"Finding the sweet spot", what makes a good chopper?

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Apr 15, 2014
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First and foremost, I don't think there's a "best" chopper out there, its far too subjective to decide. I do however think there are some attributes that lend a knife to being a good chopper.

After reprofiling my Scrapyard 1111 to a Full height convex grind, with a screaming sharp edge and fairly similar geometry to my new ASHBM, I was sure it would either match it, or outperform it even.



First I took 10 swings into this fallen pine, the ASHBM went first, biting nice and deep. The 1111 went next, and although was doing just awesome, it was a little behind the Mistress.


One hard whack into the log for each blade, as you can see the Mistress bites hard and deep. The 1111 bites in, but either either my technique (wrist rolling in), or the convex grind caused it to curve into the wood, rather then travel straight in. Side note: I find myself hitting further back with the Busse than the 1111, I'm not sure if this is good or bad yet..


More evidence of the curving, but both still biting impressively deep.




Now before you think I'm not impressed with the regrind, let me tell you, this knife is at its optimal performance. It swings fast, and bites deep. I won't be making any more modifications to it, its really great.




I think in the case of these two, although they had similar geometry, the mass of the mistress carried it deeper into the wood. I could swing the 1111 faster, but needed to do so to get it to bite as deep as the Mistress had.

So maybe you could say:
>geometry (acute flat ground/convex/sabre)
>mass (weight)
>velocity (users strength)
>leverage (blade length/balance)
are what contribute to a knife being a good chopper.

Now, different combinations of all of these will often lead to a good performer.
For instance, the 1311, which is often thought as one of the top in its category, has a relatively thin blade stock at 3/16", and a height of 1.75"(very similar to a Ratmandu), but its 13" blade length makes up enough velocity and leverage to slam that thin saber grind into the wood with little effort.

The MOAB at a .4" or .375" thickness, with a Full flat grind, and 14" blade, will rattle the earth with each swing and bite deep,, but your arm probably won't last long.

This all goes back to personal preferences. Guys a lot bigger than me could probably swing the MOAB all day long, but for me, the ASHBM is where I max out for extended use.
Some prefer a saber grind, as they seem to be more effective at battoning, and add some lateral strength. I however, rarely baton, so I'll take the performance of a FFG.

All in all, its pretty impressive that Busse and Kin have produced the wide variety of choppers, in all shapes, sizes, and even colors for us nuts to choose from. I highly recommend trying as many as you can get your hands on, and find that sweet spot for you.

Happy Chopping Hogs
 
Very nice comparison rcb2000! I have seen Dan Keffeler (on videos) do astounding things with a 10 inch Blade that the Vast majority of folks (me included) could not duplicate! That is why when I see comparison videos or read other people's opinion's I take it for what it is (an opinion)
Technique, strength, and experience all play a vital role in a evaluating a Chopper! Thanks for the comparison and analogy:thumbsup:
 
Awesome thread and cool pics. I too agree it is all in the user. Sure is neat how two blades of the same size can be so different. We need more threads like this.
 
Great post mate.

Regarding the sweet spot, it's always just a couple inches in front of the balance point. The ASHBM has a heavier handle than the 1111, thus its balance point is closer to the handle, THUS you naturally "find myself hitting further back with the Busse than the 1111".

Another thing to note is that although the MOAB will tire you out faster than say your 1111 "swing for swing", if you were chopping say a 15" diameter tree down, you would use less energy with the MOAB because you would take far less swings. The same would be true in reverse, if chopping say a 1" sapling, both would do the job in one but the MOAB would require more energy.

There's lots to think about with choppers. Sometimes I feel like a crazy knife nut scientist out in the woods conducting my own little expirements LOL :D
 
Forgot I took a video, this was towards the end, so after the 1111's turn, fatigue was starting to play a factor. You can see my cows mouth was too narrow on the second cut, and my hits were getting sloppy. Still, the Mistress made up for that and the final cuts were as or more deep.
Also, how satisfying is the sound the ASHBM makes? :D
 
Speed and weight
And geometry,, speed and weight on a thick obtuse edge won't get you anywhere fast. You kind of just smash the wood particles, rather than biting deep into it ;)

I don't think that necessarily translates to "a thick knife isn't as sharp as a dull one" either. As you can see above, a thicker, heavier blade out performed a thinner one, because it had the geometry for the weight to act on.
Look at the video of Rob Stanley's video of his Moab slicing a tomato.. thick knife, super sharp geometry.
 
Forgot I took a video, this was towards the end, so after the 1111's turn, fatigue was starting to play a factor. You can see my cows mouth was too narrow on the second cut, and my hits were getting sloppy. Still, the Mistress made up for that and the final cuts were as or more deep.
Also, how satisfying is the sound the ASHBM makes? :D
Use your hips, son! Makes a world of difference :thumbsup:
 
Great pics and video mate. Those ASHBMs are certainly impressive choppers. Love the look of your 1111 too, nice job!
 
Great pics and video mate. Those ASHBMs are certainly impressive choppers. Love the look of your 1111 too, nice job!
High praise coming from you Rob, your videos and pics are always inspiring and motivating to get out and beat on these blades, cheers!
 
Interesting read, thank you for posting. I have been really into reading about and learning about blade Geometry. Now I am tinkering and making some blades for myself, it really opens your eyes in noticing said geometry. Whereas before I only checked the sharpness of a blade. I have noticed that if the geometry is good, even a dull blade cuts well. I guess it goes back to the foundation holds the house up. Without a good foundation or geometry in this case, the house falls or is unstable.
 
Whereas before I only checked the sharpness of a blade. I have noticed that if the geometry is good, even a dull blade cuts well. I guess it goes back to the foundation holds the house up. Without a good foundation or geometry in this case, the house falls or is unstable.
Great point, in the past I've experienced chopping with knives that were hair popping sharp,, but jut weren't biting that deep,, they almost bounced off even. Great analogy :thumbsup:
 
Great thread. I love content like this.

As a side question how much doesna stripped (or satin) blade compare to coated ones. Like if you had two identical choppers one coated and one not how much difference does the coating make? I would assume rougher pebbled coatings have more negative effect.
 
Great thread. I love content like this.

As a side question how much doesna stripped (or satin) blade compare to coated ones. Like if you had two identical choppers one coated and one not how much difference does the coating make? I would assume rougher pebbled coatings have more negative effect.
I'd argue the difference is pretty minimal, depending on the coating.
If the knife has good geometry, I don't think a coating would hinder it enough that you would notice. I could be wrong though
 
Interesting to know. So are so many people stripping their knives for aesthetic reasons alone?
 
Interesting to know. So are so many people stripping their knives for aesthetic reasons alone?
I know I did. I remember actually posting a question along time ago about if the performance gained by stripping SR 101, would outweigh the loss of corrosion prevention. Most people seem to think you wouldn't gain enough performance to merit losing the corrosion resistance.
I just like the look of bare steel, and have yet to have any rusting issues that would make me regret stripping.
 
Great thread. Glad that regrind worked out for you. Looks like I'll be saving my pennies for an 1111, 1311, or ASHBM with no choil. Maybe next year. Haha.
 
The regrind on that 1111 looks great.

I should have held onto the ASHBM I had. Although it needed a g10 to micarta swap. Have to put that chopper on the want list.
 
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