hade to have read that.

[This message has been edited by scouter27 (edited 09-11-2000).]
 
I have read that story i Think it was in GUNS magazine. I also know a steak knife will go through body armour. I was o the receiving end of that once.... No it wasn't a test somebody did not like the idea of their husband going to jail

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All it takes for the forces of evil to rule the world is for good men to do nothing...Edmund Burke
 
Hey ltUSMC!

The vests/flak jackets we use in Swedish armed forces consists of strands of kevlar, they are supposed to entangle shrapnel.
Shrapnel is usually inconsistent in shape and has quite sharp edges all around and of course tumble thus they will entangle them self in the kevlar strands.

Don't know if they are of the same construction, mostly food for thought.
My opinion is that flak jackets/vests/helmets are for shrapnel protection and NOT bullets! (hence the name perhaps??
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Be well!/Jonas aka 2Sharp

"May all your detonations be expected"

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Originally posted by 2Sharp:
My opinion is that flak jackets/vests/helmets are for shrapnel protection and NOT bullets! (hence the name perhaps??
Click to expand...
Right: For bullets you use the inserts which definitely are knife proof.

The "original" flak jackets were very heavy steel plate things and would also have been mostly knife proof...

Photos and info on Swedish body armour: http://www.wendel.se/rswa/persutr.htm


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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/
Latest update: Calypso Jr Lightweight

"I've always been fascinated by Scandinavian knives [...] they're simple, in an advanced way".
- Bob Loveless
 
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