ferrocium vs mischmetal,who prefers what and why?

S

skitertank

Joined
Jun 12, 2009
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it seems the majority of people prefer ferrocium rods over mischmetal and im not to sure why,i find the mischmetal far superior,in my opinion.

i had the blast match and lmf scout and army models for years before i discovered mischmetal and now i wont go back. the mischmetal rods throw globs of molten metal(not just sparks) and they burn for a few seconds,enough to get your tinder on there if you miss the pile. you can scrape off small shavings of it and make it work just like a magnessium firestarter if you need a bigger hotter flame to get the tinder lit. they can light much larger and courser tinder than the ferro rods and i think the last pro is that they are cheaper. i picked one up on goinggear.com for under $8 and its 4"x15/32", so its bigger than the lmf army model both ways and they last!the cons would be that they dont come with a striker and they're slightly harder to strike(takes a while to get it down but once you do,its easy)i found that standard razor blades with edge knocked slightly down by a belt sander work great, but a good knife spine works even better!

so theres my two cents and just for the record,im not downin on ferro rods because i have made many many fires with them, i just prefer mm rods.so what do you guys prefer and why?
 
I thought that ferrocerium contained "mischmetal". Perhaps the two are combined in many firesteels.

From wikipedia (which I do not trust :)):

A modern ferrocerium firesteel product is composed mostly of iron, combined with an alloy of rare earth metals called mischmetal (containing approximately 50% cerium, 45% lanthanum, and small amounts of neodymium and praseodymium), plus a small amount of magnesium:

Iron: 19%
Cerium: 38%
Lanthanum: 22%
Neodymium: 4%
Praseodymium: 4%
Magnesium: 4%
 
I like ferocium more. I think it is easier to improvise a striker for it, as opposed to misch metal which requires a very perticulat striker.
 
I like the LMF ferocium more. Easier to strike means I have more control of the strike. I found that with the misch metal rods I have to strike it so hard and fast, and with only certain strikers, that I have to hold the rod farther from the target otherwise I end up knocking against the tinder in my follow through. In my practice with using lint and pj cotton balls, I can get them to light with one or two controlled strikes of the LMF, whereas I have to hold the misch enough away to prevent knocking the cotton flying that the sparks and molten metal more often miss the cotton than lighting it. It's really cool seeing the molten globs burn there on the ground but if it's not burning what I'm aiming at then it's not doing me much good.

With harder to burn tinder I don't know what the result would be. On the one hand I can get the sparks to the target with the LMF, but the sparks would have a hard time lighting it. On the other hand the misch metal might light the tinder, but I'd have a hard time delivering the sparks to the tinder. I guess I can always carry one of each.

The other thing too is that with the LMF ferro I can just flick at the tip of the rod and get sparks. Which means that with extensive use I can wear down the rod from the tip and thus use the whole rod. With the misch metal rod I have to use a hard long stroke. And that means that the most pressure is put about an inch or more before the tip. This wears away the rod behind the tip and with a lot of use I'll end up with a wasp waist rod that will have the tip fall off at some point wasted.
 
Ferro rods.

I have a hard time getting a spark from the mischmetal in the same controlled fashion I do with firesteels. I've seen no big difference in the sparks either, I get my LMF firesteel to throw big sparks that stay burning for a couple seconds and manage to get fire on the first strike most of the time, on the other hand I can barely seem to get a spark with the mischmetals, gotta strike them in a completely different way or I just get little metal filings.
 
I have both types. For me, it is far easier to light tinder with the m/m vs. the ferro type fire steel. I agree that it is not as easy to produce sparks, but once you master the technique, it is really no big deal.
 
Have both.

Misch metal lights a broader range of tinder than the ferro rod.

That said, I can't go slow, hard, and right on the tinder with the misch metal, just scrapes the material off. I have to stand off and go fast. Not what I want when my hands are shivering and I can't direct sparks from a distance.

I may keep and play with the misch metal, but I will keep my ferro for the "when I need trusted gear."
 
I have, and use, both types.

Most of the important points have been covered.

The Ferro rod is easier to strike and control, the MM does throw some molten balls of metal.

The MM does give you the option of creating some shavings to help get marginal tinder going.

I have also noted that the MM gets used up faster, but this is not a big issue in a short term survival situation, for longevity choose the Ferro Rod.

Just my two cents.




Big Mike

”Scaring the tree huggers.”

Forest & Stream
 
I wonder if the use of a Corona/Speedy Sharp Carbide sharpener as a Striker would improve either the poster's issue with firesteels and/or the consensus against the misch metal rods?

http://bepreparedtosurvive.com/FirestarterProducts.htm#Corona Sharpening Tool

I have two of them, and they make the FireSteel pump out the sparks. Basically, because instead of scraping, you are cutting the pieces off, it will put a flat spot in your rod in no time flat.

Marion
 
Grapevine said:
I like the LMF ferocium more. Easier to strike means I have more control of the strike. I found that with the misch metal rods I have to strike it so hard and fast, and with only certain strikers, that I have to hold the rod farther from the target otherwise I end up knocking against the tinder in my follow through. In my practice with using lint and pj cotton balls, I can get them to light with one or two controlled strikes of the LMF, whereas I have to hold the misch enough away to prevent knocking the cotton flying that the sparks and molten metal more often miss the cotton than lighting it. It's really cool seeing the molten globs burn there on the ground but if it's not burning what I'm aiming at then it's not doing me much good.

With harder to burn tinder I don't know what the result would be. On the one hand I can get the sparks to the target with the LMF, but the sparks would have a hard time lighting it. On the other hand the misch metal might light the tinder, but I'd have a hard time delivering the sparks to the tinder. I guess I can always carry one of each.

The other thing too is that with the LMF ferro I can just flick at the tip of the rod and get sparks. Which means that with extensive use I can wear down the rod from the tip and thus use the whole rod. With the misch metal rod I have to use a hard long stroke. And that means that the most pressure is put about an inch or more before the tip. This wears away the rod behind the tip and with a lot of use I'll end up with a wasp waist rod that will have the tip fall off at some point wasted.
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:thumbup:
Same here. I have to get my tinder finer but I prefer the control of the ferro over the hot molten sparks of the misch.
Later,
Iz
 
I have a bunch of rods. Please tell me how to identify if it's mish-metal, or ferrocerium? I can't tell by looking; they all make pretty good sparks.
 
hiwa said:
I have a bunch of rods. Please tell me how to identify if it's mish-metal, or ferrocerium? I can't tell by looking; they all make pretty good sparks.
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Well, ferrocerium is an alloy that contains mischmetal, so it's more of an issue of who makes them. Europe makes the harder rods that LMF uses in their products with the shorter lived sparks and easier use. Asia makes the softer rods that I sell and that are in many other products with the longer lived sparks and slightly harder use. If you have a blank rod by itself, it's probably one of the Asian rods since the European rods are very hard to find by themselves.

I have LMF on the way, so you'll be able to buy all of them from me very soon. :D

Regarding what I prefer, I actually use the Sparkie almost exclusively these days. It's just so stupid simple to use, and works very well.
 
Thanks. It's probably Asian stuff I have, as well as the Coghlan's firestarter (similar to the Doan's ones you fellas south got. As long as she gets my fire going.
 
hiwa said:
Thanks. It's probably Asian stuff I have, as well as the Coghlan's firestarter (similar to the Doan's ones you fellas south got. As long as she gets my fire going.
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Doans makes the Coghlans one, IIRC. :) After dealing with this stuff for a while, you start to realize that there are very few players in the game.
 
hiwa said:
I have a bunch of rods. Please tell me how to identify if it's mish-metal, or ferrocerium? I can't tell by looking; they all make pretty good sparks.
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if you have a mm rod you would prob know because it takes a different striker and method all together and they throw burning globs of metal.ferro rods throw large sparks and are easier to strike.

when i got my first mm rod, i actually hated it and didnt use it for awhile.it was only when i learned the technique that i liked mm rods. i personally practice firecraft almost everyday and i try to put them thru real tests. i dont practice with "manmade" materials like cotton balls,lint or store bought tinders because lets be honest,anybody can get those lit. i use whats around me in the woods, usually wood shavings,dead grass and leaves because thats what your gona have in a survival situation.i have practiced in the rain and high winds which is where i found the mm rod to pull ahead. in normal conditions i can get grass and shavings lit with a ferro rod easily but once the tinder gets slightly damp it seems to be near impossible, where the mm rod still works.again, thats just my findings.
 
skitertank said:
i personally practice firecraft almost everyday and i try to put them thru real tests. i dont practice with "manmade" materials like cotton balls,lint or store bought tinders because lets be honest,anybody can get those lit. i use whats around me in the woods, usually wood shavings,dead grass and leaves because thats what your gona have in a survival situation.i have practiced in the rain and high winds which is where i found the mm rod to pull ahead. in normal conditions i can get grass and shavings lit with a ferro rod easily but once the tinder gets slightly damp it seems to be near impossible, where the mm rod still works.again, thats just my findings.
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But in a survival situation how many are going to have their mm or ferro rod with them since both of those are man made products also? If they do, due to their always carrying a rod around, then it's not too difficult to carry a bit of pj cotton along. I know that I pair the rod with a bit of pj cotton, so that if I have the rod then I also have the cotton—they're a unit. In the same way, the mm rod needs its striker to have such specific characteristics that it's less likely that you'll have that kind of striker in a survival situation unless you've paired the striker to it so that if you have one then you have the other.
 
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Grapevine said:
But in a survival situation how many are going to have their mm or ferro rod with them? If they do, due to their always carrying a rod around, then it's not too difficult to carry a bit of pj cotton along. I know that I pair the rod with a bit of pj cotton, so that if I have the rod then I also have the cotton. The mm rod also needs its striker to have such specific characteristics that it's also less likely that you'll have that kind of striker in a survival situation, unless you pair the striker to it so that if you have one then you have the other, which would be the same mindset as always carrying pj cotton if you're carrying a ferro rod.
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im not sure if im like most people on here but at minimum,i never go into a wilderness of any kind without two things,knife and steel(if i have a choice)so if something was to happen that it was to turn in to a situation, i have the two most important things and the knowledge of how to use them,aside from a water carrying system. if i have a firesteel,then i will have something to strike it with. yes i do carry cottonballs when camping,hiking or hunting but what about when those run out? i generally just carry them in case i need to get a fire going quickly. i practice with natural tinders that way it still wont be a problem if i was in a situation for a prolonged amount of time and was to run out of cottonballs.
 
One thing to ask- Are most of you guys striking forward with your striker (it seems that way)? I was always taught to keep the striker still and stroke the ferro/MM rod backwards to control the sparks and to not ever touch the tinder- important in real survival/ hypothermia conditions (although I have never had to use one in those conditions). I still always pull backward- both LMF and RAT steel work this way, I have not tried other MM.
 
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