Extremely Early Lock Up On Reate Knives

[funkysteve]

Hey y'all. I'm new to the forum, but have been reading posts for a long time and really enjoy the content. Now I have a question for you knife enthusiasts.

I just recently purchased a new, Reate Mini Horizon D, but was unhappy with the lock up and returned it. I asked the dealer if he had others with better lockup, but he stated the other Horizons were similar to mine, locking up at approx 10% and he sent me a photo of one. The lock bar on both knives was just barely under the blade. To close it, I just nudged it lightly to the left and the lock bar disengaged. There was basically no resistance to disengaged the lock bar.

My other Chinese knives (We & Kizer) all lock up at between 25% to 35%.

Is the 10% or so lockup on the Reates acceptable?

 

[falar]

All three of my Reates have early lock up. They are rock-solid and not moving under any circumstance so I don't care. Just more room from them to wear in over time.

 

[Reitwagen]

Is the 10% or so lockup on the Reates acceptable?

Your description sounds like a dangerous condition. At any rate, there are lots of knives to choose from, so there is no reason to not be satisfied with your purchase.

 

[evilgreg]

I wouldn't worry about it, as long as the lockup feels solid when you exert pressure on the blade spine when locked.

My ZT 0630 has maybe 40-50% engagement and it fails easier than any knife I've ever owned, outside of an Emerson CQC-7B that was basically a slipjoint.

Give me 10% and locks up solid over 50% and casually fails . . .

 

[Hackenslash]

I have a bunch of Reate made knives and they typically have very early lock up. That being said, I've never had one with unsafe lock up.

I don't much care if the lock up is between 10% and 70%, just so long as it's secure. My problem is with lock up at 70% or more right out of the box that give little room for the lock to wear.

 

[falar]

I have a bunch of Reate made knives and they typically have very early lock up. That being said, I've never had one with unsafe lock up.

I don't much care if the lock up is between 10% and 70%, just so long as it's secure. My problem is with lock up at 70% or more right out of the box that give little room for the lock to wear.

It is strange how much opinion varies on what is ideal "out of the box". I see some people that are uncomfortable with anything under 50 and some that don't want to see more than 30 that soon.

Also some define the % as blade tang engaged and others as a % of the lockbar insert engaged.

 

[Krav]

Welcome to the forum. On this guy the lockup was dangerous. It disingauge with pressure on the spine of the blade. I adjusted the lock bar insert and this is how it's broken in. Very safe now. Great knives in my opinion. If the blade was a touch thinner with a different pocket clip this would be perfect.

 

[Alsharif]

My two Reate folders have early lockup but are rock solid, I wouldn't worry about it. When using the blade, the frame lock is further engaged by your grip on the folder. An early lockup also allows the lock to settle with time into a higher percentage of lockup.

 

[SeppukuSamurai]

Honestly, early lockup is usually my preference if given the option. All lockup wears in overtime. Out of the box, that 10% will usually gravitate on over to 15-20% over time as it's broken in. All of my Shiros are very early. They are equally very solid.

Companies like Reate/Shirogorov execute this "early" lock-up routinely. It's more or less just a "flex." Reate is one of the best, if not the, companies doing it right now. 10% lockup out of the box would make my heart skip a beat or two.

It's important to remember that when your blade is deployed and your hand is grasping the knife, you're applying pressure on the lock-bar. It's more or less next to impossible for your lock to fail under normal use whilst grasping the knife. 20% is 100% secure.

 

[sharp_edge]

I prefer early lockup too. But 15% or less does not give me confidence. That, coupled with light detent, often means disasters can more easily happen.

OP - apply some presure to the blade spine to see if it will fold (be careful when doing so to avoid being cut). If it holds, then it should be fine.

 

[falar]

I prefer early lockup too. But 15% or less does not give me confidence. That, coupled with light detent, often means disasters can more easily happen.

OP - apply some presure to the blade spine to see if it will fold (be careful when doing so to avoid being cut). If it holds, then it should be fine.

My Reate knives have strong detents too.

 

[sharp_edge]

My Reate knives have strong detents too.

I have only one Reate, Horizon D. The lockup is about 20-30% and yes the detent is on the strong side, so I am not worried.

 

[ChazzyP]

It is strange how much opinion varies on what is ideal "out of the box". I see some people that are uncomfortable with anything under 50 and some that don't want to see more than 30 that soon.

Also some define the % as blade tang engaged and others as a % of the lockbar insert engaged.

The desire for early lockup has become a popular internet refrain. There was a time when later lockup--and even a little lockstick--was considered to be a good thing and the knife safer for it. Consideration for locks wearing in (and wearing out) may well have followed the widening of the modern folder market and the emergence of liner- and frame-locks as fidget flippers.

I personally prefer later lockup and look at both the amount of blade tang and lockbar that are engaged.

All of my Shiros are very early. They are equally very solid.

The % lockup of my Shiros varies considerably from knife to knife. They are all very solid, though my F3 (older model) required significant effort to make it so. It was initially extremely early, just barely catching the edge of the blade and lock ramp with maybe 10-15% of the lockbar insert engaged. As it broke in, it began to develop lockstick beyond what I considered acceptable and, as I worked to relieve that, I noticed that the lock would slip if the knife was opened either by two hands or very light flip. After considerable polishing of the lock-ramp (reducing the light grind lines there) and a tiny easing of the insert's leading edge, the knife unlocks smoothly and silently and the insert now engages slightly in excess of 50% (20-25% on the ramp).

It's important to remember that when your blade is deployed and your hand is grasping the knife, you're applying pressure on the lock-bar. It's more or less next to impossible for your lock to fail under normal use whilst grasping the knife. 20% is 100% secure.

This is true for framelocks, but not liner locks. It also depends on one's grip as my old arthritic carpenter's mitts don't close sufficiently to exert any real pressure on the lockbar.

My Reate knives have strong detents too.

I think you're referring to lockbar pressure here, a significant amount of which makes it less likely that a knife will inadvertently disengage.

 

[jceckrosh]

I generally only care if the lockup is very late - getting near the other liner.

I know lots of knives I have lock up slightly differently depending on the energy spent opening them.

The best lockup I've seen is on my CRK's - where the lockbar is fully engaged on the blade tang, but just. That seems ideal.

 

[Scott K.]

This is the lock up on my Chaves Ultramar (made by Reate)

Looks a little early but the knife blade is super solid with no play. I love it!

 

[kniferbro]

Extremely early lock up = not having to spring the lock bar over as much. This is perfect when your customers demand "fall shut" action out of the box. What it's not good for is the lock wearing in and actually having a good amount of usable life.

People tout "well early lock up means I have more room to wear in" that doesn't work out when the lock bar is barely sprung, so once it wears in a little (repeated openings, hard cutting causing parts to settle) you're left with lock rock. The lock bar has to actually be sprung to at least the other scale if you want the lock to wear in and provide a solid engagement for the life of the knife. I guess you could take it apart once you get lock rock and spring the lock bar over more each time this happens to get a better engagement but if you don't want to take it apart or its an integral you're kind of SOL.

This is the difference between something like CRK's action and something like WE or Reate. If you hold the lock bar off the blade a CRK is just as smooth and falls shut under its own weight as any WE or Reate. It's the detent pressure that makes them feel different. CRK springs their locks all the way past the other scale, meaning the lock bar will truly wear across the entire width of the blade tang as the knife is used. This is why CRKs have a "hydraulic" action. They have lock bars sprung to last the knife, which means more pressure on the blade and not as "fall shutty" as the others.

So in the end the early engagement works hand in hand with weakly sprung locks to achieve a smoother action when flipping open or closed.