German retention tests (Cliff?)

F

Franco G

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Dec 29, 2000
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I just found in german Messerforum an interesting thread on retention test, with some unexpected results.

If you do not read German just take a look at the graph/table in colors. The green color means a clean shave, the yellow one a shave under pressure, the red one no shave. Numbers are a numbers of cuts.

As you can see, the BG-42 steel seems to be a winner. Both a BG-42 CF Millie and Buck 110 (custom BG-42) are among winners.

http://www.messerforum.net/showthread.php?t=34401

Take a look and have a fun.

Franco
 
I already saw that one. Interesting results. By their table, a SAK is better than some knives in S30V. That hasn't been my experience, but it does make one think.
 
Note they are testing for very high sharpness on a push, 420HC is far more suitable for that application than S30V. Can anyone read german and verify that the angles were all the same, blades sharpened equally, and the work repeated?

UPDATE : I did a few translations and the clearest was :

"The measurers were sharpened all on the Sharpmaker and thereafter taken off on shaving sharpness. The respective angles were kept"

These two statements seem to be incontradiction.

-Cliff
 
Cliff,

maybe I can help with German.
You are quoting this sentence:

Die Messer wurden alle auf dem Sharpmaker geschärft und danach Abgezogen auf Rasierschärfe. Die jeweiligen Winkel wurden eingehalten.

My translation is roughly (w/o vocabulary)

All knives (Messer) were sharpened using the Sharpmaker and then brought to the shaving sharpness. The existing angles were kept.

You see that "Messer" was not correctly translated. Actually, "der Messer" (mascul.) is a measuring device (your "measurer"), and "das Messer" (neutr.) is a knife. "Der" and "das" are masc./netr. articles (as "the").

From the text it is not clear to me if all knives were brought to, let's say, 30 degrees inclusive. I shall read the thread carefully and, probably ask that question. I understand your point - if the angles were not the same, the results are not quite conclusive.

Franco
 
Yeah, I think keeping the origional angles is fine because a lot of people do that, you just have to be careful then that you are not doing edge retention (or in this case stability) testing on steel as much as on knives. Ideally then you then give the work over a bunch of angles and show how that effects the results, that is of course a lot more work.

-Cliff
 
Yes, Franko,
That translation is correct. However, I have the same question what that actually means. Sharpened on the Sharpmaker would imply that all the blades should have at least the same microbevel. I assume that "the existing angles were kept" means that the knives were not reprofiled.

Still, I would think that edge finish and geometry play a pretty important role here.
 
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