fast sharpening methods?

[Eva-01]

I am a scout leader and have just taken on the job of taking care of all the scouts knives. There are now 15 carbon steel mora knives and all of them need to be worked on. We want to put a normal V scandi grind onto these knives and they came with a rather large microbevel. Is there any fast way of removing a lot of metal or am I just gonna be spending a long time with my Diamond block?


image of what knife looks like if appropriate

 

[Magnumfloyd]

Belt sander

 

[Sharpnessis]

Paper wheels

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Might be worth posting a pic of both the least-worn and most-worn examples of the knives you have in-hand, to illustrate exactly how much repair might be needed (touching up the edge, or re-grinding the entire bevel). Could make a big difference in what might be recommended as the best & easiest solution, and also what equipment or tools you may need to acquire (from dirt cheap sandpaper to very $$$ stones or powered systems).


David

 

[airmojo]

I recently got an Work Sharp WSKTS and I sharpened up a bunch of kitchen knives and miscellaneous other knives... and a a hatchet... did a great job and pretty easy... its basically a little belt sander that uses 3 different size grit belts.

Here is the YouTube video that comes on the DVD.

http://youtu.be/F3MlkabgqYM

I like it... not sure I will use it on my really nice knives, but they barely get used any ways.

 

[Jason B.]

A scandi grind will best be sharpened on waterstones or sandpaper over glass. Sharpening wheels, diamond blocks, belt sanders and the work Sharp are all the wrong tools for the job, unless you want to ruin all the knives.

A king brand 220 grit waterstone and 1000 grit waterstone will go a long way in providing a quality edge to that style of grind. If on a budget then automotive sandpaper does very well also.

 

[stvpourciau]

A good old carbon steel file

Whatever you choose just keep the blade relatively cool. Don't be to much of an eager beaver.

If you do choose a grinding wheel or belt saber of some sort work for short burst at a time. Don't let the blade get hot or you'll ruin the temper.. Keep a bucket liquid near by for coolant.

I've heard that if you do mess up the edge, often times you can use a steel file to get at the still good steel right underneath it.

 

[Razorsharp-Travis]

use flat waterstones or sandpaper on a flat surface. If you dont have waterstones Id recommend 2 sheets of 220, some 400, 600, 800, 1200 , 1500 and 2 sheets of 2000 grit sandpaper, tear a corner of one of the 2k's and sand the surface, that will make it polish the edge more than the fresh 2k Just lay the sandpaper on something flat and sharpen away. Could also look at micromesh

 

[Razorsharp-Travis]

^^^^ dont use a steel file unless theres NOTHING ELSE

 

[stvpourciau]

^^^^ dont use a steel file unless theres NOTHING ELSE

Ha, yes I'm no expert. It's just all I have for cases where a daimondsharpening rod isn't gonna do it.

Which is what I think the op was asking for. How to remove a lot of metal fast. Not putting a fine edge on it. It's a better option than a grinding wheel.

 

[Jason B.]

Actually its not.

Understand the type of bevel the OP is dealing with seems to be a problem here.

 

[xuz]

Carbon steel Mora is thought to be somewhere between 58 and 60 HRC.
I'd need to see a picture of them, but going through 15 of these by hand will take a long time to put the original Scandinavian grind back.

That said, most of my Mora's don't have scandi. The user knives have, as you say large micro bevels, and some as large as 1/8+ inch. When I'm working on carving hardwood that dulls knives quickly, I don't have time to sit there and work out the full scandi. I cut a quick new bevel with DMT XC, strop a few times on DMT fine, then it goes right back to working.
The only Mora's that I have that retain their full scandi are ones that I reserve for softwood carving. Scandi offers advantage there with smoother cutting actions.

In outdoor situations, I would definitely not recommend scandi grind. Soft materials like ropes, meat & skin, bandanges, etc. simply don't care what kind of geometry you put on that. Harder things like shaving/splitting small pieces of wood for tinder, etc. prefer convex geometry which tends to "split" the material you are trying to cut and reduce the compression onto the blade. What you have, large microbevel, with thinner blade behind, is essentially convex and should work very well outdoors.
In summary, look for ones where the geometry is simply too thick to cut well. Thin those down. Grind that microbevel down so it has a keen edge and pass those out.

 

[Eva-01]

Might be worth posting a pic of both the least-worn and most-worn examples of the knives you have in-hand, to illustrate exactly how much repair might be needed (touching up the edge, or re-grinding the entire bevel). Could make a big difference in what might be recommended as the best & easiest solution, and also what equipment or tools you may need to acquire (from dirt cheap sandpaper to very $$$ stones or powered systems).


David

Condition that they are in at the moment that's one that most of the microbevel has been removed from and one that has not been touched.

trust me I feel pain at the rust also but I have 15 to do and they are carbon steel. I honestly don't have the time to sit down and grind through 15 of them at this point in time. even enough to get the rust off them.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Condition that they are in at the moment that's one that most of the microbevel has been removed from and one that has not been touched.

trust me I feel pain at the rust also but I have 15 to do and they are carbon steel. I honestly don't have the time to sit down and grind through 15 of them at this point in time. even enough to get the rust off them.

For some reason, I'm not seeing the pics (I'm seeing some placeholder icons for what I assume are pics).

My inclination is that I'd use some relatively coarse wet/dry sandpaper on a hard surface for these (this is how I maintain a lot of my knives anyway). Between the carbon steel and the relatively thin grind, this should work pretty fast. On the worst-worn edge, starting with something like 220-400 grit makes sense to me, then following up with sequentially higher grit (if desired, for a higher finish). On edges that have very little wear, maybe something like 600-1000 grit. An edge-trailing (stropping) stroke works well, and is usually the best approach on the sandpaper, to avoid cutting it. I use glass backing under my sandpaper, with the paper stuck to it (using temporary spray adhesive). The harder backing, like glass or hardwood, will make the sandpaper work more aggressively (faster) and it will also help to keep the edges very crisp, minimizing rounding off the apex.


David

 

[richard j]

i would go with a belt sander too like magnumfloyd suggested. i turned an emerson "a 100" into a scandi grind for a mod on the forum using nothing but my belt sander. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6774942#post6774942

if you are not in a hurry to get them done and i get caught up on all the orders i have before going back into the hospital, i would be glad to grind them for you.

 

[brettgrant99]

Don't know about the sharpening part, but why aren't you having the scouts take care of their knives, even if they are patrol/troop equipment?

I was the leader of the New Scout patrol for a couple of years, and we taught the kids how to sharpen. At least I did. I would let them use my equipment, but we had them do it. Often it would be on a Saturday. How are they supposed to learn if you do it for them?

Just my not so humble opinion,
Brett

 

[Sharpnessis]

Don't know about the sharpening part, but why aren't you having the scouts take care of their knives, even if they are patrol/troop equipment?

I was the leader of the New Scout patrol for a couple of years, and we taught the kids how to sharpen. At least I did. I would let them use my equipment, but we had them do it. Often it would be on a Saturday. How are they supposed to learn if you do it for them?

Just my not so humble opinion,
Brett

The best idea yet!
However, if you get a belt sander you can also do other things with it.

 

[me2]

Carbon steel Mora is thought to be somewhere between 58 and 60 HRC.
I'd need to see a picture of them, but going through 15 of these by hand will take a long time to put the original Scandinavian grind back.

That said, most of my Mora's don't have scandi. The user knives have, as you say large micro bevels, and some as large as 1/8+ inch. When I'm working on carving hardwood that dulls knives quickly, I don't have time to sit there and work out the full scandi. I cut a quick new bevel with DMT XC, strop a few times on DMT fine, then it goes right back to working.
The only Mora's that I have that retain their full scandi are ones that I reserve for softwood carving. Scandi offers advantage there with smoother cutting actions.

In outdoor situations, I would definitely not recommend scandi grind. Soft materials like ropes, meat & skin, bandanges, etc. simply don't care what kind of geometry you put on that. Harder things like shaving/splitting small pieces of wood for tinder, etc. prefer convex geometry which tends to "split" the material you are trying to cut and reduce the compression onto the blade. What you have, large microbevel, with thinner blade behind, is essentially convex and should work very well outdoors.
In summary, look for ones where the geometry is simply too thick to cut well. Thin those down. Grind that microbevel down so it has a keen edge and pass those out.

At least I'm not the only one that doesn't have a problem with a little bevel on a Mora.

 

[Camber]

At least I'm not the only one that doesn't have a problem with a little bevel on a Mora.

I certainly don't! I tried returning my stainless Mora to a true scandi on Sunday, but it was just taking entirely too long, so it's still got a secondary.

 

[Eva-01]

Don't know about the sharpening part, but why aren't you having the scouts take care of their knives, even if they are patrol/troop equipment?

I was the leader of the New Scout patrol for a couple of years, and we taught the kids how to sharpen. At least I did. I would let them use my equipment, but we had them do it. Often it would be on a Saturday. How are they supposed to learn if you do it for them?

Just my not so humble opinion,
Brett

that's exactly what we want to do but I want to remove the micro bevel first. Our plan is to start with the importance of stropping and have them strop the knives before and after use and then once they are more comfortable with the way the knives work and get used to the feel of the knives we would teach them how to sharpen.