Full-tang or no????

bdws1975

bdws1975

Joined
May 19, 2006
Messages
3,721
Hi all,

I finally got my first khuk. It's a 15 inch BAS villager. i LOVE it.

Here are my questions:

1. In non full-tang knives, how is the blade attached to the handle?
2. How stury is this construction?
3. Which do you prefer? Full-tang or no?

thanks all!!!

brett
 
bdws1975 said:
1. In non full-tang knives, how is the blade attached to the handle?
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Look at the buttcap. The end of the tang is peened onto it. I haven't ripped apart a hidden tang HI so I'm not personally familiar with what's underneath. I've read in other threads that it is fairly substantial. I assume the space between the handle and tang is filled with laha. They are pretty much the same as any other hidden tang knife.

I prefer hidden tang for comfort and the fact that the scales are less likely to separate.
 
ilbruche said:
Look at the buttcap. The end of the tang is peened onto it. I haven't ripped apart a hidden tang HI so I'm not personally familiar with what's underneath. I've read in other threads that it is fairly substantial. I assume the space between the handle and tang is filled with laha. They are pretty much the same as any other hidden tang knife.

I prefer hidden tang for comfort and the fact that the scales are less likely to separate.
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yeah, what really impressed me was how comfortable it is when chopping. I spend a good 30 chopping andnever had any blisters or hot spots.

thanks for the input!

brett
 
Think "crocodile tail", or rat-tail...in terms of the shape of the tang. VERY thick and tapering back to peened part.

On-going discussion on full or regular tang. The full tang is heavier and is said to transmit vibrations more. I don't know, never had one.

This isn't some spindly little part welded on, it is a one part piece of metal, some hidden in the handle, the rest tempered and polished and differentially heat-treated.

In Nepal, handles are replaced as they break; the blades live on.
 
Thank kismet. it sure feels solid I was mainly curious about how it's constructed and you and Bruce answered that very well.

thanks!!!

Brett
Kismet said:
Think "crocodile tail", or rat-tail...in terms of the shape of the tang. VERY thick and tapering back to peened part.

On-going discussion on full or regular tang. The full tang is heavier and is said to transmit vibrations more. I don't know, never had one.

This isn't some spindly little part welded on, it is a one part piece of metal, some hidden in the handle, the rest tempered and polished and differentially heat-treated.

In Nepal, handles are replaced as they break; the blades live on.
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They are all full tang. If the tang extends the full length o fthe handle, it's a full tang.
An exposed tang will be stronger, just simple physics. However, as mentioned, the hidden tang is quite large on these and not likely to break in your, or your grandkid's lives.

I prefer the exposed, Chiruwa style tang, but that's personal preference. The comfort issue is a moot point, IMO, as even with the exposed tang, the primary gripping surface is still the wood or bone scales, and the shock transfers through them to your hand. I have zero comfort issues with my Chiruwa handles. The only downside is that the wood will shrink and you'll have to file down the metal of the tang to match the wood. But it isn't a big deal.
 
Never owned a full tang that didn't aggravate my carpal tunnel and make my shoulder hurt:thumbdn: For me at least and in the models I have tried (ang khola, YCS, M43 they all did it)

Also I think as the slabs shrink, and they all do, they don't look as good as when the stick tang that shrink.

If any of you still have the search function if you can find the pics from the Ohio Khukuri Khonvention as I recall Dave Rishar took a pic of a stick tanged khuk I took the handle off of
 
the traditional tang on older kukhri was the stub tang, a few inches of metal inserted into a hole in the grip and held on with laha (himalayan epoxy, aka cutlers cement) this weaker design would frequently break under hard use, maybe even as frequently as every twenty years or so, so they'd get that weaker handle replaced and pass the blade on to the next generation who would then be forced to replace the handle in a few short decades themselves.

barring manufacturing errors or extreme abuse there is no way you would normally break the hidden tang. the differences are mostly in the preferences and perceptions of the owner rather than in any practical difference in strength.
 
kronckew said:
the traditional tang on older kukhri was the stub tang, a few inches of metal inserted into a hole in the grip and held on with laha (himalayan epoxy, aka cutlers cement) this weaker design would frequently break under hard use, maybe even as frequently as every twenty years or so, so they'd get that weaker handle replaced and pass the blade on to the next generation who would then be forced to replace the handle in a few short decades themselves.

barring manufacturing errors or extreme abuse there is no way you would normally break the hidden tang. the differences are mostly in the preferences and perceptions of the owner rather than in any practical difference in strength.
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Well said Kronck, very well said!!!!:thumbup: :cool: :D
Personally I have never broken any knife I've ever used with a hidden tang because of the tang being weak. I've snapped off a few points when I was younger and careless and didn't take good care of my tools but never a hidden tang.
I don't have a clue as to why knifemakers ever started making knives with exposed tangs in the first place seeing as how knives had been made with hidden tangs from the beginning of the iron age unless it was because steel finally got cheap enough it could be wasted in such a manner.:rolleyes: :p
If an exposed tang is so much stronger why weren't the old Kabars and Cattaraugus Q225 Quartermaster knives used in WW II that are still so well thought of today made with hidden tangs?
And the Cattaraugus Q225 was made for opening crates and all sorts of other rough duty and were especially prized.
The bayonets were out of necessity made with exposed tangs so the hardware mechanism could be put in the back of the handles. If there had been a different way to mount them on a rifle so that it would have been feasible to have made them with hidden tangs they would also have had them IMO.:D :p ;)
 
Hidden tangs are adequately strong if properly made.

Before I found H.I., I was chopping with a cheap indian made kukri with a hidden tang and shattered the handle. The tang and blade survived just fine.

Comparing its tang to the ones of the H.I. khukri's I've seen posted here, H.I. tangs are substantially larger.

If the tang of a lesser, cheaper kukri survived, I have no doubts the tang of an H.I. will survive.

My go-to 'power chopper' is my first H.I. - a 20" Ang Khola by kami Kumar. I have dealt out many full strength power blows on hardwood with it for years now and it has performed flawlessly. I do not see it ever breaking.

How does it cut? If they cloned mammoths, it's what you'd use as a meat cleaver after successfully hunting one. I bet it would cleave through the bones too.


However... after examining the M43 I bought my brother for Xmas, I noticed a definite difference in the overall feel and balance of the chiruwa style. IMO the additional steel in the handle improved the balance.

But again, sure it's going to be stronger than a hidden tang, but H.I. hidden tangs are large and substantial enough to survive anything you might use it for anyway. As I recall from images posted here, H.I. hidden tangs are almost as wide as the blades are (at the bolster)!

When you get one, test it out by smacking it against a stout wooden post or log to check it for structural integrity.
 
Yvsa said:
I don't have a clue as to why knifemakers ever started making knives with exposed tangs in the first place seeing as how knives had been made with hidden tangs from the beginning of the iron age unless it was because steel finally got cheap enough it could be wasted in such a manner.
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A lot of it is a sales gimmick to sell based on strength.

Another part of it I think is the ease of attaching/changing scales.
Any dummy like me can replace them on an exposed tang. They don't even have to be properly sized, just screw/rivet them on and sand to size!

Also they will be stronger in blades that are fully heat treated as the tang/blade transition will be hardened and more brittle than with a differentially heat treated blade.

I like exposed tangs due to absolute bulldog, it'll go anywhere and survive it, strength. Will I notice that strength over an HI hidden tang? I doubt it. But it eases my mind.

hollowdweller said:
Never owned a full tang that didn't aggravate my carpal tunnel and make my shoulder hurt:thumbdn: For me at least and in the models I have tried (ang khola, YCS, M43 they all did it)
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I have a feeling you're gripping it tighter than I do. I found that with a loose grip, I can swing it hard, get a good wrist snap at the end and little of the impact is transferred to my hand. I do not notice the difference between my exposed and hidden tangs.
 
Cpl Punishment said:
I have a feeling you're gripping it tighter than I do. I found that with a loose grip, I can swing it hard, get a good wrist snap at the end and little of the impact is transferred to my hand. I do not notice the difference between my exposed and hidden tangs.
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Nope. In fact I kind of hold the khuk loosely with my ring finger and pinkie doing most of the holding that way it transmits less shock. I also am not a power chopper, more of a placing my cuts chopper.

Maybe you're younger and stronger than I am:thumbup:
 
I don't know, that's how I hold mine.

I'm not a power chopper for the most part, either. I tried it when I first got the thing to test it and see what it could do. But I found it works much better to let the weight of the blade, and a good wide, somewhat leisurely swing propel it, and my hand just guides it. It's surprisingly easy to hit with accurately.

It's probably a matter of our bodies beign different. My hands are somewhat arthritic, yet it doesn't bother me to use my CAK. But I have other issues, such as I have to do pushups on my knuckles, if I try it with my palms, I have shooting pain run up my arms.

Everyone's different. . .
 
I have a horrible feeling {& a very early British made kukri.} that full tangs with riveted grips was some Englishmans idea, it wasnt the Nepali or Indian way.

But we rulled India & bought the kukris in the old days.

That said the earliest full tangs had the tang taper forged or ground very thin so it didnt affect balance to much.

But partial tangs are easeir on the joints long term I definatly prefer them they cut with more life in them too, i find. ;)

Spiral
 
I feel a little more confident with exposed tangs. At the same time, I have never had a problem with HI's hidden tangs. It's amazing that they understood the physics, or figured it out over time to create the hidden tang.
 
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