Firestarters

J

Jimbo

Joined
Aug 10, 1999
Messages
546
I've just posted in the Gerber Strike force thread that I have some students preparing a report on firestarters. We'll be putting up a page on what they find with pictures, sizes weights, ease of use, durability, etc.

So:

1. What firestarters would you like added?
2. What natural tinders would you like added to the test?
3. Other related questions/requests? Mine would be the question of why ferrocerium rods are round. Since so far we are finding that the thicker the rods the easier it is for complete newcomers to start a flame - simply due to size of the spark - it appears to me that a rectangular cross section would give the same effect in a lighter rod.
4. Just what sort of durability test would you want to see before getting a Blastmatch, Strike force, or other types with plastic fittings?

Any ideas welcome.

Jimbo
 
1 --

Doan tool and other mag. firestarters
'plain' ferrocerium rods
strike force/blast match
Boy Scout (Very small, keychain size) ferro- rod


2-- Sapwood shavings, birch bark, rodent nests, plus other shavings/bark/fuzzes

3-- Add flint & steel and friction methods

4-- used vigorously and dropped on hard ice
at -40F.
 
Hi Jimbo,

Please add the Spark-Lite firestarter "package" to your tests, I have emailed with the inventor Oak Norton and I have one of those military Spark-lite firestarters and it amazes me each time that with one or two quick rolls of the wheel I lite the included firetab.

I also would like you to test "Maya" wood sticks. This pine wood contains about 80% resin instead of the normal 20-30% and is harvested in I think Guatemala in a workers friendly project.
The Maya sticks are sold bundled with about 12 sticks (6-7 inches long) and consists of split "pinewood".

You can soak that stuff for days and it will start burning after a scrape on the firesteel.
Just scrape/slice some very thin pieces form the Maya wood and light it.
For the Catholics under us when it burns it smells like the burning of resin in church (at least in Holland they do that).

Cheers,

Bagheera

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[This message has been edited by Bagheera (edited 02-09-2000).]
 
I'd like to second the spark-lite as an addition to the test. As for durability, students generally manage to test that all on their own. I'm looking forward to reading your findings.
 
I don't want to sound facetious, but I always wanted to know how common fire starters like disposable butane lighters and waterproof matches compare to the exotic sparking things. I'm talking about a comparison of durability, ease of use, and actual fire starting in field conditions.

I carry a milspec magnesium block with sparking insert in my pack as a third back-up source of ignition, but honestly I use the tiny Bic lighters I sprinkle in the many pockets of my clothes and pack or matches to start fires outdoors. I know butane can freeze and the lighter mechanism can break and that even waterproof matches can get soaked, but they sure work most of the time. I wonder if, say, the average hiker would be better served with a couple of handfuls of matches or two or three lighters instead of a sparking device. Just a thought.
 
A bunch of matches, if dropped in water, quickly lose effectiveness. Waterproofing them will definately help, but under abusive, wet conditions, I still have a not insignificant number of waxed matches get wet enough to not work. While they work, they are very easy and useful though.

Lighters can break, and run out of fuel (A problem I'm more concerned with. My Zippo eats a fair amount of fuel, and needs to be checked regularly to be relied on). And when broken, or out of fuel, they are of little value. And a Zippo style can lose effectiveness to water.

Contrast this to any one of the ferrocerium gadgets, be they the plain rods that Greg likes, or the nifty 'point and shoot' (Like a (P)ush (h)ere (D)ummy camera) types. You could take a hammer to one of these, while soaking it in boiling water, and in the end, you could pick up the pieces, apply your knife, and get a spark.

This is not in any way to say that matches are useless. I will still carry a lighter, and reach for it first to start a fire. But if I have to carry a backup, I would sure like it to be more reliable than the one that broke and forced me to my backup. And the only thing more reliable than a ferro rod is knowing how to make fire with a bow and drill out of found materials. Even the fancy gadgets have the same material inside. And if bad comes to worse, you can break open the case, and pull out the rod. And even a sharp rock can make a spark on it then.


Stryver
 
Thanks for the input guys!

We've already broken a ferrocerium stick! That point about dropping when conditions are cold is pretty important Stryver! I would never have considered a stick actually breaking... we also managed to "break" the Coglan's magnesium block fire starter. The ferrocerium stick fell out when dropped (but didn't break). The glue doesn't work too well in cold conditions it would appear.
We'll be doing some work with "real" flint later. A lot depends on materials so other than a basic introduction I don't think that will tell too much. So far in my search for the "tinder fungus" (inonotus obliquus) I'm running birch trees 1000 - Jimbo zero. I've never seen so many healthy trees. Obviously if I find that stuff - which is supposed to light with a spark from natural flint - I'll be dancing down the creek beds in my caulked boots watching for sparks from rocks to find some good ones.

Bagheera - I'll look into getting a Spark-Lite. For a start we'll be looking at how well a regular disposable lighter without butane works. I imagine this is very similar to the Spark-Lite. I have found that the spark from a disposable lighter will easily start a fire tab - or any prepared tinder. Using natural tinders takes a lot more skill and work.
I'm not sure where to find the "Maya" wood sticks. I have resin collected from spruce and balsam fir to start. Resin needs to be incorporated with a tinder so it'll be interesting to see how the students figure to do that. There's still a lot of snow here so getting pitch wood from a rotten stump will be difficult for a while. I bring in stuff to get the students started but then they have to collect their own materials.

Hazardous - feel free to use whatever you want - but there are advantages to ferrocerium rods such as being able to count on them. I ran out of fuel in my lighter last summer and raided my buddy's match safe - only to find he was carrying safety matches in it.


At this point I don't know where the project will lead other than to provide pictures of tinder and the trees it was prepared from, and of course the various fire starters, their effectiveness in starting a flame and durability.
As of today we have:
1. Measured size and weight of fire starters for comparison.
2. Tested on various sized shreddings of cedar and birch bark - to get a feel for use.
3. Torture tested fire starters with 100 2metre drops onto concrete. The pictures of the damage done have been photographed. For those who want to know right now:
Strike Force showed very minor - hardly noticeable cosmetic damage.
The blastmatch cracked the cover (considered cosmetic) but the striker fell out. It was possible to reassemble and use it - having found the tiny striker bar.
The magnesium fire starter lost the ferrrocerium rod on the first drop. Nothing broken - just poor glue. If yours is attached on the outside of pack or person, you might want to superglue.
The breakage of a "Camper's Village rod was considered a fluke - but they do break. The ferrocerium is a powdered compressed rod so testing would only show flaws in the rod that is actually being tested.

Tomorrow we test the fire starters on various sized shreddings of cedar bark, and on standard shavings of kiln dried softwood. Manmade tinders are soaking in water for later test. Wednesday we should collect samples of various barks and resins. With pictures you should be able to see what is being done.

I have ordered a couple of 4" rods from Greg, and am looking into getting a Spark-Lite. The larger metal matches in Canada are not available since the store has to order 500 minimum. I'll be reclaiming my tiny Coglan's Tinder kit from a friend to add to tests and be looking into getting scouts metal matches. All in all it's coming together.

Jimbo

 
I just carry several Bic disposable lighters. I've never had one leak or break. They are water proof. When they run out of butane you can still use the sparking element. What has worked for me in place of butane is dandelion fluff bundled around the striker.

[This message has been edited by Jeff Clark (edited 02-10-2000).]
 
Hi Jeff:

I'd agree to some extent - lighters have served me well for many years. It's also no big trick to use one without butane to light a cotton Q tip, or a piece of lamp wick. They sure aren't waterproof though as a simple test will show.
The problem where I live is the dampness - it takes a lot to get tinder going. Add to that the fact that I'll be most desperate to light a fire fast after taking a soaking. The last time I was in such a situation a backup match safe saved the day - the lighters were unusable.
I've come to respect the capabilities of firestarters after testing. I guess what convinced me is that they are 100% dependable and once you find the right one they are good for most of a lifetime - good value.

Anyway I had thought of a test for people here to see how a lighter without fuel makes out with natural tinders. How would you like to start a thread?

Jimbo
 
I have a couple of comments and questions, after reading this very interesting thread.

1 - Without having a Spark-lite or going back to www.equipped.com to read about it, it is my impression that it is heavier duty than a normal lighter and thus throws a bigger spark.

2- Some fancier lighters have piezo electric quartz sparkers. The spark seems very small. Has anyone ever tried them with tinder?

3- Matches: One problem with safety matches, i.e. those without a self-igniter/ strike anywhere head, is that even if the match is waterproof the striker is not. A good example are the lifeboat matches which a hard to light, even though they burn great. Thus, even if you have matches, a metal match is handy to light the match. [I recall trying this once and it worked, but some further trials would be warranted before relying on this.]

3 - Has anyone noticed any difference from one brand of metal match to another in sparking ability? I have used the "Greg" match
smile.gif
and a BlastMatch and they are both good, but I have never sat down with several types and tried to see if they were more or less the same in the amount of spark they put out.
 
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