Forge questions

B

blackgrub0331

Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Messages
72
I have seen how to make a forge and I also know of one place to get the stuff you need to make it. What I would like to know is there anything out there that can read the temp in the forge so you can get a more accurate temp for your metal?

I'm looking at doing the fire brick forge to start out with or do the coffee can forge.
 
blackgrub, I would guess that they do make something that would read that high of temp. but would be very expensive. The best way is to learn to judge the different colors of the hot metal, black heat,dull red,blood red,dark cherry,med cherry and on up to light yellow. Most blacksmithing and bladesmithing books have this info or you can buy a bunch of different tempstiks. They look sorta like crayons and come in different temps you touch them to the hot metal and they melt at a certain temp,but they also can get expensive.......Stuart
 
I would really recommend a thermocouple and temp comtroller. You can find them on ebay for around $40. It makes a huge difference especially when you heat treat. i finally set mine up after 14 years, i really like it. I can controll it manually for HT. I just sit nest to the forge and turn on and off the propane to maintain the heat. take a look at them, I connot recommend it enough.

Chuck
 
Add a solenoid valve to the gas line and connect it to the controller.It will turn the gas on and off for you.
Stacy
 
The solenoid valve is the next step, I had to try out the sensor first. But it still is really easy to control. I can run it from 1300 to 2499f. Really neat to see the difference the fule mix makes in the temp. I usually use the torch method to HT. I am really interested in Hamon Development and the better control is required.

Chuck
 
A C Richards said:
I would really recommend a thermocouple and temp comtroller. You can find them on ebay for around $40. It makes a huge difference especially when you heat treat. i finally set mine up after 14 years, i really like it. I can controll it manually for HT. I just sit nest to the forge and turn on and off the propane to maintain the heat. take a look at them, I connot recommend it enough.

Chuck
Click to expand...
I would agree that the thermocouple/temp controller is extremely nice for heat treating. I have six working on salt pots and kilns around the shop with three more units on the shelf for future applications/replacement.

I can't imagine why you'd run one on your main forge, though. It's easy enough to judge the temp by sight for forging and welding.

You might say that you want to use the forge for heat treating, but if you're making a forge and have a controller, just make a salt pot too. It's more accurate, more even heat, no scaling. Salt pots open the door to some very interesting HT options.
 
JCaswell said:
I would agree that the thermocouple/temp controller is extremely nice for heat treating. I have six working on salt pots and kilns around the shop with three more units on the shelf for future applications/replacement.

I can't imagine why you'd run one on your main forge, though. It's easy enough to judge the temp by sight for forging and welding.

You might say that you want to use the forge for heat treating, but if you're making a forge and have a controller, just make a salt pot too. It's more accurate, more even heat, no scaling. Salt pots open the door to some very interesting HT options.
Click to expand...

How much do the salt pots cost? Also what do they look like I've searched the net for them but no photo.
 
I'm not sure if salt pots are the best consideration for new guys like you and me, blackgrub0331... there's no doubt that they are great for the level of control they offer, but they're also incredibly dangerous in the hands of those less experienced (such as myself)!
 
MrPurple said:
I'm not sure if salt pots are the best consideration for new guys like you and me, blackgrub0331... there's no doubt that they are great for the level of control they offer, but they're also incredibly dangerous in the hands of those less experienced (such as myself)!
Click to expand...

Forgive my lack of knowlage but why is this?

Also other then Ellis where are some good places to buy stuff to make a forge?

Here are a few forges I've seen that look easy and cheap to make

IMG_58.jpg


IMG_25.jpg


IMG_70.jpg


Found them all and a little info on how to make them at http://refractory.elliscustomknifeworks.com/
 
Salt pots introduce certain risks, but in practice, I haven't found them to be more dangerous than any number of things we do making knives. If you understand what's going on, you can use them very safely.

The technology might sound intimidating, but it's really just a forge with a tube in it full of salt (a controller really helps with convenience). Check out Don Fogg's site for tutorial on construction one (with controller).
 
Just like learning anything , salt pots have used in industry for years.

Most folks are scared of propane forges tooo :p
Mike has some good info check out his grinder plans too:D
 
Sweany said:
Just like learning anything , salt pots have used in industry for years.

Most folks are scared of propane forges tooo :p
Mike has some good info check out his grinder plans too:D
Click to expand...


Well I'll have to check his site out. Does anyone know it off hand or can I just run a search on his name?
 
I understand voltmeters can be used as pyrometers too, you just need a thermocouple and a chart that translates resistance readings into temperature values. Most ceramic supply companies now have reasonably priced hand held pyrometers that work in the temperature ranges we use. The contollers from eBay previously mentioned can be cheaper and that is the route I took, using one just as a pyrometer for checking temps. The thermocouples themselves are consumables however but decent 3/16" to 1/4" type-K inconel probes at $30.00 to $40.00 a pop hold up for a good long while if you don't abuse them too much. Sticking mine in the hottest zone of a smelter for reducing iron ore to steel shortened the life of one of mine greatly! If you go looking for thermocouple wire online (or thermocouples either for that matter) don't be surprised at the mind boggling numbers of varieties available. Before I was given some actual thermocouple wire I used some all copper speaker wire with little difference in the readings. It has to be all copper though! It's important that the resistance of the two wires match so you don't want a silver colored wire and a copper colored wire.
 
How about a non-contact themometer? I've seen handheld units (the laser aimed, type unit) for relatively cheap. Question is how accurate are they, and I imagine a unit with the high temp rang3e might be more pricey.

Syn
 
synghyn said:
How about a non-contact themometer? I've seen handheld units (the laser aimed, type unit) for relatively cheap. Question is how accurate are they, and I imagine a unit with the high temp rang3e might be more pricey.

Syn
Click to expand...
I haven't seen one of these that will go above 500F. They may exist, but I'd bet they'd by pretty expensive if they do.

I've 'graduated' to 3/8 inch thermocouplers for my salt pots. I find they last much longer than the 1/4 inch variety.

The big advantage of using a process controller with your HT set up is that it will 'tend' your project, maintaining temp within your preset range so you don't have to worry about it. It's the brains of the operation, tripping your electric solenoid as described above. They're well well worth the money --- especially if you can pick up a nice used one. Just make sure you get (or can get) a manual. I like the Watlow 93, 94, 98 models, but have used others. The simple process controllers is all you need, though.
 
Another thing a controller will do is save propane! With the controller set at ,say 1800F, you aren't running the gas constantly to keep it there.Most people run the forge way too hot when forging anyway.You don't burn up the steel as bad with the temp set right.
Stacy
 
Heh, yeah they do, I just looked at some. Industrial model, good up to appr. 5600 degrees, problem is it cost like a grand per degree. Actually I saw $2400-7500, way out of the ballpark!.

Alright so the thermocouples your referring to, I know what it is and all that, but not the specific type to look for. Any more specific info? Or even a link, ebay or what not? For me it would be for an in forge application, not salt pots as yet.

Syn
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top