Glue, Adhesives and Chemical bonds - new research

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BMK

BMK

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"Tony" researched and tested glues, adhesives and chemical bonds as they pertain to attaching handle material to the knife tang. After an exhaustive study and months of field testing we concluded: In order to stay on the cutting edge (pun intended) of knife engineering, we will continue to use the "SUPER glue" shown below.


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He means that no adhesive is as strong as a good mechanical fastener.
 
I would think that most adhesives also serve to create a seal... like a gasket. What are your thoughts on that? I see you flare the tube, so the handle is permanent... why not use some kind of adhesive to keep out the elements. I have seen some pretty nasty looking tangs under removeable scales.
 
Rick Marchand said:
I would think that most adhesives also serve to create a seal... like a gasket.
What are your thoughts on that? I see you flare the tube, so the handle is permanent... why not use some kind of adhesive to keep out the elements. I have seen some pretty nasty looking tangs under removeable scales.
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I agree.

Memory tells me that SR Johnston used super glue CA in his subhilt video set.
It's easy to use since you can fit it up, then let the CA wick in

On a permanent handle, I think a good epoxy has much better moisture sealing qualities.

I agree that mechanical fasteners are good, but good modern adhesives used well are pretty darn good too.


On a handle that is already permanent because of the flare, I like corby's better than the torx head screws.
Have you ever tried to clean blood, brains and goo out of torx screw heads? it's a PITA
 
CA's and epoxies are still chemicals. Although they may have a terrific shear strength, seal out moisture, etc, etc, they are still chemicals and eventually, they will degrade and fail as they all absorb moisture over time and oxidize. I know for an absolute fact this is true as I researched this for the areospace industry and so they have a lifetime, ultimate strength, residual strength, and PM schedule.

So, as you all pointed out, metal to metal first, mechanical second, and glue third, probably with one of the first two.

Keep up the good work.

Larry
Tinkerer
 
I use epoxy as a sealer for the reason Rick mentioned above and rely on it only as a sealer. When you look at it in a certain light, "glue wars" becomes a source of comedic entertainment.
 
Totally agree with you there, BMK. I would never rely on adhesive alone.... especially for slab handles. Hidden tangs are a bit different but I still like getting a pin in there.

Most of my handles are held on by string..... lol....

Incidentally, I knew what your OP meant.... I was just bustin' yer nachos.

Rick
 
It's ok to agree with me just don't let anyone know...lest the village elders rise up and smite thee - lol

Rick Marchand said:
Totally agree with you there, BMK. I would never rely on epoxy alone.... especially for slab handles. Hidden tangs are a bit different but I still like getting a pin in there.

My handles are held on by string..... lol....



Rick
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8 months, 100 knives, extensive research...ROFL...keep it simple monkey its a midtech scandi, w/ routered micarta, glue and pin those scales! Why use allen/torx if you chamfer the thong? Blood and brains can get scrubbed up real quick, and some people like to be able to "disassemble" oil, maintain, and utilize the ease of sharpening when you can remove the scales, on a knife that is not built w/ "faux" removable ones?? Ive been makin knives as long you, hope to see something new from you/tony, offer still stands if you wanna swap blades!!:DGHaile
 
Good thread BMK. I think epoxy should be viewed as a sealant only. Loveless took this approach decades ago, his knives are withstanding the test of time.
Rick, I have recently started making knives with removeable scales but they are usualy coated.
 
I'm not making any new knives without glue and mechanical fasteners, unless there is good reason. However, it seems to me that many established makers have used appropriate glue for bonds and pins for shear strength and have had no problems. I think the glue wars thread is a good one. Surface preparation and choice of adhesive for the application appear to be the most important factors. To me, it seems that glue and pins is good, peened pins or flared tubes is better, Corbys or other threaded mechanics and glue is best.
 
OK Rick and BMK...:mad:
If you guys are going to be civil and agree with each other I'll have to......... No?, wait, What if????, Hmmmmmmm :confused:

Ok, but keep playing nice :)
( I know you two are up to something) ;)

The Elders have spoken! :D:D:D
 
Serious tools depend on serious connections.



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