Ever try to actually sharpen an M-9 Bayonet?

A

AnthonyD.Hamilton

Joined
Aug 17, 2000
Messages
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I've got this LanCay M-9 Bayonet that I bought a few months ago for my Mossberg 590. The thing is ugly as hell and has about the worst asymetry I've ever seen on a blade. Have any of you ever tried to put a decent edge on one of these things? I'm afraid that if I actually start to grind on the beast I'll have to remove a tremendous amount of steel, especially at the point. I think I've seen sharper points on McPukes plastic sporks! Any suggestions?

Anthony

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"Paranoia is simply a state of heightened awareness"

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Do you really think that thing was ever intended to be sharp? I mean that is a pretty radical idea!


Mike
 
I sharpened mine with my spyderco V angle set. The diamond grit sleeves did most of the work. Came out pretty darn good, considering it's a bayonet as a primary use.


Scott

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RW
 
Yeah, yeah... I know that some people try to say that bayonets are supposed to be dull so they make a jagged wound channel, blah, blah, blah...I understand that it's a "multi-tool" because of the supposed wire cutter, yadda, yadda... I'm just wondering if it can actually be made into a cutting tool, not just a poker and chopper. These things are issued because of their claimed versatility. The way I see it, right now it is strictly a stabbing instrument (a heavy one I might add). I figure if I can put an edge on the thing it might do more than just sit beside my shotgun. For those that have sharpened an M-9, does the edge hold for very long or is the steel so soft that it's not even worth the effort?

Thanks,
Anthony
 
I sharpened one. I won't say it was very sharp, but it had a more keen edge on it then when I started. It was a pain to sharpen. If it was mine I would have ground it down to a thinner blade edge, and then sharpened it. Good luck!!


Blades
 
I sharpened my friend's once. After much aggrivation I went with a course then medium diamond before it was close to the sharp that it needs to be. As for the "how sharp" controversy, in the utility knife role it needs to be as sharp as a K-bar of something related that a soldier would carry with him/her. Dull doesn't help much.

Doug
 
This is a classic case of a tool designed to do two tasks that doesn't do either one of them as well as a dedicated one.

I have a copy of the documentation originated by the Army that stated the need for an improved bayonet back in the early "80's (I used to be in Army R&D). It states the several purposes (not porpoises!) the new bayonet was to address over the then current M7 bayonet. They are, in order, and the order is important!

1. Bayonet
2. Combat Knife (read as "fighting knife")
3. Field Craft Knife (read as "tool")
4. Wire Cutter
5. Limited saw capability
6. Mine Probe
7. Civil disturbance deterrent (read as "where would you like this cold piece of steel inserted, sir?)

Part of the charm of any bayonet is identified in the "Rationale Annex" to the original document where the following quote is found, "The sight of a fixed bayonet instills fear in the enemy or mob and stiffens the resolve of the combat soldier."

I think Phrobis/Buck/LanCay have done a good job for the direction they were given, but a bayonet and a field/combat knife have drastically different functions, therefore different requirements for materials and shapes. The M9 is a fair bayonet and an adequate field knife, but a terrible fighting knife. It's weight (with sheath) would allow one to carry the old M7 (a pretty good bayonet) and a separate field knife of your choice.

A bayonet should not be razor sharp since it is used as a hacking, thrusting tool that may need a more tough, durable edge to prevent chipping, etc. A field knife may need a very sharp edge for obvious reasons. These are not compatible so the bayonet wins out and the field knife looses.

Bruce Woodbury
 
I haven't sharpened the M9, but I've sharpened many other bayonets. In order to get a refined edge you need to use a grinding wheel or a belt sander. You can hollow grind the blade with a grinder and get a sloppy looking, but very sharp edge. It won't work as well as a properly designed knife due to softer materials and rather a short bevel to the full blade width. The balance is also handle heavy. With a belt sander you can reprofile the blade to a convex bevel. This will be a more utilitarian edge than hollow grinding and will look better. You will probably want to repaint the extensive grinding area. For a quicker job I would only sand the bevel down for about 1/4" behind the edge rather than doing the entire bevel.

Given the relatively obtuse bevel on the blade I would leave the edge with a coarse finish. I would finish my reprofiling or lesser sharpening by alternately working from side to side with 220 grit belts. Then I would remove any burr with medium grit hones and stop. The edge coarseness will give a very agressive cutting edge. If I didn't have access to a belt sander I would use a 12" mill bastard file for most of the work and finish with the medium hones.
 
Hereby I admit that I've tried to sharpen my Buck M9 2 years ago
smile.gif

I understand that M9 is a bayonet primarily, yet I do not understand what does prevent it to be sharpened & hold that edge for a little while?
I mean, come on, that piece of metal already has some resemblance with the knife, why not to make it capable of some cutting?
The only thing that comes to my mind is the price, I mean to keep production cost lower while selling it for $130+.
When I got that knife if was promoted as Buck M9 Field Knife. I assume that field knife is supposed to do some cutting besides mine probing & stabbing... Donno how edge holding can interfere with either of those purposes...



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What special qualities must a mine probe have? I assume it would be a good idea to be non-magnetic, but the M-9 is steel. Or does it not matter with land mines?

Also, what is the spine thickness of the M-9?

[This message has been edited by tallwingedgoat (edited 09-28-2000).]
 
I have sharpened a bayonet starting out with a very fine file after getting an edge on the blade I thought was workable it went to the stones came out very sharp. I have even reshaped a knife that I have starting out with a fine file don't know if anyone else has ever used a file to start to sharpen anything. But I thouoght that it was better then power tools as you dont have to worry about the temper of the steel changing on you.
 
I've sharpened lots of things with files. It only works well on knives that are relatively soft. I can't say for sure, but I guess that you need to have the edge below 56 RC (maybe below 55 RC) for it to work efficiently. It has worked best on machetes, next best was bayonets, then some cheap knives and kitchen knives. You can remove material from some harder blades, but it is hard enough to do that you might do better with a coarse silicon carbide hone.
 
tallwingedgoat, I would think the best characteristic of a "mine probe" would be length! ...about 20 feet of it. Seriously, there are few requirements put on a mine probe. It's just that mine probing is a function soldiers "may" have to perform and they have no other means to do it other than a bayonet so it should more importantly not have any characteristics that would prevent it from being used as one.

Bayonet drills consist of thrusting and slashing. In combat, these actions could encounter an enemy's helmet, metal portions of his load bearing equipment (LBE), his weapon or any number of hard objects on or about him. Unfortunately, this may result in a chipped or otherwise damaged edge, making the next contact slightly less effective. If the M9 is to be used as a bayonet then it should not be razor sharp! You gentlemen who own them and never intend to attach them to your M16 or AR15, sharpen away, since you will probably use them as field knives. But soldiers want a functionally sharp, yet durable edge which takes away from it's lethality as a fighting knife and less importantly, it's utility as a field knife.

Bruce Woodbury
 
I see no point in not sharpening the bayonet if the only serious risk you face is dulling it. Any slash maneuver you make with the mounted bayonet will be more effective with an actual edge. If I worried about rapid edge degradation I would simply use a somewhat obtuse filed edge. This is stout and cuts effectively. I would carry a small file for touch up.
 
Jeff, exactly my point, which is why in my above post I stated a bayonet should not be "razor sharp." A bayonet can be sharp but thinning the edge to get it scary sharp is detrimental to functionality as a bayonet. An M9 sharpened to "bayonet sharpness" makes an acceptable "fieldcraft knife" but not a good fighting knife. Remember, this is a tool you may be putting your life on the line with, you can't afford to screw it up! We're not talking the difference between being able to peel branches off a log to make a litter or something, this is life or death when you need it.

Bruce
 
Originally posted by bruce:
...a bayonet should not be "razor sharp." A bayonet can be sharp but thinning the edge to get it scary sharp is detrimental to functionality as a bayonet...
Click to expand...
I don't know about other people's Buck M9 knives, but mine was(and still is) a very stubborn one
smile.gif
I've never tried to thin down the edge, yet even that fat edge it came with, was dulling way too fast. Let alone the difficulty of sharpening.



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