Gransfor Bruks orCouncil Tool Velvicut Hudson Bay

fmendez

fmendez

Joined
Dec 20, 2007
Messages
355
After using hardware axes for Camping and backcountry; I decided to save and get a GB, then found out about the Council Tool premium Velvicut and the fact it is Made ithe US makes it a strong contender in my decision of what to buy.
However, after reading the posts here I'm confused that I can't find a review of the Council Tool in action.
Help!

Paco
 
Depends on what you want.

I have no first hand experience with the Council Velvicut line, yet. I have a GB scandanivian and a hatchet. The scandanvian I find too small, and the hatchet is awesome. However, I am not a bushcraft guy, I am a redneck axe user.

First thing you must decide, is this axe everyday, or pretty common for use, or backpacking/backcountry? (when I say everyday, I mean firewood, kinling, general chores, etc)
 
Hi Op. 1975
I'll use it as an utility ax, general chores in base camp. I have titanium replacement in both shoulders and although I can swing an axe I prefer it not to be too large, heavy but effective in splitting/chopping wood for a fire, that kind of thing. The hardware store axe made me work extra and too much effort keeping the edge.
If you consider yourself a redneck axe user, then I think you are qualified to recommend an axe
Paco
 
You are probably going to want something in the 2 to 2.5 lb range - which would mean you have a lot of options. All depends, how much cashola you want to spend, how much time sharpening, upkeep, etc.
 
I think you're not going to have much luck finding a review since the council tool axes are relatively new.
 
Although Operator's BMC axe is made by Council and has the same head as their Velvicut American Felling Axe.
 
I'm considering the GB becuse is in my price range, around 120. The Council appeals to me since is made here but read too many conflicting post and no reviews. I don't mind keeping it sharp and maintaining it but I don't want to do the edge every time I use it. It is going to get used and abused but maintained well. I take care of all my tools but they are put to work.
Paco
 
I don't own the council, but I do own a couple of GB that I bought to see how they were in comparison to what I make, and I own an old Norlund Hudson Bay pattern that was the best ax I had used until I started to make my own.

I really like the Hudson Bay pattern. It'll outwork its weight. Not something I'd use to bust up the root ball of a mesquite tree down amongst flint rocks, but if you keep it to cutting wood, it does quite well. If Council executed their version well, it should serve you quite nicely.

The Gransfors Bruks I would say are very well made and are quite sharp, but they are not made to deal with hardwoods. If you are going to be using it a lot on spruce and pine they should work wonders, but if you are going to be cutting hardwoods, it's not what they were built to handle.

The ones I make are based on the Hudson Bay pattern directly because of my experience with that old Norlund. Prior to that, I used old double-bit axes exclusively, and they are still great tools, especially for mesquite clearing where I don't want to be using a fine tool because I am cutting below ground level and will be hitting flint chunks upon occasion.
 
Storm Crow, good point. I should have said that it will be used mostly in the White Mountains in NH and Down East
Maine. Mostly hardwoods
Paco
 
Personally I'd go with the Council then. The US Forestry Service uses their axes. :)
 
Buy gransfors scandinavian and you won't regret. I have dozens of axe, use all of them, but no one can beat GB, even if you are working with hardwood, like ironwood (caesalpinea ferrea), santos woods (machaerium sp) , etc. Very easy to sharpen.
 
Storm Crow said:
The Gransfors Bruks I would say are very well made and are quite sharp, but they are not made to deal with hardwoods. If you are going to be using it a lot on spruce and pine they should work wonders, but if you are going to be cutting hardwoods, it's not what they were built to handle.
Click to expand...
Why is the GB not good for hardwood? I've heard this before from a blogger in maine who says they tend to wedge in because of the concave bit to eye transition IIRC. Is that your experience?
 
I have a 10 year old made in the USA collins or council - can't remember which - and have been consistently impressed with how much the geometry on that 1.75# axe head lets it do. Bites deep, doesn't bind, doesn't weigh me down a lot, and the 26" handle doesn't get in the way but allows me to use it one or 2 handed.
 
Shotgun said:
Why is the GB not good for hardwood? I've heard this before from a blogger in maine who says they tend to wedge in because of the concave bit to eye transition IIRC. Is that your experience?
Click to expand...

I say that because I saw it already visibly losing its edge after cutting through a mesquite tree that was 2" - 3" in diameter. Mesquite is fairly hard, but not as hard as other woods that I have to deal with here in central Texas. I don't knock GB at all, but they don't seem to be built for the same kind of trees that are prevalent in Texas. I didn't mess with changing the edge geometry because I bought them to see how the ones I make compare with how the GB factory makes them since they seem to be the go-to tool for many in the ax-using world who are willing to pay more money for a quality tool.
 
Hi Paco,

I am in the process of field testing a Council Tool Velvicut Hudson Bay Axe. I haven't posted a full field report yet because mine was a first run test model and Council is currently making some final corrections to the axe. Because mine was a test model, the edge came a bit too thick. However, after thinning it some the axe does indeed chop very well. This axe is extremely promising, as the 2lb head is an excellent chopper and splitter. That said, Council should be getting back to me soon with an update on these changes and I should be able to post an update soon.

Cheers, CW
 
Hi everyone this is why I joined the forum, hearing all comments and trying to sort out and decide what work best for
Me. In these times I need to make sure I get the right tool for the money and if is spent in the US better, however I'm well aware of GB reputation and if I think it is the right axe for me I'll spring for it.
CW, I'll be looking for your HB's findings, I actually contacted Council Tool regarding tweaking the prototype since the Velvicut HB is such a new product but I have not received their reply yet
I thanks everyone for your assistance and keep letting me know your thoughts on the matter
Best,
Paco
 
I am a notorious GB critic. I think they are a terribly over priced, light working axe. If you try to cut larger stuff the light weight and poor profiling hinder it. For carving and kindling and whatnot they are probably great, but I use my axes for more than that.
 
Hi all, I am new to the forum.
Interesting post... I like the way the Gransfors axes cut and are easy to resharpen, but be careful when using them for harder types of wood.

I've been cutting wood and heating my home with it for over 15 years. I currently own 2 Gransfors (Hunters axe and a mini axe) But I have also personally broken 2 of their blades.

I had a small forest axe that chipped while limbing a small oak that had fallen on the back of my property. I laso had the bottom of the beard chip on my mini hatchet. Both tools were being used correctly, but now I am reading that their axes are intended for soft wood like connifers.

I happen to think that since I purchased both axes around the same time frame, that maybe these two were part of a bad heat-treat batch. Please note, I haven't had an issue with either of my replacement axes from them.

Either way, I've never had that happen to me before and I own and use everything from old Collins to Plumb to Marbles.

If I were you and were looking for an all-around camp axe and doing primarilly SPLITTING,
go with the Velvicut Hudson Bay. 5160 is a great steel and the profile/angle of the head/face will excell at splitting.
If you're going to be cutting soft wood for shelter/hunting blinds etc, the Gransfors is a very nice axe and makes short work of small sapplings.

I might purchase the VELVICUT myself, and if I do, I'll post a review on here with pics.

Good Luck!
 
Casehardn said:
I had a small forest axe that chipped while limbing a small oak that had fallen on the back of my property. I laso had the bottom of the beard chip on my mini hatchet. Both tools were being used correctly, but now I am reading that their axes are intended for soft wood like connifers.
Click to expand...
That's a joke, I've used them on oak and beech without any problem, and many others have.

Regarding 5160, this point seems to come up all the time, it's hardly different from what GB uses, it has higher carbon content but the fact it is tempered significantly lower won't allow this to show.

Also if you're doing mostly splitting, most hardware store axes will do.
 
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Ravaillac said:
That's a joke, I've used them on oak and beech without any problem, and many others have.

Regarding 5160, this point seems to come up all the time, it's hardly different from what GB uses, it has higher carbon content but the fact it is tempered significantly lower won't allow this to show.

Also if you're doing mostly splitting, most hardware store axes will do.
Click to expand...

It is possible.
 
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