Feedback on my proposed BK2 stripping method?

[bearedmonkey]

Stolen BK2 was replaced by my gf, her sister's father-in-law said he'd make a new set of scales for me and since I had the old ones in my car (micarta was on the stolen knife), I was able to give those to him for a template (just gotta choose and send him the wood), so now I'm on to stripping it. Been perusing old threads on the forums and a few other sites as well, and here's my plan so far. Can you all read this and give me some feedback? I'm especially interesting in your thoughts on my questions (in bold).


1. Progression: 150 180 240 320 400 600 1000 1200 1500 2000

2. At 240, move from circular motion to alternating directions at each progression (ie: hilt-tip for the first grade; spine-blade on the next)

3. Have also read the following tips. Your thoughts? Are these worthwhile suggestions?
* Color the whole blade with a Sharpie, that way you know if you’ve hit every spot
* Buff in the lower grades (150 and 320), that way you’ll bring out big scratches I may have missed
* Move slowly through the higher grades

4. At 2000 switch to Dremmel with polishing compound. I've heard that diamond paste works well, ie: Norton 3,6,15,30 microns (4-pack). Is this necessary or can I just use the polishing compound that comes stock with the Dremmel?

5. Use oil instead of water when wet/dry sanding (won’t risk rusting it with the method I plan to use to secure it – see below)
* What kind of oil should I use?

6. Sanding block should be made of what?
* Sanding “sponge”?
* Rubber wood sanding block?
* How much does it matter how malleable/pliant/how much “give” the block has?

7. Avoiding the edge:
* I can’t. I’ll hit it. I’ll deal with what I’ve done to the edge when I’m done. If need be I’ll get it professionally re-sharpened and I’ll have them add a convex edge since I’m still not sure how to do that by hand and don’t own a belt sander.
* In order to save my fingers I’m going to remove the scales and then screw the blade to 2x4. I have some leather scraps so I’ll nail or screw one of those down so I don’t mess up the other side. I also don’t think I’ll need gloves if I do this. If it turns out I do and I end up losing a finger, I'll definitely post pics
* Should I go all the way up the grades before flipping it over, or should I hit both sides before moving up a grade?

8. To strip and mirror polish or just leave it at a satin finish? This is not going to be a safe queen so am I destroy my (hopefully) pristine polishing job the first time I use it?

Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jwolf90]

I would think your method should work fine but I would go with the satin finish and give it a nice patina. You also don't quite need all the grits if u don't want a mirror polish

 

[Moosez45]

Damn, let me take a moment to soak it all in, then I'll reply.

Moose

 

[bearedmonkey]

Damn, let me take a moment to soak it all in, then I'll reply.

Moose

Ummm... Yeah, when I ask a question I go big; I actually transfered this from a word doc Feel free to answer any part as any help would be appreciated. I'm still waiting for a payment from a client anyway, so until I have money the project is on hold anyway.

 

[Moosez45]

Well, from what I was able to decypher , you are going to be stipping it with sandpaper, then polishing it, right?

Because, I would say, get some Jasco, strip the paint off it, and save you some elbow grease, and sandpaper, you're going to be using it soon enough.

For a high mirror shine, you will really need to get on a buffing wheel with some compound, to make a the entire thing mirror shine. I can shine mine enough to reflect with 0000 steel wool, but it doesn't last if you are going to use it, so, why bother with making a mirror shine on a user.

Unless that's what you want to do, in that case, I say,


POST PICS WHEN YOU ARE DONE!!!!!!

Moose

 

[LECTER]

 

[bearedmonkey]

Helpful dude, thanks. Always appreciate someone who goes out of his way to be a ****.

Moose I think I got it figured out. Redhat (i think that's who) is my inspiration, and I'm aiming for what he did... Pics soon as I just got all my materials.

 

[spider991]

Holy crap, I just dumped stripper on it and scraped it off with a putty knife then wiped it with an old tshirt.......I may have missed a step.

 

[bearedmonkey]

Yeah yeah.... Ok too many words, not enough work. I'm gonna shut up and get to work. Next post after I've made some progress.

 

[whereismyclock]

Off topic: These make me laugh.

On topic: That blade is going to be so polished you can see yourself 5 years from now. Seriously dude you gotta post pics.

 

[LECTER]

Off topic: These make me laugh.

On topic: That blade is going to be so polished you can see yourself 5 years from now. Seriously dude you gotta post pics.

hehehehe!

 

[daizee]

skip the 150 and 400. They're too close to other grits, don't waste your time.

Use a FLAT sanding block, something that will STAY flat throughout the process. Else you'll round the bevels and make the thing look like a spoon. I use a piece of extra G10. I used to use maple flats. The G10 is better. At some point you may need the slightest conformity from your block. Slip a thin piece of stiff , veggie tanned, leather between the block and the paper (I learned this trick recently and it works great).

Sanding pattern:

1. 45deg one way, entire bevel
2. 45deg the other way, entire bevel
3. goto 1 until the underlying surface is ONLY your sanding scratches from the current grit
4. lengthwise fore/aft until ALL 45deg scratches are gone
5. plunge to tip ONLY (not back/forth) until even
6. select next grit, goto 1.

Notes:
a) DO NOT sand lengthwise until ALL the lengthwise scratches from the previous grit are gone. This is how you know you are done.
b) treat sandpaper like it's free. If you keep sanding with loaded paper you're wasting your time.
c) wet vs. dry: I don't wet sand. It may help, don't know.
d) once you're up to 1000+ you might just want to go to the buffer.
e) go all the way up on one side. Then apply blue masking tape (or similar) to protect your work. Flip, repeat. The fewer times you re-position the knife, the faster it will go. Don't expect to finish the entire blade in one sitting. If you do, I'll raise a glass in your direction. But you won't, because your hands will be spent.
f) bolting the blade to a 2x4 is a good idea. or clamp it - whatever. The knife board (that's what it is) should be solidly attached to a solid workbench or something. If the whole bench waggles as you work you'll go nuts.
g) skip the sharpie. If you follow the protocol above, the scratch pattern will be your indicator. Make sure you have good light.
h) skip the dremel. In my experience, your power tool should have a LARGE working surface relative to the piece. The opposite (such as in this case) will result in an uneven surface that's very hard to correct. Use a real buffer, or give the knife to someone who knows how to use one safely.
i) If you can do this hand finishing you can re-sharpen the knife yourself. It's the transition line from flat to primary bevel you should worry about preserving, not the primarybevel-to-edgebevel. Oh, for the love of DOG, PLEASE wear a glove on your hand that's on the edge side.
j) As per Moose, presumably you strip it chemically (which you did !). A high polish will be easier to keep clean and reduce the microsurface area which reduces moisture retention and rust. It will also have less drag in MOST materials (notably NOT cheese). IMO, 600 would be sufficient for a satin finish on an uncoated knife. Anything else is gravy.

Oh yeah, and Pix Or It Didn't Happen.

Now git sanding and wow us!

-Daizee

 

[bearedmonkey]

skip the 150 and 400. They're too close to other grits, don't waste your time.

Use a FLAT sanding block, something that will STAY flat throughout the process. Else you'll round the bevels and make the thing look like a spoon. I use a piece of extra G10. I used to use maple flats. The G10 is better. At some point you may need the slightest conformity from your block. Slip a thin piece of stiff , veggie tanned, leather between the block and the paper (I learned this trick recently and it works great).

Sanding pattern:

1. 45deg one way, entire bevel
2. 45deg the other way, entire bevel
3. goto 1 until the underlying surface is ONLY your sanding scratches from the current grit
4. lengthwise fore/aft until ALL 45deg scratches are gone
5. plunge to tip ONLY (not back/forth) until even
6. select next grit, goto 1.

Notes:
a) DO NOT sand lengthwise until ALL the lengthwise scratches from the previous grit are gone. This is how you know you are done.
b) treat sandpaper like it's free. If you keep sanding with loaded paper you're wasting your time.
c) wet vs. dry: I don't wet sand. It may help, don't know.
d) once you're up to 1000+ you might just want to go to the buffer.
e) go all the way up on one side. Then apply blue masking tape (or similar) to protect your work. Flip, repeat. The fewer times you re-position the knife, the faster it will go. Don't expect to finish the entire blade in one sitting. If you do, I'll raise a glass in your direction. But you won't, because your hands will be spent.
f) bolting the blade to a 2x4 is a good idea. or clamp it - whatever. The knife board (that's what it is) should be solidly attached to a solid workbench or something. If the whole bench waggles as you work you'll go nuts.
g) skip the sharpie. If you follow the protocol above, the scratch pattern will be your indicator. Make sure you have good light.
h) skip the dremel. In my experience, your power tool should have a LARGE working surface relative to the piece. The opposite (such as in this case) will result in an uneven surface that's very hard to correct. Use a real buffer, or give the knife to someone who knows how to use one safely.
i) If you can do this hand finishing you can re-sharpen the knife yourself. It's the transition line from flat to primary bevel you should worry about preserving, not the primarybevel-to-edgebevel. Oh, for the love of DOG, PLEASE wear a glove on your hand that's on the edge side.
j) As per Moose, presumably you strip it chemically (which you did !). A high polish will be easier to keep clean and reduce the microsurface area which reduces moisture retention and rust. It will also have less drag in MOST materials (notably NOT cheese). IMO, 600 would be sufficient for a satin finish on an uncoated knife. Anything else is gravy.

Oh yeah, and Pix Or It Didn't Happen.

Now git sanding and wow us!

-Daizee

Thanks! Bad news? I've been using my hand, not a block. Spoon-like? Not to my eye, but who knows. Good news? Like six hours in and I've only just switched up to 600 (I should note, looking at other threads it looks like good polishes were achieved starting at 400, but now I wish I'd started lower -- so much pitting it took me forever). Anyway, I don't have any g10 so I'll grab some maple or plexiglass tomorrow. The edge is pretty much shot right now but whatever, if I can't fix it when I'm done I'll send it to Richard. Hope not using a block didn't screw me, but either way, it's getting somewhere. I'll do your 45 - 45 - hilt-tip method starting now.

 

[daizee]

Hey beardedmonkey,
you have not screwed yourself, but geez, things will go so much better with a block. I mean... hands are only for surfaces that require conformity. Starting at 400 is indeed too high. But if you've made it through, then you've made it through. The bonus is that next time it will go much faster. You'll find out when you go up to 600/800 whatever how much is left behind. If it turns out the surface is too un-flat for a truly flat block, then do the leather trick I mentioned. it will give you just a tiny bit of conformity.

Sometimes you gotta learn the hard way. Don't ask me how I know THAT.

-Daizee

 

[daizee]

For encouragement:

This knife was sanded to 360 before heat-treat, so there are no pitting or deep usage scratch problems.
It's small, and only about 2.5-2.6" of blade will be exposed - only polish the exposed areas (blade, spine, ricasso).
Then it was heat-treated.
I cleaned the scale off with 280grit and then sanded 280, 360, 500, 1000. This took about 45min-1hr.
That's a 1000grit one-directional surface in the picture. Pattern on the bevel is from the plunge to the tip.
Immediately after taking the picture I put blue tape on that side, trimmed to fit, and put it away. I'll finish the other half tomorrow or the next day.
Check out the reflection of the ceiling in the blade flat.

My point is that although you project has much more area to cover, with the right protocol you can move reasonably quickly.
Switching directions on a regular basis and with a regular pattern means you're taking the peaks off the surface scratches by sanding across them instead of just dropping your grit into the troughs along the direction of travel. MUCH more effective!

-Daizee

 

[bearedmonkey]

Thanks dude, this is really helpful, and explains a bunch. Just an hour of work? I'll definitely give your method a shot. A few questions... What is the "plunge"? Also, why does the tip show scratches (or is that just a weird effect of the photo)?

 

[daizee]

The tip shows the 1000grit finish due to the reflection of the light. However you can get a pretty good image at that finish level too. The 'plunge' is the rearmost part of the main bevel where it transitions back to full thickness.

That was an hour of work from the heat-treat starting point. IIRC, that was a 1084 hunting knife treated in a propane mini forge and plunged into warm oil. The processes leaves a bit of a mess requiring cleanup, yet is still manageable with the right protocol (and a decent pre-heat-treat finish! the main flattening happens while the blade is still soft, before heat).

-Daizee

 

[C_Tanner]

Looking forward to trying this. The plan is, strip the Potbelly when it arrives (might not get to that till tommorrow), Polish the grind, and clich the flats. Then add the black scales Greybush gave me when they arrive. Should be the sweetest Potbelly yet. Time to start "Beckerizing" other Ka-Bars...

Definately going to go back and re-do the MkI and BK16.

 

[rwn2000]

Daizee is dead-on correct in the way to do it. One rule of thumb you can use is that you can usually step up to about double the grit you just finished. i.e. 60>120>220>400>800>1500>2000>3000. (2000 just makes it quicker once you get this fine)

Also, if you haven;t seen this thread you should check it out. Nick Wheeler's stuff is amazing. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...-the-metal-with-you?highlight=stuck+the+metal

skip to page 5 for his blade sanding pics.

randy

ETA: DONT start at 60 grit stripping a Becker, You'll just make work for yourself. that was for illustration only. I started at 220 grit on my BK-15.