Full sized waterstones on EP, an experiment

[Pete84]

After experimenting with my new EdgePro Apex over the past few days, I've found that it is every bit as good as advertised. Naturally, being something of a sharpening geek, I wanted to see if I could lightly modify the system to improve the already stellar results I've experienced thus far.

Others have said that the stock EP stones leave something to be desired due to their slow cutting and propensity to "load." I wondered if it would be possible, or worthwhile, to use my full-sized waterstones in place of the EP stones.

I have a number of good quality Norton and King waterstones, which I've been using for freehand sharpening and honing my straight razors. The finish I've seen come off of my EP so far hasn't held a candle to the mirror polishes the King stones have put on my other blades.

In another thread, a member with far more expertise than I on the EP (changeofseasons), suggested the use of a drill bit stop collar to help maintain consistency between EP stones and ensure a perfect matched angle. See here for particulars. Based on the same principle, I decided to use the stop collar to allow a transition between the EP stones and my full sized stones. I had no idea if it would work or, if so, how well. Let me just say, I am incredibly happy I tried it -- the results were astonishing!

I unscrewed the ball on the end of the stone arm and removed the brass fitting to allow the stone clamp to extend such that it would accommodate a large bench stone. After I made sure my stones would fit and clamp securely into the assembly, I went about using the stop collar concept to replicate the angle I had used for the EP stones. I flattened my large stones then, using a sharpie to check and adjust, I discovered that it matched the angle exactly! Here's how the setup looked once I had my stones clamped and the bevel arm adjusted. (forgive my messy workspace and the camera-phone-photography)

I then went about sharpening my Cold Steel Recon 1, which I carry and abuse regularly. Set the angle to 20* per side. The abrasive progression went something like this:

• EP 120
• EP 220
• EP 320
• EP 600
• King 800
• King 4000
• King 6000
• King 8000
• Chinese 12k polishing
• 1 micron Honing Film
• 0.3 micron Honing Film
• 0.25micron spray
• Plain leather
• 0.050micron spray

I can't begin to tell you how happy I am with the refined edge on my blade from having used this little trick.

There are some things I probably could change, namely a better progression once I switched to the Honing film and sprays, rather than such a huge jump. The other thing I'm going to have to be watchful of is ensuring that my large stones are completely flattened before each sharpening (they seem to wear more quickly, as their entire surface isn't used when sharpening on the EP.

I would love to have some feedback on potential improvements to this setup, pitfalls, or thoughts from others who may have tried/used this setup. I can't imagine that I'm the first one to try this with the number of great sharpening minds we have on this forum.

Please forgive me if this is a duplicate of someone else's post -- didn't find anything similar during my brief search.

Thanks for reading!

- Pete

 

[Ankerson]

You can buy Shapton and Chosera waterstones that are precut and mounted for the EP.

 

[Pete84]

You can buy Shapton and Chosera waterstones that are precut and mounted for the EP.

Yes, I've seen those. I think there's a site that also sells a range of DMT stones for the EP. I just wanted to use what I had, since I can't afford outlay more cash on EP stones just now. As they say, necessity is the mother of invention.

 

[sodak]

Very inventive, 10 pts for thinking out of the box! You must have strong arms... Any problems on the curves with such a big stone?

 

[Ankerson]

Yes, I've seen those. I think there's a site that also sells a range of DMT stones for the EP. I just wanted to use what I had, since I can't afford outlay more cash on EP stones just now. As they say, necessity is the mother of invention.

Yeah they do.

Also Congress Tools sells precut stones direct and they have a very large variety, Sil Carbide, Aluminum Oxide, Ceramic and Diamond.

 

[Pete84]

Very inventive, 10 pts for thinking out of the box! You must have strong arms... Any problems on the curves with such a big stone?

Thank you!

The curve on the blade belly wasn't much of an issue, although I can say that over time the stone would wear unevenly because of the blade shape. On most common blade shapes, I don't think it would be a problem. On a recurve or blade with extreme curve of any sort, however, it don't think this method would work at all because of the significant increase in stone width compared with the standard EP stone size.

 

[Pete84]

Yeah they do.

Also Congress Tools sells precut stones direct and they have a very large variety, Sil Carbide, Aluminum Oxide, Ceramic and Diamond.

I'll have to check those out once I get paid again! Thanks.

 

[Ankerson]

I'll have to check those out once I get paid again! Thanks.

I ordered some 320/400 and 800 grit Sil Carbide stones from them, they are not expensive either, will test them once I get them and find time to mount the stones ect.

 

[changeofseasons]

Nice idea! That setup looks to be more much more stable. I've never used the Apex and didn't know that a mod like this would work. Just curious, was 5/16 the right stop collar size for the Apex? Also, is the blade table long enough to allow you to use the full length of the stone?

I have a similar setup for us with the EP Pro model. But I had to make a whole new stone arm. Modding the existing Pro arm doesn't allow for the use of the full length of the stone. A regular stone holder does though... after removing a little rubber off of the end.

In your stone progression, the King 800 should be pretty close in grit to the EP 320 stone. Using it after the 600 is probably adding an unnecessary or repetitive step.

 

[Pete84]

Just curious, was 5/16 the right stop collar size for the Apex? Also, is the blade table long enough to allow you to use the full length of the stone?

The stop collar was one size up from the 5/16 -- luckily for me, they come in a pack at Lowe's including a number of common sizes. That trick really helped!

The blade table isn't quite long enough for use of the full stone; there is about a half inch gap at the top and bottom. I figure as long as I'm more polishing than grinding heavily with them & keep an eye on flatness, it should be fine. I'm finding as I continue to experiment that my little trick isn't very good on blades under around 4". Otherwise, completely happy with my results so far.