Fun w2 mini camp sword/knife (knife testing question)

PaulDiStefano

PaulDiStefano

Joined
Nov 14, 2016
Messages
636
Hey guys I forged out what I thought looked like a knife but ended up looking more like a mini sword. I thought i'd show it because I thought it came out pretty cool looking.

I know the pictures are bad again, I took them on my kitchen counter. I'm working on buy lights so I can set up a little photo studio.

Blade is 12 inches 18 overall. W2 / stabilized Birds eye maple burl handle(pictures dont show it but its a very high gloss tung oil finish) with brass guard

I had a lot of fun testing this out chopping some 2x4 but stupid me used an old piece of wood laying around in my garage that had staples inside it. So now the blade has a few little scratches near the edge. Barely visible but still there.

I had a question about testing knives. After I finish grind and before hand sanding, will it suffice to chop through some 2x4 just holding the tang without a handle. I ask this because when I was done with the knife I was wondering if my edge geometry wasn't thick enough for a chopper. When I was able to swing the knife as hard as I could with a handle I didn't get any edge deformation(just those scratches) but I hadn't tested it against a tree. I don't have any that I can chop into around me. Do you guys think if it passes a 2x4 test it could handle something bigger and harder because I know pine isn't that hard.
What other testing do you guys think I should do. Thanks
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get it shaving sharp, chop through a 2x4 twice. if it still shaves were you were chopping, its doing well.
 
I always put a temporary handle on all of my knives made of soft pine 2X4, carry it for awhile and give it a good workout before the final finishing, just to make sure I am happy with it! Good looking blade!
 
IMO, that's an AWFUL hamon.

It's the heat treat version of a random damascus that is all over the map....it shows limited CONTROL which is the goal of a well done hamon, even one that ascribes to the (generally awful) Western style of going up to and over the 1/2 way point on a blade. Demonstrating knowledge and control over the heat treating process of the steel. Art comes after craft....if art is made as the primary goal, than it should become suspect as a functional tool.

While I appreciate your enthusiasm, your focus should be on craft, and honing it. For starters, that's a silver(ss?) pin in the handle, which is contrasting horribly with your brass guard, are my eyes correct?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
I'm not a master Japanese sword maker. I do whatever I think looks cool. If that means having a hamon that goes past half the blade, not making a uniform pattern and leaving black oxides on the blade then apparently I'm breaking all the rules.
This is also why I don't do custom orders. I don't want someone telling me how to put clay on a blade and have it come out boring.

And as for learning the craft before art. Haha loosen up. Have some fun and mismatch a pin on a hard use knife once in a while. Who cares. Having boring rules for things as minuscule as claying a blade is a sure way for everyone to make the same boring pieces over and over.

You should be on forged in fire. You sure do like critiquing blades

Thanks for your constructive criticism
-Paul
 
PaulDiStefano said:
I'm not a master Japanese sword maker. I do whatever I think looks cool. If that means having a hamon that goes past half the blade, not making a uniform pattern and leaving black oxides on the blade then apparently I'm breaking all the rules.
This is also why I don't do custom orders. I don't want someone telling me how to put clay on a blade and have it come out boring.

And as for learning the craft before art. Haha loosen up. Have some fun and mismatch a pin on a hard use knife once in a while. Who cares. Having boring rules for things as minuscule as claying a blade is a sure way for everyone to make the same boring pieces over and over.

You should be on forged in fire. You sure do like critiquing blades

Thanks for your constructive criticism
-Paul
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I honestly can't entirely disagree with Steven, I'd be a little concerned about a chopping knife that has differential hardening as shown by your hamon line, but if that was your choice, it does look cool. And the tung oil finish on the maple handle is fantastic. Gorgeous wood.
 
PaulDiStefano said:
I'm up for learning. If there's a hardened edge what's the concern about? The blade bending?
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Unlikely that blade will easily bend, it looks beefy.

The problem is where the hardening line gets very close to the edge..there is not a lot of material that can be removed in sharpening before you hit soft steel.

This would be an issue if you chipped the edge chopping, and maybe hit a rock or piece of metal.

Will address your direct response when I get home from work, as it is maddening to do with a "smart" phone.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
It might look different in the pictures than in person. There is only one spot on the blade that is less then about half an inch of hardened steel and in that spot it's probably .300 inches(which is in a spot you shouldn't even chop with. It's way out of the sweet spot) I couldn't imagine how many boulders you would have hit to have sharpen a blade a half an inch from where the edge originally was.
Thanks
-Paul
 
PaulDiStefano said:
It might look different in the pictures than in person. There is only one spot on the blade that is less then about half an inch of hardened steel and in that spot it's probably .300 inches(which is in a spot you shouldn't even chop with. It's way out of the sweet spot)
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For what it's worth, my big bowie lost about 1/4" of length and 1/8" of width after about 2 years of hard use. If you've ever looked at antiques (especially agricultural tools that were used daily), you'll see some that end up looking like a fillet knife. The more hard steel you have, the longer its service life will be. The end half to third of the blade is where the most wear will happen on a chopper, so that's where I'd want the hardened area to be widest. If you want a thinner hamon somewhere for aesthetics, I'd prefer it to be closer to the ricasso.
 
Kohai999 said:
Unlikely that blade will easily bend, it looks beefy.

The problem is where the hardening line gets very close to the edge..there is not a lot of material that can be removed in sharpening before you hit soft steel.

This would be an issue if you chipped the edge chopping, and maybe hit a rock or piece of metal.

Will address your direct response when I get home from work, as it is maddening to do with a "smart" phone.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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the possum said:
It's not the sharpening, but the using that does it.
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Idk I use camp knives I've made and don't ever get any deformation anywhere. So I can't imagine a well made knife having to completely be taken back 1/4 an inch or ground thinner.
What about people who make stainless San mai blades. Burt foster has made camp knives on his website where it looks like about 1/8 to 1/4 is visible carbon steel. This is good by keeping most of the blade stainless. I would never in a million years say he needs to work on honing the craft because there isn't enough hardened steel at the edge. That comment seems very condescending to me. If my blade has a hardened steel edge that's properly heat treated and good edge geometry why would it ever chip or dent unless you have no idea how to properly use it.
 
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PaulDiStefano said:
Idk I use camp knives I've made and don't ever get any deformation anywhere. So I can't imagine a well made knife having to completely be taken back 1/4 an inch or ground thinner.
What about people who make stainless San mai blades. Burt foster has made camp knives on his website where it looks like about 1/8 to 1/4 is visible carbon steel. This is good by keeping most of the blade stainless. I would never in a million years say he needs to work on honing the craft because there isn't enough hardened steel at the edge. That comment seems very condescending to me. If my blade has a hardened steel edge and good edge geometry why would it ever chip or dent unless you have no idea how to properly use it.
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Comparing Burt's san mai to a normal hamon is not apples to apples. Burt gets carbon leaching/migration into the stainless, so it isn't quite as easy for the viewer to tell exactly what is hardened and what is "transitory"..Burt knows.

I have used swords and camp knives hard for probably longer than you have been alive. The last third of a sword blade is what is cut with, not the tip, but the "belly/sweet spot". In Japanese terminology, this is called the "mono uchi".
The Bowie is the closest true analogy that America has to the katana.

The Possum HUNTS using a bowie knife.

I have seen some fairly severe edge deformation/chips from accidentally hitting granite when chopping, and other damage that occurred incidentally.....and to suggest that I don't know how to properly use a knife isn't simply condescending, it's sophomoric.

Thus far, you have had two comments supporting my premises, and no refuting them, except you. Ostrich/Sand?

Did you start posting on BFC to learn something, or do you simply want accolades? It is my observation that you have the skills to be a great maker, but if you don't consider critical commentary....you might not.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
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Is anyone going to answer the question that the OP actually asked?
Instead of jumping in and telling him his creation is crap, why not suggest some tests that will show all of the weaknesses that are stated to exist?
 
Kohai999 said:
Comparing Burt's san mai to a normal hamon is not apples to apples. Burt gets carbon leaching/migration into the stainless, so it isn't quite as easy for the viewer to tell exactly what is hardened and what is "transitory"..Burt knows.

I have used swords and camp knives hard for probably longer than you have been alive. The last third of a sword blade is what is cut with, not the tip, but the "belly/sweet spot". In Japanese terminology, this is called the "mono uchi".
The Bowie is the closest true analogy that America has to the katana.

The Possum HUNTS using a bowie knife.

I have seen some fairly severe edge deformation/chips from accidentally hitting granite when chopping, and other damage that occurred incidentally.....and to suggest that I don't know how to properly use a knife isn't simply condescending, it's sophomoric.

Thus far, you have had two comments supporting my premises, and no refuting them, except you. Ostrich/Sand?

Did you start posting on BFC to learn something, or do you simply want accolades? It is my observation that you have the skills to be a great maker, but if you don't consider critical commentary....you might not.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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I'm all for learning. But you did not show any interest in helping. Your first sentence said my hamon is horrible and then went on to bash my heat treat control. This thread was made with a question and you disregarded it. So when you say did I post looking for accolades you couldn't be more wrong. Read the original question....lWhen I wrote about not knowing how to use the knife I didn't mean you directly, I have no idea who the heck you are. I also don't really care how much experience you have swinging swords or knives. That had nothing to do with my question. And that ostrich sand crap. Clearly your a gentlemen and thank you for your help. I hope you are not a good representation of the knife community because man you are unlikeable. I have seen some of your other posts about the abs still sucking after all these years and I can tell you have a lot of class.
 
robgmn said:
Is anyone going to answer the question that the OP actually asked?
Instead of jumping in and telling him his creation is crap, why not suggest some tests that will show all of the weaknesses that are stated to exist?
Click to expand...
Thank you. I'm glad there's some people who see how ridiculous this is getting.
 
Learn or don't learn.

Class has nothing to do with the question. You want to test your knives, right?

Test your ability first....you just can't see the answer through the forest.

It's easy for those who don't know jack shit about the basic question to throw dispersion....and I am no gentle man.

Good luck.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
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