Germany April 2008

bigbore.45

bigbore.45

Joined
Sep 23, 2000
Messages
736
I`m sorry i have to inform you about this:
we have a new knife-law now!

It is illegal to carry a "Einhandmesser" = one-hand-opener that locks open,
no matter what size!
It is illegal to carry a fixed blade over 12cm blade.

There is a "leagal reason" except, but noone knows for sure how this will work in real life.

BTW: It is also illegal to carry any baton.
 
Can you carry a friction folder? Or a mini Titanium pry-bar, a prySTR?
 
Why? why was this law passed?
was there any reason given ?
just looking at the paris france thread , seems much less restrictive ,,
 
At least you can still carry a sub 5 inch fixed blade. Better than the UK.
 
@Lycosa:
afaik a friction folder will be ok,
any slipjoint will be ok,
any folder with lock that opens only with two hands (like Buck110 or Navaja) will be ok,
any fixed <12cm will be ok if it was not designed as a weapon, ....god knows what this means :confused:
@bigbadboom:
they (Gov) saied this will reduce youth-crime :barf:
@jdm61:
yes, my good old bavarian nicker is on my side :)

PLEASE: I am not a lawyer, this is what i know till now.
There is no feedback with the new law here.
 
bigbadboom said:
Why? why was this law passed?
was there any reason given ?
Click to expand...

The "reason" would be that the city-state of Berlin, I believe, reported a high number of knife-related youth crime. This snowballed into this new law because politicians, sitting in their bullet-proof limos, driven by their bodyguards, believed that it was a bad idea for your average Joe to be allowed to carry a knife. Which, of course, will do nothing to prevent criminal gang-members from carrying one.

You´re still allowed to carry such knives if you have a "reason" to do so. For instance, a carpenter or such, would be allowed to carry his one-hand folder because he needs it while working.

So far, so good. However, self-defense is NOT considered a valid reason to carry a knife, and that´s the whole problem. In my work for the court, I have seen what people are capable of. Anything from stupid youths who think it´s a funny idea to beat up random people to disturbed people who will stop at nothing to rob you. And frankly, I´d rather have a means to defend myself. Just like most people, I haven´t been in a fight since high-school nor have I ever considered using my knife as a weapon on anyone. And yet, with this new law, I will now be punished for carrying a knife.

If the lawmakers though for just a minute about it, they would have arrived at the following conclusion: Any upstanding citizen with no record of violence should be allowed to carry a knife. However, those convicted of assault, robbery etc. should have that right stripped by the court. Any other law is bullshit.
 
I wandered into my favorite knife shop here in Frankfurt. I asked the manager about the law. I was pretty much told that the law was not directed toward "people like me" but toward "outlanders" and "undesirables". Man. That chilled me to the bone. There are restrictions by place (public gatherings, athletic events) and by activity (hiking and camping are authorized activities that allow a larger or different type of knife). Now the appearance and age will be factors. I really want to ask about religion being a factor, but this is not the forum for that. Still, it is a consideration when you are an American citizen in another person's country.
 
Do you know what the punishment would be if someone(normal tourist for example) gets "caught" with a one-hand folder on the street?
Do you think the police will only take it from you, or do you think there can be heavy penalties for possession?

If it's only the risk of the knife being taken away, I would take it, but otherwise it can end up very unpleasant...
 
At the moment, the german Police doesnt even know, how to execute this sick new law.
You are allowed to use named folders for sport. Ok. Does this mean, you can carry it like always, or do you have to lock it up into something like a box, until you actually NEED the knife?:confused:
Nobody knows. The only thing everyone knows for sure is that Angela Merkel (Our "President") and her cortege are from East Germany. 15 Years ago the DDR was absorbed by West Germany, and now Whole Germany is led by some pseudo-Honecker's.:thumbdn:
 
Ivalid said:
The only thing everyone knows for sure is that Angela Merkel (Our "President") and her cortege are from East Germany. 15 Years ago the DDR was absorbed by West Germany, and now Whole Germany is led by some pseudo-Honecker's.:thumbdn:
Click to expand...

I don´t see how her background has anything to do with the discussion at hand?

Anyways, I haven´t heard of this being inforced, but obviously, how often does the average person get stopped and SEARCHED by the police? Never. So frankly, I´d keep carrying my knives in Germany. Only take it out when you need it. If it´s for cutting, then obviously you had a good reson for carrying it. And if it´s for self-defense, well, what´s more important, risking a fine or risking your life? You pick.
 
joe-bob:

the new law seems to have three parts:
length of blade;
one-hand opening: and
locking blade.

When I got here two years ago, I was very happy that I could carry my Lone Wolf Double Action. Now I am sort of leaving it home until things get sorted out. Except for the SOKs, everything that I own has a lock (at the least).
 
any recent news? could'nt find anything useful on the net
I'm going to visit my grandmother from Italy to Germany, looks like I can only carry my slipjoints now.

this is all I found http://bundesrecht.juris.de/waffg_2002/__42a.html point 3)
seems that OH with no lock are OK, slippies are OK, so my trappers, hunters and canoes will be safe to carry

thanks for the help,
Max
 
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Mad_Maxx said:
any recent news? could'nt find anything useful on the net
I'm going to visit my grandmother from Italy to Germany, looks like I can only carry my slipjoints now.

this is all I found http://bundesrecht.juris.de/waffg_2002/__42a.html point 3)
seems that OH with no lock are OK, slippies are OK, so my trappers, hunters and canoes will be safe to carry

thanks for the help,
Max
Click to expand...

Please note that one-handed openers with a lock aren´t illegal. It just depends on how you carry them.

The law states that you can carry them in a "closed container". So if you keep one in you backpack, briefcase or some such, you´re fine. There has been some discussion whether a belt-pouch is sufficient. Some say yes, others no. Messer Magazin, the leading german bi-monthly on knives got two answers saying "Sure, a belt-pouch is fine" and one "No way in hell". In any case, pockets, even pockets that you can close with a zipper or button, will most likely not be accepted.

My recommandation is to take whatever knife you EDC and shlep it around in a backpack of some description while keeping a slipjoint in your pocket, should you need fast access to a knife.

Also, if you´re hiking, camping or something like that, the law doesn´t apply, since you have a reason to be carrying the knife.

Hope this helps.
 
OK thanks
I'm planning to keep a rather large slipjoint like a trapper\hunter or similar size (3 to 4" closed +-) in a belt pouch on my belt and a smaller slippie in my pocket

Probably a mora\opinel or little"camper" if going to the mountain nearby (if I have time), of course kept in the backpack and not on me where there are people.

should be fine right?
Maxx

it's a pity I have no time to get a UKPK wich should be the best choice
 
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Mad_Maxx said:
OK thanks
I'm planning to keep a rather large slipjoint like a trapper\hunter or similar size (3 to 4" closed +-) in a belt pouch on my belt and a smaller slippie in my pocket

Probably a mora\opinel or little"camper" if going to the mountain nearby (if I have time), of course kept in the backpack and not on me where there are people.

should be fine right?
Maxx
Click to expand...

From my understanding, sure. I´d just recommend you stay away from belt-pouches that look "tactical". Even if the knife in it is perfectly legal, it´s still better not to attract attention.
 
Removing thumb studs: I wouldn´t do it. Even without studs, many knives can still be opened with one hand by holding the blade and flipping it open, so it doesn´t change anything.

Kalashnikov pouch, probably not. Take something simple that won´t get noticed. As said, in theory, you don´t need to worry at all if it´s a slipjoint, but you know how cops can be sometimes.

Also, don´t worry too much. I live in Luxembourg, not Germany, but I´ve never been stopped by the police, so chances are, it´s not going to happen to you. Enjoy your vacation.
 
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