Found a USA-made Schrade Buck knockoff with a broken tip - any tips on restoration?

[Hashishiin]

https://imgur.com/a/DOQCOsL

https://imgur.com/a/bY1ayJd

So, this is my perfect opportunity to do a knife restoration. I noticed the rust is a bit hard to just flitz off, any recs on what to use to up the ante with that? I do not have a grinder or power tools, but I do have a 50 grit "Beast" stone for a recently-purchased KME, and I would imagine that it would be useful... taking down the spine, to meet the tip? I intend to draw it out in sharpie, but that is what I'll have to do, I'm guessing. Barkeeper's Friend for the bolsters/OT logo, used some Bronzeall or somethign on some copper and the patina came straight back, so clearly that isn't the right stuff to use. What about that paint about the front of the Old Timer logo, you think some nail varnish may do the trick on that? I'm not sure what the handle material is.

Any other tips, comments, whatever, greatly appreciated! I understand this knife was made from 1995-2005 I think, or could it be older than that? I think there's still probably a great, usable, functional knife here, the lock is perfect, it still has a little bit of edge, even. This is absolutely awesome, I was so happy when I went to see my mother and she says "Hey, did you break a knife or something, because I found this in a box..." and I'm like, whoooo, USA-made Schrade, I always wanted some of this! This will be my first knife restoration, and my first re-grind of this type.

I wonder if whatever relative owned this was screwdriving or prying with it, to break it. Any guesses on that, too, just for fun? Thanks for any help!

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

For the amount of grinding needing to be done without power tools, to take the spine down to intersect the cutting edge, nothing will will work as quickly as a LONG length of very coarse abrasive. I've liked using coarse sander/grinder belts in zirconia-alumina grit for this (I used 3" x 21" belt at 120-grit), cut at the diagonal seam in the belt and affixed flat to a hard backing (bench/tabletop, plank of hardwood, etc). The belts can be bought inexpensively at the home center and work very well, used in this manner.

With a small stone such as is used for a guided sharpening system, even the very coarsest stones will be very limited in working speed because each grinding pass is very short and a lot of focus is needed to keep from running off the end or the edges of the stone, which inhibits speed, use of pressure and fluidity of motion. But with a longer & wider stretch of very coarse abrasive, it becomes much easier to utilize some pressure and allows for much more fluidity and speed in each grinding pass, and the metal gets hogged off much, much more quickly. Any belt in the 50-120 grit range should work for this.

It looks like your blade is marked 'SCHRADE+' on the tang. If so, that '+' symbol after 'SCHRADE' indicates it's stainless steel - that's how Schrade stamped their stainless blades. That'll either be 440A in Schrade's older stainless blades, or perhaps 420HC in relatively recent stainless from them, before they went out of business. The Bar Keepers Friend product works pretty well for cleaning up rust on stainless blades, by making a paste of the powder with some water and applying it to the rusty portions. Let it sit for 60 seconds and then rinse it off, maybe doing a little scrubbing as well.

I'd think the paint on the handle should come off with some paint thinner or mineral spirits and maybe some scrubbing.

 

[gentleman_edc]

You could use this as an excuse to buy a bench grinder or bench sander from Harbor freight Or maybe a Ken Onion Worksharp.

As obbsessed with edges mentions, a :LONG course stone/surface would be best. Course sandpaper on a flat surface can work (sandpaper designed for wet use and keep it wet, is how I would start, if you don't want to invest in a power option).

 

[Hashishiin]

For the amount of grinding needing to be done without power tools, to take the spine down to intersect the cutting edge, nothing will will work as quickly as a LONG length of very coarse abrasive. I've liked using coarse sander/grinder belts in zirconia-alumina grit for this (I used 3" x 21" belt at 120-grit), cut at the diagonal seam in the belt and affixed flat to a hard backing (bench/tabletop, plank of hardwood, etc). The belts can be bought inexpensively at the home center and work very well, used in this manner.

With a small stone such as is used for a guided sharpening system, even the very coarsest stones will be very limited in working speed because each grinding pass is very short and a lot of focus is needed to keep from running off the end or the edges of the stone, which inhibits speed, use of pressure and fluidity of motion. But with a longer & wider stretch of very coarse abrasive, it becomes much easier to utilize some pressure and allows for much more fluidity and speed in each grinding pass, and the metal gets hogged off much, much more quickly. Any belt in the 50-120 grit range should work for this.

It looks like your blade is marked 'SCHRADE+' on the tang. If so, that '+' symbol after 'SCHRADE' indicates it's stainless steel - that's how Schrade stamped their stainless blades. That'll either be 440A in Schrade's older stainless blades, or perhaps 420HC in relatively recent stainless from them, before they went out of business. The Bar Keepers Friend product works pretty well for cleaning up rust on stainless blades, by making a paste of the powder with some water and applying it to the rusty portions. Let it sit for 60 seconds and then rinse it off, maybe doing a little scrubbing as well.

I'd think the paint on the handle should come off with some paint thinner or mineral spirits and maybe some scrubbing.

Great tips all around but especially the part about the belts on a plank, that's really going to help out, thanks!

Yes indeed it is a +, good to have it narrowed down, either way though, I hear good things about the steel coming from these when it was manufactured in USA!

You could use this as an excuse to buy a bench grinder or bench sander from Harbor freight Or maybe a Ken Onion Worksharp.

As obbsessed with edges mentions, a :LONG course stone/surface would be best. Course sandpaper on a flat surface can work (sandpaper designed for wet use and keep it wet, is how I would start, if you don't want to invest in a power option).

Dude, that is an awesome idea, I was just at HF looking at some cheap tools to get me started on a home workshop.

 

[Triple_D]

If you use a grinder or belt sander, don't let the blade get hot, so as not to screw up the hardening of the steel. I'd go with small amounts of grinding/sanding, and then dunk the blade in some water to keep it cool. It will take la little while, but patience will pay off.

Just my humble opinion.....

 

[Hashishiin]

If you use a grinder or belt sander, don't let the blade get hot, so as not to screw up the hardening of the steel. I'd go with small amounts of grinding/sanding, and then dunk the blade in some water to keep it cool. It will take la little while, but patience will pay off.

Just my humble opinion.....

Oh, as I said, I have no power tools yet, but thank you for this advice as I was considering my first sander! I was under the impression that you should also pour water on the wheel as you grind it, is this right, or will this mess up the average grinder?

Totally new to grinders, by the way, just barely had the idea to try a basic HF one, if not, the idea is to grind it using a length of coarse belt attached to a wood base and grind it down by hand! You are right, I do not wanna mess up the heat treat.

 

[Triple_D]

I was under the impression that you should also pour water on the wheel as you grind it, is this right, or will this mess up the average grinder?

A typical single speed bench grinder is cruising along at something like 3000 RPMs, so I don't think you could pour water over the wheel without spraying it everywhere. I guess if you get one with variable speed, that will go slow enough, you could try it, but that still seems like that would make a big mess. I ground a new profile on a SAK blade using a "regular" bench grinder (dry), and didn't have any problems. But I removed very little material with each pass, while reshaping the blade, and cooled the blade in a cup of water, often. Once I got it to the shape I wanted, I moved over to my bench stones to sharpen it by hand. I had a picture of it, but seem to have lost it somehow.

I've also reshaped a hand plane blade the same way, using the bench grinder and sharpening stones. I picked the hand plane up used, off of eBay, and the blade needed a fair amount of work.

 

[bayouace]

Get a bench grinder. You'll use it again and again.

 

[catspa]

I set mine up with a 80 grit aluminum oxide wheel on the right and a wire wheel on the left. If you can put a C-clamp on the tool rest as a blade stop, you can mist water from a squirt bottle with your other hand, but starting out it’s easier to have a helper do it. Grind with a light touch, practice on some old screwdriver or door hinge first to get the feel for your wheel and how fast it heats up.

You can also make your own grinder from a double shaft 1725 rpm 4-pole motor and a couple shaft adapters. Running slower helps delay overheating.

Parker

PS: the Schrade LB-7 wasn’t really a Buck knock-off, but a legitimate folding hunter model of their own. It has subtle shape and dimensional differences, and by the 90s Buck didn’t really have a lock on the folding hunter market any more. Case made a couple, I think Camillus did also, and others. By then the folding hunter was a distinct pattern, like the stockman or Barlow, IMHO.

 

[Hashishiin]

I set mine up with a 80 grit aluminum oxide wheel on the right and a wire wheel on the left. If you can put a C-clamp on the tool rest as a blade stop, you can mist water from a squirt bottle with your other hand, but starting out it’s easier to have a helper do it. Grind with a light touch, practice on some old screwdriver or door hinge first to get the feel for your wheel and how fast it heats up.

You can also make your own grinder from a double shaft 1725 rpm 4-pole motor and a couple shaft adapters. Running slower helps delay overheating.

Parker

PS: the Schrade LB-7 wasn’t really a Buck knock-off, but a legitimate folding hunter model of their own. It has subtle shape and dimensional differences, and by the 90s Buck didn’t really have a lock on the folding hunter market any more. Case made a couple, I think Camillus did also, and others. By then the folding hunter was a distinct pattern, like the stockman or Barlow, IMHO.

Thank you for this reply, I did not know it was it's own thing! I thought all of those "folding hunters" were just versions of Buck's thing, even if quality made. The more you know, huh? Glad to find this out.

Going to the store right now actually for some low-grit alum. belt and Barkeepers Friend to get this going.

 

[Hashishiin]

Still thinking about getting a cheap bench grinder, but I got this stuff, just a bunch of general stuff I'm gonna need, at Home Depot, gonna make another trip to HF, but this covers the basics of this project, I think, right? I got 36 and 120 grit sandpaper. I just hope this paint remover stuff isn't harsh enough to damage the handle material. Does anyone know the handle material?

https://imgur.com/a/CvgbAG7

good advice

Thank you again for the wood and belts idea, I would be grinding away with the 50 grit if it wasn't for that tip.

 

[gentleman_edc]

You've got some time to start sharpening and give us a report.

 

[Hashishiin]

Yup! Right now, reading some instructions and gluing my grinding stick together, don't wanna grind rust off all on myself. First time with the Barkeeper's Friend powder.

 

[Bill DeShivs]

NEVER PUT WATER ON A COMMERCIAL BENCH GRINDER STONE WHEEL! THE STONE CAN EXPLODE!
A bench grinder is a pretty crude tool to use on knives. Maybe a Harbor Freight 1 X 30 belt grinder is what you need.

 

[Hashishiin]

NEVER PUT WATER ON A COMMERCIAL BENCH GRINDER STONE WHEEL! THE STONE CAN EXPLODE!
A bench grinder is a pretty crude tool to use on knives. Maybe a Harbor Freight 1 X 30 belt grinder is what you need.

Oh, yeah, that was what I was referring to. The HF grinder. I don't have access to any grinder, but good to know! I did not know the stone could explode, what does that?

 

[Hickory n steel]

Does anyone know the handle material?

The scales are saw cut delrin, it's a good durable economical material

Good luck on this Schrade , you've really got your work cut out for you.
I would likely just sharpen it as is and toss it on the work bench, but I don't really know why.
I can see a lot of possibilities here.


Btw do you have access to at least a drill ?
There are small grinding wheels and sanding drums you can get for a drill, that might help to speed the process along a bit then you can finish with the sanding board.
Just keep a cup of water on hand

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Yes, the handle is a delrin-like material - Schrade had a different name for it, but I don't recall what that was at the moment. For the paint on it, a little scrubbing with the paint thinner or mineral spirits could do the trick, or maybe even with some WD-40, depending on the type of paint. The one thing you need to be careful about with delrin-type handles is with heat. If buffing it with powered tools & a cotton wheel, it can melt very quickly if lingering in one spot with the buffing wheel longer than a second or two. So I'd avoid doing that. But it should hold up well enough to paint thinner or mineral spirits - it's pretty resistant to chemical exposure & solvents.

The sanding board will work faster than the abrasive drums for drills - you'll see obvious progress with metal removal after each single pass on the board. I've used the drill & sanding drum method also for smaller tip repairs, using the sanding drums with a drill press. Have to be very focused & controlled with it in contact with the spinning drum (rotating AWAY from the blade tip), else it's pretty easy to do some heavy damage and/or lose control of the blade. Also have to be more aware of heat issues, doing it that way. The sanding board, clamped to a work surface, can be used with a good deal of pressure and speed of stroke, with little/no worries about losing control of the blade. Use tip-trailing passes only, to avoid digging into the abrasive belt. For the amount of heavy damage to that blade tip, start with that 36-grit belt to reshape it. Then refine with the 120-grit, after you get close to producing a point on the tip.

 

[Bill DeShivs]

To get the tip properly shaped, you will need an abrasive wheel of some sort.
Perhaps you could use a rounded board with sandpaper, but I doubt it would come out well.
Get the cheap Harbor Freight 1 X 30 belt grinder. Use the top wheel to form the curve on the blade clip.

 

[Bill DeShivs]

Bench grinder stones are not designed to be used with water. The bonding agent could be weakened by water, and the stones very well could become out of balance with water.
Spin that at 3600 RPM and you have a disaster waiting to happen.
There are stone wheels designed for use in water, but you won't see them on bench grinders.

 

[gentleman_edc]

I didn't even think about the paint. Delrin is pretty impervious to things. I would just use a fingernail and see how far you get. Think of it as a worry stone. Eventually you will get the paint off. If not that, a plastic scraper/corner of a credit card. Those shouldn't scratch the delrin.