Frustration with a scandi

C

crbauhs

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Dec 2, 2007
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I recently bought a custom puukko that is just gorgeous. I'm a fan of the whole package. I was especially intrigued when I was told it came with a 52100 blade at 60-61 RC. Well I got the blade, took it to a zero grind, and it micro chipped like crazy all along the edge via regular use aka feather sticks, notching, and carving. And this all happened with about 3 minutes of use. By microchip I mean when it catches the lights you can see the tiny tiny tiny chips and when I run my nail down the edge I can feel the divot as well.

Thinking it might just be a bad edge, I took it back to the stones. Sharpened out the chips, stopped again, same result.

One thing I didn't want to do but decided to try was to put on a micro bevel. By micro I mean you can't see it without it catching the light. But you can feel it. So I stropped it again. Same issue. Now I prefer a zero edge and I'll have to remove a good amount of metal to get it back to flat.... Yay...

My sharpening setup is a 1000/6000 water stone. Spiders fine and ultra fine stones. Strop with green compound and .25 micron paste followed by a stop on plain leather. To make sure I wasn't crazy I carved the same wood with my stockman and had no issue as well as on my condor Woodlaw, which I haven't Sharpened nearly as well as this, and no problem. Anyone have any suggestions?
 
I would return it. That does not sound right to me at all. Doing feather sticks, notching, and carving should never EVER cause chipping even on a thin edge.
 
That was my thought as well. I am in contact with him currently explaining. With pictures. I have never bought a custom knife before so I am not sure what the etiquette is. I will attach a pic for clarification.

http://imgur.com/vomVGEd

Is Abad cell phone pic since that is the only camera that I have. It does however give you a good idea of what I am talking about.
 
The etiquette is polite emails and pictures, asking to return the knife and a refund on the knife arriving back to the seller
The knife goes well packed and registered
 
neeman said:
The etiquette is polite emails and pictures, asking to return the knife and a refund on the knife arriving back to the seller
The knife goes well packed and registered
Click to expand...

I think neeman nailed it on exactly what you should do.

That picture made me cringe. That really sucks that the edge isn't up to par. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.
 
Cryptyc said:
I think neeman nailed it on exactly what you should do.

That picture made me cringe. That really sucks that the edge isn't up to par. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.
Click to expand...

Ya that is the worst part, the rest of the blade isn't as bad but that is the most used section. The other areas are more so staggered chips that aren't like that, but still present.
 
My first question would be, why did you take a brand-new custom knife and attempt to re-grind it to such a thin zero edge? My second question is, if you wanted a zero-edge, why did you not ask the maker to provide it that way?
 
james terrio said:
My first question would be, why did you take a brand-new custom knife and attempt to re-grind it to such a thin zero edge? My second question is, if you wanted a zero-edge, why did you not ask the maker to provide it that way?
Click to expand...

Well when I bought it I was told it was zero ground. It came with a bit of a micro bevel or secondary edge. So I took it down as I was to believe it was meant to be. It wasn't that big a deal for me since I enjoy sharpening as it is.
 
What's the blade thickness & width?
e.g. 4mm thick, 12mm bevel face = 19* inclusive. Which is too thin for tasks listed. maybe mitigate deformation/chip by putting a mini/micro (0.5-1mm) bevel at 15dps.
 
I do not have calipers to measure however I was told that the angles are roughly 24 inclusive then I add in the micro bevel. I would believe that'd be enough for non hard woods. And to still chip like that... I dunno.
 
I just whittled my experimental 52100 blade (est 65rc) with 12* inclusive no micro-bevel against dry seasoned oak. Did fine until it hit a small knot resulted with one 1mm deep chip. A 2nd similar to 1st except with 1mm edge-bevel at 30* inclusive, whittled & notched dry oak fine. Without seeing your blade personally, I can only assess that your blade is brittle especially at 61rc.

* Dry seasoned/old oak is edge unfriendly.
 
Employing very thin/very acute zero-edges against anything but very soft materials like fish and some meats is decidedly unwise. It almost always results in micro-chipping, if not outright breakage. Furthermore, it's simply not necessary. That's precisely why reputable knife/tool makers put micro-bevels on wood-working knives and chisels.

Re-grinding any knife I make automatically voids any guarantees or warranties. I have no way of knowing if the client has a semblance of a clue as to what they're doing. You mod it, it's your problem and all bets are off. I'm sorry if that sounds harsh... that's just me... other makers may have different policies.

If I had made that knife, I would be at least a little ticked-off at a client receiving it and immediately re-grinding it... I would offer to re-sharp it properly at no charge except return shipping, and leave it at that.
 
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I micro-bevel all my convex users (mostly A-2 and 1095), and I've never had a problem, even through hard woods.
 
The microchips seem to be about the same size? Do you have any clue on how the blade was heat treated? Was it tempered in an oven or tempered at the forge?
 
24* inclusive should hold up reasonably well even with a true zero grind. I have a bench plane with no chip breaker that I run about that acute with no microbevel though am pretty sure it isn't 61 RC. I've taken to putting a very slight convex on my Scandis and Puukkos to toughen them up, maybe a degree from shoulder to apex, and this seems to give a larger margin of error for EDU. Under the mid to low 20s inclusive and that's (for the most part) too acute, a few degrees can make a big difference. Am not so sure I'd use ceramics on that either, maybe stop at the 6k and strop (or not).
 
Since it's a puuko design with scandi grind, the maker needs to adjust the steel and heat treat accordingly. I won't blame user try to go full scandi as it should be designed/made that way.
 
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