?Eureka? Stockmen

black mamba

black mamba

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You all have seen my little 3-3/8" old yella synthetic Rough Rider stockman, already. I've been carrying it off and on for some time now. I call it a Eureka (or Reverse Eureka), as it looks like one to me, but Rough Rider just says, "Stockman." Experts, correct me if I'm wrong, please!

RR_DoglegStockman.jpg


It really is hard to express how much I enjoy this little, inexpensive knife. The quality and usefulness are way beyond it's price. So I decided to do some research and see if they were available in some other handle materials. YEAH BABY !!

EurekaStockmen.jpg


From top to bottom, they are stag bone (#RR407), red bone (#RR406), yellow synthetic (#RR890), and brown bone (#RR372).

Out of the 12 blades, only two have any kind of rub, and they are both very slight. You can barely see light between one spring and liner, and there are absolutely no gaps between bone scales and bolsters. And these are small, 3-blade and 2-backspring knives. Only one blade out of the twelve would not roll hair off my forearm, but the bevels were still good, and a half dozen swipes on each side got it shaving, too. This is just a wonderful pattern to carry, and I highly recommend any of the four.
 
A very nice collection. Although I tend to favor a Barlow or Whittler for daily carry I'll keep my eye out for a decent Stockman and maybe give it a try.
 
You converted and convinced me Jeff. :D

It's a delightful pattern and something different, near enough sunk joints are appeallng too . I though it was a kind of 'Norfolk Stockman'

I've got the Redbone (very nice colour too) and the Old Yellow, didn't know there were others.

Regards, Will
 
Yes Will, darn near sunk joints. Only the little spey spine sticks up about a half a millimeter above the bolster.

The color of my redbone example is sort of "plummy" indoors, but in direct sunlight it looks a lot like old Case redbone, but not quite as "brickish."
Do you have a good pic of yours?
 
Hello Jeff, would like to help but don't even own a camera....(yes such types exist :eek: )

I'd agree it has a plum kind of shade and it is nicely jigged with what I think is a good RR shield, Propeller style. Better than the coin ones anyway. It's certainly a Red that is more pleasant than some of the current CASE renderings, not their oldies though!
 
Hi guys!

The sockman pattern is my absolute favorite. I like the three blades on that patterns. Jeff, thank you for posting your RR Stockmen here. I think a RR stockman would make a nice addition to the collection. I really love my Case Delrin CV (Yellow) stockman. Great knife! I think the RR stockman would make a good stainless addition.

Thanks for sharing!

Kind regards
Andi
 
Regarding what might be the correct name for this pattern, LG4 pg. 287, shows some "Fancy Cattle knives" with this frame shape, both 2 spring and 3 spring, however in these the larger end has one blade and the smaller end 2 blades, the opposite of this Rough Rider. Mr. Levine refers to these as "Eureka Cattle Knife".
So i think you have a Eureka Cattle Knife. Stock knives have never used a frame of this shape.
Not only are the Rough Rider knives well made, you really have to hand it to the owners of this brand for reviving (and sometimes 'tweaking') so many of the great vintage patterns that the long established knife manufacturers haven't made for 75 or more years. It's a real delight for us who love Traditional style folders.
Thank You Rough Rider brand owners. You have done a Fantastic job !
roland
 
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Roland, thanks for the info. I have seen Eureka Jacks, all with both blades at the small end, so I have been calling this a Reverse Eureka Stockman, just like there are Reverse Gunstock Stockmen.
 
Hey Jeff, here's a different take on the Eureka pattern. Ken calls it a Eureka Cattle Knife and it has the master blade at the large end.

This post from Kerry and this one from Jake in the Old Knives thread each show a Eureka Cattle Knife with the master blade at the large end. The RR version looks like a cross between this and the Stockman pattern.
 
Thanks, Danny. Those examples all have a "whittler" blade arrangement, but this RR pattern is the only one I've seen with "stockman" arrangement of clip and sheepfoot pivoting from the big end.
 
It's the only one I've seen with that blade configuration as well. The links were just to show that there were others with the main blade at the larger end, so it might not be considered a 'reverse' pattern. I think that Eureka Stockman is certainly an accurate description of the knife, but whether or not it falls under another pattern name is better left to those who are more knowledgeable on the subject than myself.

BTW I like the red bone the best out of the bunch.
 
Quote Dan: "I think that Eureka Stockman"
No. The frame is NOT a Stockman by any definition of "Stockman". In this case it is the frame pattern that decides what it is to be called, not blade arrangement.
Get a copy of "Levine's Guide to Knives" 4th ed. for the best descriptions of how patterns are named and how they evolved.
roland
 
Roland, after rereading my last post, I see that it was poorly worded. I did not mean to imply that it was the proper name for the pattern. Following some further reading, I think I see why you say the frame determines what it is called in this case and agree with your previous post about it being a variation of Eureka Cattle Knife.

I would like to get a copy of LG-IV. It's a shame that the publisher screwed up the more recent editions, making the 4th harder to find and driving up the cost.
 
Dan, i was lucky and picked up a copy of LG4 about 5 years ago for quite a low price. I've used this book more than any book i have ever owned. The page corners are curled up and my daughter has colored (scribbled really) on most of the pages and even though i have read all of it many times i continually find more info in it.
Levine says a Stockman is a "serpentine-shaped double-end pocketknife that ordinarily has 2 springs and 3 blades". he goes on to say they can have up to 6 blades and 3 springs, but the standard serpentine shape is the only one that can be called a "Stockman". The 2 basic types are square end and round end.
I was wrong about the signifigance of the blades in that the Master blade is "always some type of clip-point".
Cattle knives are an older pattern and with these there are quite a few different shapes to the frame.
Hence the OP knife comes under the "Cattle" variety rather than "Stock".
I do believe there are still deals to be had for LG4 but it requires almost daily searches because they don't last long.
roland
 
I like your collection of these Eureka's, which I would call them, and nothing else. I live in the Levine's 4th as well.

This is from my Internet picture collection, but an interesting take on the Eureka pattern. It has the classic Eureka handle shape, which is clearly the defining feature on this nostalgic old pattern. It sports a spear, spey, and punch. It is a Henry Sears "1865" and was sold recently on Ebay. The seller labeled it as a Eureka Cattle knife, which leads me to believe the catalog did as well. It clearly is used more as a stockman or cattle knife, but not as a whittler. The Ebay description is shown under these illustrations. Interesting bolsters... and I would have guess it had split spring construction, with the tapered middle liner. Appears the spey was the blade of choice, OUCH!

sears_eureka.jpg


sears_eurekacat.jpg


[TABLE="width: 1179, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]Vintage Henry Sears & Son 1865 Eureka Cattle Knife. Shown next to catalog reprint (not included) for historical reference.

Henry Sears & Son 1865, c1878-1959
3 5/8", 3 back spring, half stops on all 3 blades
For reference, see p287 of Levine's Guide 4th edition and p170 of The Old Knife Book (books not included)

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
 
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I based the description on p287 of Levine's Guide 4th Edition. Levine calls it "Eureka" in the "Cattle Knives (Fancy and Three-Spring)" section of the book. It's a three spring, not a split spring. The ad reprint from p170 of The Old Knife Book specifies "Each blade on separate spring". I posted some photos in the Old Knives Thread and there were some fun comments about it.
 
Here's a link to post in the Old Knives thread. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/527126-quot-Old-Knives-quot/page150 By the way, I bought one of those RR890 knives after I saw Jeff's knife in the What you're totin' thread. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...quot-are-ya-totin-today?p=9822408#post9822408

Jeff, Thank you for introducing me to the pattern. I have the yeller RR890. I had one in pearl also but I think I sold it... don't remember the model number. I like the color of the red RR406.
 
I'm away from my knives for some time yet but i have a pearl RR lockback that has about The Best Pearl i have ever seen.
And, i collect vintage pearl folders and once owned a $3000 Don Hanson Pearl Auto knife.
These Rough Riders are so "ridiculous" (for lack of a better word). How do they do it ? ( "it" = make really good knives often with really good natural handle material and sell them for about $10)
roland
Actually, that Pearl LB might be somewhere in this thread already.
 
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