Fail - bowdrill with red cedar

[kgd]

Okay, I've been getting over confident with Doc's basswood and then with cottonwood. The cottonwood is about twice as difficult to get to coal, but I have done it about 5 or six times now. Then as we were cleaning out the garage I found the cedar I had bought earlier in the year from the hardwood store for the purpose of playing with the bowdrill. So, this time with a bit of experience I decided to give it a go.

Unfortunately, this thread doesn't have a Hollywood ending. I could get plenty of smoke but no coal. I'd even get the smoke to persist for about 5 s after lifting the drill and waving with my hands but the coal just didn't stay together like the ones I've made with cottonwood and basswood. It was just fine dust and soon went out. Still it was a fun exercise to do and this time I had a photographer, Becky, present.

Warning - I didn't take a shower today and I look like hell. Hey its the weekend and I'm married. I don't have to peacock it up anymore.

Here was the set up I bought. Cedar stakes. Given the red tinge, I'm assuming it was red cedar which I know is not ideal.

Making the hearth

Drilling out the divot in the hearth

Oh, I wasn't anticipating failure. I was dressed (well not dressed) for success. I had my tinder bundle all set. Jute twine - the good stuff!

Ready to roll. Drilled out the divot and got smoke in no time. I thought this was going to be a piece of cake!

Okay - here we go (man I'm just a hunk of love'n aren't I)...

I'm bowing!

I'm smoking!

Notice in this next one, the top of my drill is grinding down, I'm getting smoke from both ends and increasing the friction making my life tougher - ouch that it hot!

I think I got it, still some wisps of smoke coming out of the coal pile section. I carefully remove the drill. Note this is easy to screw up, you get really excited about your coal and you pop out the drill, lifting the hearth and spewing your goods all over the place. Careful now!

More to coming...

 

[kgd]

Fanning the coal

FAIL

I'm still happy though...I'm not giving up that easy! Lets try that again. Okay, fitting the drill to the bow.

Using the same divot, I got smoke right away again..

I really think I got it this time, I lift the drill and start waving. It's looking good....Dang it ain't looking good. I get down there and try a little blowing..I know, I know, waving is better no moisture on the breath. But I want to see what is going on!

Utter failure. I decide to inspect the coal. All there is a fine filement like black dust. Nothing sticking together like I get with the basswood or cottonwood.

Not dejected yet. When I was still dating, I learned that it was good to be persistent as hell. You eventually where 'em down and get success! Sharpening end up the head piece end of the drill so I don't get that double smoke action again.

Making a new divot well

Fit the drill to the bow and drill out the new divot/well

more coming...

 

[kgd]

Cutting out the wedge

Try this again. Going like hell now!

I think I got it!

THE AGONY OF DEFEAT

Okay...I need a beer, how about some Waterloo Dark Ale....

Beer will cheer me up, yes it does!

 

[BarberFobic1992]

i have heard of red cedar being too resinous, like pine. lots of smoke, but no coal.

 

[kgd]

Could be BarberFobic. It smoked so easily I though it would work for sure. I'm told that pine will gum up the drill and that wasn't the case here. What seems to be the issue is the nature of the coal as far as I can tell. When I get a coal with cottonwood, you get this little mass of stuck together dust that ignites and retains a bit of of shape when you fan it. This stuff was just thin strands that didn't seem to hold any shape on its own.

So wood type is important. I could use a bigger bow to help my efficiency I think. Cedar smoke smells awesome!

 

[DOC-CANADA]

Hey k,

A couple of observations, in no particular order (keeping in mind, I'm not there in person):

1. What kind of Red Cedar is it?

2. Has it been treated with anything?

3. If you're getting that much smoke at the top bearing, I'm thinking you're applying too much pressure - the fact that you mentioned 'strands' kind of supports this.

4. Not necessary relevant to this particular example, but if you're using 550, I strongly recommend that you reverse twist it, otherwise string slippage can be a problem.

5. I noticed that you haven't reshaped the head piece (also not relevant to this problem).

6. Remember, I told you there would be times when you would get skunked - all part of the learning process - the important thing is that you know you can do it, so everything else is just 'tweaking'.

7. Remember what I said about don't stop fanning just because the smoke seems to stop - many times I've had the char pile stop smoking, but because I kept fanning, it restarted (yes, I know I didn't deserve it, but it did )

8. If you can't get it to work, bring it with you on one of your trips to Kingston, and maybe we can get together for an afternoon.

9. In a survival situation, if you have this problem, change materials.

10. Is your drill and hearth, both from the same wood?

BTW, Phil and I have both used Pine successfully, just not one of your more easy materials.

Doc

 

[bindlestitch]

That's one heck of a close shot you got there though. Sure not for lack of tying. That doesn't look like eastern red cedar. I believe you that it's cedar it just doesn't look like the red cedar I'm used to.
One suggestion if you're not picky about using an all cedar set, try using a yucca drill on a eastern red cedar hearth.
Later,
Iz:thumbup:

 

[kgd]

Thanks for the input. I might be bearing down too hard. I'll try that. No the drill wasn't of the same wood as the hearth. I'll try that too. I haven't done anything to your headpiece doc, just my hand is completely covering it in the shot. It works awesome as it is! Yep, I'll keep at it, this is fun! I still haven't done the weeping willow yet which I want to try out. Cotton wood is working well so far. Thanks again for your advice!

 

[Dinkum]

Couldnt really see well, but I would say the notch in your hearth is too narrow. Double the size and try it again. I have noticed R Mears uses quite a large notch on this type of wood.

 

[DOC-CANADA]

Hey k, I read Dinkum's post and I looked back on your pictures and I think he's right, but it's hard to tell for sure from the pictures posted.

Doc

 

[Gravitas]

Try shortening up the spindle, it should give you more downward pressure and stability without sacraficing energy

 

[kgd]

Okay, I'll widen the notch too.

Thanks for the tip Gravitas. I start with a relatively long drill so that I may use it multiple times after being successful. Also during fails, as in this case, I start grinding it down usually at the headpiece end (due to the thinner point). However, I'll keep you point in consideration.

Thanks.