Gerber E-Z skinner... in Canada?

[The_Iron_Joe]

First off, I would have posted this in 'the Canadian connection', being from the great white north, but honestly it's just about dead at the moment [the forum, that is, haha]. So I would like to ask all of YOU about the EZ Skinner! I can apparently buy this lovely blade at my local Bass Pro Shops just a short way out of town; even though it is technically a prohibited weapon in Canada, given that it has a blade perpendicular to the handle.

Here is the exact quote from the website here, which is a list of prohibited weapons in Canada...

Any knife commonly known as a “push-dagger” that is designed in such a fashion that the handle is placed perpendicular to the main cutting edge of the blade and any other similar device other than the aboriginal “ulu” knife.

Now, here is a picture of the knife as seen on Gerber's website:

There are two very possible results from this knife; that because it is not considered a push-dagger in design [not a clip point, dagger or drop point style blade] it is perfectly legal, or that it is in fact technically illegal, but it's purpose is so obvious [and its function as an offensive stabbing weapon is diminished due to the lack of prominent point] that law enforcement just lets it go.

What do you think? Also, has anyone any similar situations in their area?

 

[HoosierQ]

If I were to classify that, I'd call it an Ulu. I mean Gerber took their design cues directly from the Ulu. Unless you get into a bar fight and start swinging that thing around, I think you be in the clear. Of course, I cannot imagine anybody deploying that particular knife anywhere but on a hunt, were the Ulu thing is further emphasized.

I am no lawyer, in any part of North America, so take my advice for its market value.

 

[Poez]

So what will you tell a police officer if he asks what do you need this thing for?
That "skinner" design does not look very practical from the skinning point of view. It simply does not look very practical. The cutting edge direction is totally not Ulu.
It is Gerber and I will not be surprised if the knife is made of some crappy steel.
And it is technically prohibited weapon in Canada. You are probably attracted to it because it looks like a push dagger in the first place.
For me: that would be enough reasons to forget about it.

 

[Goosey]

I remember reading a Customs tribunal where there was a vintage 17th century Indian "katar" punch-dagger seized. The tribunal found it was not a "push dagger" due to its size, and the fact the handle was not "T-shaped" and there was a knuckle-guard.



However, they still dismissed the appeal (I don't think ANYONE wins) because the legislation says "push daggers or similar objects".


I'd be careful on this one...

 

[chiral.grolim]

So what will you tell a police officer if he asks what do you need this thing for?
That "skinner" design does not look very practical from the skinning point of view. It simply does not look very practical. The cutting edge direction is totally not Ulu.
It is Gerber and I will not be surprised if the knife is made of some crappy steel.
And it is technically prohibited weapon in Canada. You are probably attracted to it because it looks like a push dagger in the first place.
For me: that would be enough reasons to forget about it.

1) it doesn't look like a push dagger, and the reason the OP is attracted to it isn't in any way apparent from his single post, so the assumption is ludicrous.

2) Even if some ignorant sheep or an individual looking for a means of indicting you interpreted this design as a "push dagger", Canadian law regarding "push daggers" is as follows:
88. (1) Every person commits an offence who carries or possesses a weapon, an imitation of a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition for a purpose dangerous to the public peace or for the purpose of committing an offence.
89. (1) Every person commits an offence who, without lawful excuse, carries a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition while the person is attending or is on the way to attend a public meeting.
90. (1) Every person commits an offence who carries a weapon, a prohibited device or any prohibited ammunition concealed, unless the person is authorized under the Firearms Act to carry it concealed.

In summary, if this tool (NOT "weapon") is being carried lawfully, i.e. not concealed to a public meeting for the purpose of committing an offense (or any of the above), then there is no ground for legal action. It is evidently NOT unlawful to own, transport, purchase, or sell this item in Canada... which is why you can walk into a brick&mortar store and purchase one! If you then carry or use the item/tool in a lawful manner, then you have nothing to worry about. And FYI, police are far more concerned about guns. This is a hunting tool, use it as such. Anybody who harasses you about it is in violation of your civil rights. Stand up for those rights. :thumbup:

3) Gerber is a good company with a long history, legions of hunters employ their tools regularly, and they stand by their warranty. Their tools are generally priced for the common man and plenty sufficient for his needs. If you find them lacking, buy something else.

4) Poez, have you ever used one for game purposes (and by "game" I mean hunting/skinning wild animals)? How much experience do you have to make any sort of evaluation? I'm just wondering, because from my own experience with whitetail, small game, and fowl, it looks fine, plenty practical for its stated purpose... not my cup-of-tea because I prefer general utility implements and have more experience with straight-handled knives, which is why I also don't care for the ulu, the influence of which is certainly evident in this design.

5) If in the highly unlikely situation that a police officer stops you and asks what you need it for, the answer is obvious: "For processing game."

In summary, if you can buy the knife in Canada, you can legally possess it in Canada and can use/carry it as the law permits.

 

[The_Iron_Joe]

Thanks everyone for the replies! I think I do need to make one or two things clear here, however.

I am merely interested in the legality of such an item being sold in Canada given it's design and form, not in actually using the knife, much less for it's intended purpose. Although, I did buy a very cheap karambit folder, just to see how I like the blade shape, and may do the same with this knife eventually. Also, I don't particularly care for debate on how crappy or how good Gerber's steel is. My Remix [liner lock version, heard there were different kinds] has served me just fine for basic utility around my warehouse for a good few weeks now and only needed sharpening once or twice thus far.

Poez, I'm not interested in the knife as an offensive weapon, nor am I planning on carrying one out in public [I don't even go hunting, buying this would be for collection purposes only]. However, there is a VERY good review of the EZ skinner's performance right here that I recommend you read, but keep in mind that's just one mans experience with the knife.

chiral.grolim, thanks for the very well written/thought out reply! Although I'd have to disagree on the notion that 'if it's for sale, it's legal', at least in certain instances.

 

[Poez]

Why so angry?

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

1)
2) Even if some ignorant sheep or an individual looking for a means of indicting you interpreted this design as a "push dagger", Canadian law regarding "push daggers" is as follows:
88. (1) Every person commits an offence who carries or possesses a weapon, an imitation of a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition for a purpose dangerous to the public peace or for the purpose of committing an offence.
89. (1) Every person commits an offence who, without lawful excuse, carries a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition while the person is attending or is on the way to attend a public meeting.
90. (1) Every person commits an offence who carries a weapon, a prohibited device or any prohibited ammunition concealed, unless the person is authorized under the Firearms Act to carry it concealed.

Keep reading. Possession of a prohibited weapon is covered under sections 91 and 92.

 

[coyotebc]

I have used the whitetail skinner for years (15 or 20), and it is basically the same knife shape as the Gerber.
It is an ulu type blade design so it is not prohibited.

 

[The_Iron_Joe]

Poez-- Why put any thought into a reply? I'm sorry if my blunt wording came off as aggression or dismissal, I just don't like 'beating around the bush'.

Rusty-- I've already provided a list of prohibited weapons in my original post. I understand that even owning such an item is grounds for being charged.

coyotebc-- Does that really count as an 'ulu' design? I thought that in order to be considered an 'Ulu' design the blade needed to sweep across the width of the hand when held, like this:

 

[chiral.grolim]

chiral.grolim, thanks for the very well written/thought out reply! Although I'd have to disagree on the notion that 'if it's for sale, it's legal', at least in certain instances.

Well, alright, let's be more specific. Under the "trafficking" section (99) in the Criminal Code, anyone manufacturing or selling a prohibited/restricted weapon/device
without specific license is in violation of the law and subject to minimum 3-yr prison term, so... Either the person you might buy it from is a criminal OR it's perfectly legal.

Keep reading. Possession of a prohibited weapon is covered under sections 91 and 92.

Alright, now this thing is just getting confusing, but my above remark still applies, and I encourage the OP to lobby to repeal some of these restrictions. If you ever get the E-Z Skinner, remember that it is NOT a weapon (and it should be easy enough to defend that in court) and always carry/use it responsibly. If you can find it at a brick&mortar store on display for sale, it is legal to possess.

 

[coyotebc]

I agree the average knife person would not consider it an ulu design however when I asked this question with our local firearms officer he told me that the direction they had received was that this type of knife (my whitetail skinner) was designed, marketed and sold to people for processing game.
As such they consider it an ulu
Of course to my knowledge no one has ever been charged for owning one, so the courts haven't made a ruling on it

 

[The_Iron_Joe]

Fair enough, good to know.