Feeling the burr?

uilleann

uilleann

Joined
Nov 20, 2016
Messages
144
I am knew to this sharpening thing. I got a KME sharpening system with the diamond steel blocks that run from 50 to 1500 grit.. I also got the strop with a 4 micron emulsion.

I think I have learned that you do not flip the blade till you feel the burr. Tell me if I am wrong.

What I have found is that its easy to get and feel the burr at 50 grit. Its sort of easy to feel it at 140 grit. At 300 grit you have to increase the number of strokes to get a burr. At that point you can sort of feel the burr but using the fingernail is a strong indicator. At 600 i have to do alot more strokes again and now I am not sure if I am feeling burr on my finger but my fingernail still catches. At 1500 I have to stroke even more and I cannot feel the burr except for a slight fingernail chatch.

Then during the stropping I can detect no burr with my fingernail or finger.

So..... is this the way it is supposed to go? Or should I be able to detect a burr while stropping?

My knives are very sharp but not as sharp as what I see on youtube videos.
 
I rub the edge with my fingerprint. If there is a burr on one side, the burr will be caught in the grooves of fingerprint and generate rough or rugged texture. There should be a clear difference on the other side, which is supposed to be smooth. This works best when the finger tip is very dry (I use a little bit of dish soap on stones, and it seems make my hand surface very dry during sharpening). I can sense burrs after #2,000. But I can not feel them after more refinement on finer stones or strops.

I suggest you read the sticky.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...hat-is-sharpening-a-knife-about-(2015-updates!)


Miso
 
WELCOME!

Yes, that's the way it generally goes.

It's easy to feel the burr, even see it, with the coarse stones cuz you're removing relatively lots of steel. The finer you go, the less steel is removed, raising a smaller burr, which becomes increasingly harder to detect.

After 1000, I don't even check for a burr, as the edge bevel has been set and I'm just refining it so I just do the same number of strokes per side.

"alot more strokes" - YMMV as I personally don't find that I have to do significantly more strokes.
 
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When you get down to the finer stones its very hard to feel a bur. At your finest stone there really shoukdnt be a bur anymore, as said a above youre just refining the edge that the other stones created. At this point start checking your edgedfor sharpeness. Make sure both sides are somewhat equally sharp. At your finest grit use light strokes and i try to keep the number of strokes equal on both sides of the blade.
 
uilleann said:
I am knew to this sharpening thing. I got a KME sharpening system with the diamond steel blocks that run from 50 to 1500 grit.. I also got the strop with a 4 micron emulsion.

I think I have learned that you do not flip the blade till you feel the burr. Tell me if I am wrong.

What I have found is that its easy to get and feel the burr at 50 grit. Its sort of easy to feel it at 140 grit. At 300 grit you have to increase the number of strokes to get a burr. At that point you can sort of feel the burr but using the fingernail is a strong indicator. At 600 i have to do alot more strokes again and now I am not sure if I am feeling burr on my finger but my fingernail still catches. At 1500 I have to stroke even more and I cannot feel the burr except for a slight fingernail chatch.

Then during the stropping I can detect no burr with my fingernail or finger.

So..... is this the way it is supposed to go? Or should I be able to detect a burr while stropping?

My knives are very sharp but not as sharp as what I see on youtube videos.
Click to expand...

To add to what TravisH & 115Italian said... Don't worry about checking to see if you've created a burr at the finer grits. A burr primarily tells you that you've sharpened all the way to the edge. Especially on a guided device using diamond stones, (which is pretty consistent), once you create a burr, the remaining stones are used to refine the edge to the desired level... you're already at the edge. If you think a subsequent stone isn't hitting the edge, it's easier to mark the edge with a Sharpie to check. And no burr while stropping... in fact, it should be gone as much as possible prior to stropping. The strop should just clean up any remaining burr, and further refine the edge if desired.

Only real reason to check for a burr at finer levels... is to see if one that you don't want is still there. Then you can try some of the suggestions others made...to see what works for you.
 
I usually do a rough gauge by finger - rub.

The smallest of them can be seen by holding the knife up to eye level, edge pointing down under a bright light. Slowly tilt the blade back and forth and you'll see the burr as a glint of light along the edge when the bevel behind it is still dark. The human eye can see a candle flame nearly 2 miles away. Stropping the edge on paper also tends to shine up any residual burrs for easier ID.

There are varying shades, and you can actually detect a slightly folded edge as well as a lot of other defects, the burr will be pretty obvious. A loupe in addition can be helpful but not really needed. Helps if the overhead light source is the strongest in the area.
 
I NEVER feel for a burn. In my mind, and I am sure the apex sharpeners will agre, that is way too much bur.

In stead I look for an ever so slight glint right on one side of the edge. The slightest whisper of metal. I use a high power jeweler's optical magnification visor and always sharpen where I can have a bright light hit the edge just so I can easily detect the bur visually. Really . . . any bur is a no,no but I'm still a wimp sharpener and haven't progressed to REAL sharpening. Apex sharpening.

50 grit ! ! !
Whow and I thought i liked coarse stones to start using my 220 and some times venturing into 120 land.

Yah . . .set the 50 grit down and back away slow before you cause some sort of cataclysmic disaster they will be talking about decades from now.
 
Totally glossed over the 50g stone part.... yeah, you should avoid sharpening all the way to the edge with that one. If you look at (or even feel) the edge... it'll have a bunch of chips in it you'll have to remove. Save that stone for major repairs or reprofiling, and use it just enough to fix the damage or do the work, while avoiding the edge as much as possible.
 
leann, once you have set the bevel to your liking, I would not take a blade back to a 50 grit stone. You probably just need to touch it up. In that case take it to your 600 grit and give it a few passes. Don't worry about working up a burr unless it was real dull. Just work the edge and count the strokes. Feeling of it after working both sides. Should you feel a burr just sheer it off and move on to the next grit. DM
 
Burr with a #240 stone. You don't see it on the opposite side, and it should be gone when you grind this side.


Burr.JPG




Miso
 
I agree with the others but it takes some experience knowing what to look and feel for. Until you get there use a cotton ball or q-tip or the rough edge of a paper towel. Rub it lightly along the side that should have a burr. You should feel it catching the whole way, if you dont, you don't have a burr. Play with that a couple of times under some good lighting and feel for the burr. When you know there's a burr start moving the blade under the light and you'll pretty quickly find out what to look for. You'll probably have some stands of cotton hanging off of the burr even at higher grits. And when you're stropping you shouldn't be looking to raise a burr. That's the step where you're cleaning the edge up. You can remove some steel so it's not outside the realm of possibility to raise a burr but you shouldn't be going that far when stropping. You should really be trying to go into stropping with the smallest burr possible through light, single passes on each side and stropping is just removing crap from the apex left over from the stones and taking off any random "teeth" hanging on to the apex.

And I agree that a 50 grit hone should be left for the worst damage and you need to remove ALOT of steel. For reference I use a 100 grit stone to put initial edge bevels on a blade.
 
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