Folders: Tolerance VS Maintenance?

timberweasel

timberweasel

Joined
Jan 5, 2011
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So, you've got yourself a high-precision cutting tool. Do those tight tolerances mean more maintenance? Will a little pocket lint and/or everyday detritus have a greater negative impact on the action compared to folders with higher (perhaps more forgiving) tolerances? Do you find that the low tolerance actually keeps dirt and grit out of the pivot? How often are you dismantling your low-tolerance folders? Is there really a Santa Claus? And why can't I has a cookie? :D

So many questions... :o

-Timber
 
The only folder I have with really tight tolerances is a sebenza, and no I don't find that I have to clean it more often. I rarely have to dismantle it, maybe once a month, but that is more because I like to clean it than it needs it. Santa isn't real, and you can't have cookies because I ate them all already.
 
Honestly, I don't d/a any of my folders for cleaning anymore unless they demand it. 'Course, I use small FBs now for most EDC work, but I do carry a small WC Sebenza for using in front of people who are scared of sharp, pointy things. For a while I used to d/a my Sebenzas and Striders when it was new to me and something wonderful, but I discovered after 3 or 4 times that there wasn't any need to keep doing that because there wasn't anything in the spaces that needed to be cleaned. I keep my folders blown out with air and I don't carry anything but a knife in my knife pocket, so they don't have a hard life even getting used for warehouse, garden, and woods chores.

I also took apart a Spyderco Caly 3 one day after about a year of carry and use to see how things looked in the washerless pivot area. There was nothing in there except a little CRK grease left from when I removed the blade and added the grease just after I got it. No lint, no dirt, no cookie crumbs.

Nowadays, unless the knife tells me she wants to be taken apart and cleaned up, I do other things with my time.
 
Thanks for the responses. I just picked up my first CRK recently and I've found some finely compacted... er... pocket snot (lint, dust, dirt, etc.) wedged between the frame and lock-bar a few times. Same goes for around the pivot. This debris is almost thread-like and pretty much needs to be plucked out of the knife with tweezers. Weird. Maybe it's just the factory gunk.
 
timberweasel said:
Thanks for the responses. I just picked up my first CRK recently and I've found some finely compacted... er... pocket snot (lint, dust, dirt, etc.) wedged between the frame and lock-bar a few times. Same goes for around the pivot. This debris is almost thread-like and pretty much needs to be plucked out of the knife with tweezers. Weird. Maybe it's just the factory gunk.
Click to expand...

Seems like pocket lint accounts for most of the debris I find in my folders (mostly traditional styles). The fibers are very, very fine, and they do seem to get into every nook & cranny. Opening/closing always seems to slow down, if that lint starts accumulating too much. Whatever oil/lube is used, I'm sure that contributes to how much gets collected.

Regarding tight tolerances in knives, it can be a very narrow transition from 'too loose' to 'just right' to 'too tight'. On the one hand, tolerances tight enough to give that 'bank vault door' impression might seem the ultimate in build quality. But, sometimes when they're that tight, some additional effort is needed to keep things working smoothly. If the oil or other lube begins to dry, or gets just a little dirty & sticky, a really tightly-fit knife may become difficult to open/close properly. I have a custom traditional trapper-style folder (2 blades) which initially seemed to have that 'bank vault door' feel to it, which was great. I have noticed though, as the oil dries a little bit, it has become very stiff to open. This is further complicated by the small & shallow nail nicks on the blades, which will break a nail if opening is very stiff. I used some isopropyl alcohol to flush out the joints & seams in it, and noticed that the alcohol actually pooled in the blade well, without leaking out between the backspring & liners; it's really that tight, and in this case, perhaps a little 'too tight'.
 
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timberweasel said:
So, you've got yourself a high-precision cutting tool. Do those tight tolerances mean more maintenance? Will a little pocket lint and/or everyday detritus have a greater negative impact on the action compared to folders with higher (perhaps more forgiving) tolerances? Do you find that the low tolerance actually keeps dirt and grit out of the pivot? How often are you dismantling your low-tolerance folders? Is there really a Santa Claus? And why can't I has a cookie? :D

So many questions... :o

-Timber
Click to expand...

I am a sebenza guy when it comes to tolerances. I bought my brother a Regular Plain Sebenza back when they still offered them direct. He is not a maintenance guy. That sebenza has been all over the world mainly performing field research work near on or the sea. It has NEVER gotten anything into the pivot. The same goes for my senenzas. When you talk of tight tolerances they REALLY have to be spot on for the entire surface of the pivot or it will not matter. Take a slipjoint that may have a tight pivot but an uneven ground tang...crud will still get between the tang and liners where the surfacing is off.

So yes, a truly precise folder is a big time no maintenance tool. My brothers has NEVER been taken apart and or cleaned.

I don't make any money promoting the sebenza, so please take this for what it is. Honest experience.

Kevin
 
timberweasel said:
Thanks for the responses. I just picked up my first CRK recently and I've found some finely compacted... er... pocket snot (lint, dust, dirt, etc.) wedged between the frame and lock-bar a few times. Same goes for around the pivot. This debris is almost thread-like and pretty much needs to be plucked out of the knife with tweezers. Weird. Maybe it's just the factory gunk.
Click to expand...

Talking about lint around the pivot is silly IMO because the tolerances are all about the handle scale, bushing, washer, blade tang fit.
 
richstag said:
Talking about lint around the pivot is silly IMO because the tolerances are all about the handle scale, bushing, washer, blade tang fit.
Click to expand...

Well, it is said there are no stupid questions, just stupid people. Thanks for taking the time to enlighten me; I reckon I feel a little more educated. Just never seen a knife compact pocket debris like my Sebenza seems to do (unless I got some mystery junk in it somehow.)
 
I did not mean it was a stupid question or that you are a stupid person. I guess I jumped a little because I get tired of people writing off a well built knife as a novelty.

I have lots and lots of folders and the sebenza is one of the very very few that has absolutely spot on tolerances where it matters. Collecting a lot of pocket lint? Well, they do have grease in and most likely all around the pivot from the factory. The best thing I can suggest is to disassemble and completely clean EVERYTHING with a strong degreaser. Put just enough lube for proper lubrication and absolutely no more. Keep the knife like this and pocket lint will no longer have so many greasy areas to stick to. I can't tell you pocket lint never got into a sebenza of mine or my brothers, but keeping it clean and grease free is the best route.

You can burry a sebenza in the sand and work the action with out any problem. That is from personal experience too.

Kevin
 
I most certainly agree, Kevin. The Sebenza is no joke. It is a truly beautiful knife--very well built. No gritty action at all. I was a little concerned that the rolled lint might wind around the pivot somehow or get stuck in the lock-bar. Perhaps I'm being way too preemptive or analytical of this observation--haven't owned a CRK caliber knife before. Plus, as with all new knives, I'm sure it has some excess factory grease to work out. I'll be patient... :o

Thanks!

-Brett
 
You are welcome. If you do not want to break it down you can use a little windex on a q-tip to clean around the tang of the blade. Windex is about the least harsh degreaser that is effective. Rubbing alcohol and acetone also work well, but you have to be more careful using them all the time. The best way is to break them down new, but learning the tricks to proper assembly can be a learning curve in itself. There is a great tutorial on the CRK forum if you have not seen it yet.

It really works. I can not blame you for wanting to keep lint out of your knife. There is an old timer in the tradtional section that is always giving out common sense hints. One of them being to wash your pants with the pockets out :)

Kevin
 
richstag said:
(...) I can not blame you for wanting to keep lint out of your knife. There is an old timer in the tradtional section that is always giving out common sense hints. One of them being to wash your pants with the pockets out :)

Kevin
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention this! It is an old habit of mine to do just that! Too many pocketables have gone through the laundry to do otherwise... :D Even so, I still clean out ordinary crud from my folders. Part of the routine, I suppose. Never seen the finer, almost hair-like, threads sticking out before like on the Sebbie. At least the crud seems to be pushing away from the pivot so far. Just struck me as odd...

Cheers (and thanks for the tips!)
 
Also, one tip for assembling that was not mentioned was the proper torque I found for the bolts. When you use the supplied allen key, place the long section into the allen bolt and twist tight with the short section of the L. Tightening until the allen key just starts to flex is enough. This will give you enough even torque that when you loosen them you will hear that pop. This was explained to me to be a cause of the steel used for the bolts/pins and how they lock to each other on the threads.
 
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