Grinder idler wheel question

B

Brekfast

Joined
Dec 9, 2005
Messages
57
Here is my dilemma:

I need 4 wheels for my KMG clone. I tried to order it from Beaumont metalworks, but they don't ship to Canada.

The only grinder wheels I was able to locate was from Downie Knife Supply, (Thanks Jeff if you are reading this !) who told me he can get me 3-5/8" diameter 2-1/5" wide wheels with sealed bearings in them.

Now here is the question, can I use 3-5/8" wheels for everything idler, tracking and drive wheel ?

I am asking because on most pictures the idler wheels seem to be 2x2 wheels and I figured there must be a good reason for that.

BTW, the motor will be turning at 1750 rpm.

Thank you for your input in advance.


Henrik
 
Sure, why not? I'm not sure we share the same terminology, though. On a KMG, the idler is the tracking wheel. If, however, you mean the wheels on a platen, that's fine too as long as you design it to accomodate the larger size. Go to Ed Caffrey's page and look at his KMG that uses contact wheels on the platen. You may wanna do that instead, and expand your versatility.

The drive on a KMG is only 4". Not much difference. (Idler is 3.5") They are 2 1/2" wide. Did you mean 2 1/5" or is that a typo?

Something else you haven't mentioned is whether these wheels are crowned. You need at least one crowned wheel. My "early" KMG has only one and tracks great. I believe newer KMG's have both drive and idler crowned. I don't think I'd want crowned wheels on a platen, though. That might make it a bit squirelly, IMO.

Hope that helps.
 
Mike,

I was using the incorrect name I think. By "idler" wheel I meant the two small (2x2) wheels on each end of the platen attachment

The wheels I can get are 3 5/8" diamter and the width is: 2 1/5" or so I was told. I grew up using the metric system so I am a little uncertain when it comes to inches.

The wheels are supposed to be crowned yes. I will definitely take a look at Ed Caffrey's page.

ThHank you.

Henrik
 
Henrik, I sorta don't like the idea of crowned wheels on the platen. Might make tracking real touchy with so many in the loop. Might stretch your belts down the centerline a lot faster, too. You could always take those to a machine shop, though, and have 'em flattened out on the face.

Rashid11 has a couple threads on building his homemade "KMG" that used a couple other sources for wheels. You may want to search through his past posts to see his solutions. they were USA, but perhaps ship to Canada. Or should I say Quebec, now that it's a separate country. ;) :D

If you don't have severe dollar constraints, I found that Caffrey's innovation with using two different contact wheels on the platen and making it so you could turn the platen to expose them created a very versatile single-attachment device. I'd call it "highly recommended".

The only problem I see with 2 1/5" (56mm) is that the belt will not have any slop room on either side. There is a slight chamfer on the KMG wheels, so their effective width is not much more than your wheels. Gut feeling says it won't be a problem. Thankfully, it'd be a long ride from Montreal to smack me if I'm wrong. ;)

I would say to you that there are a bundle of people who've made their own grinders using many different configurations and components. This suggests that there is no single correct answer. The one common need is for good bearings. Some have found out the hard way using industrial coated casters that despite a high weight-bearing capacity, they're just not meant to spin a thousand times a minute.
 
Mike,

I have read Rashid's posts. I think he had access to a lathe and was able to modify those caster wheels to suit his purposes. Unfortunately I don't have a lathe (even if I did I have never used one), and would prefer to use wheels that are well made to minimize the chances of something going wrong.

To be honest, the Beaumont wheels would still be my first choice and will try to find someone in the US to where they could be shipped then ship it from there to Canada.

I saw Ed Caffrey's machine and it does look great I will consider incorporating it in my design, if not at the first pass then once I will get it going then definitely, I think it is "just" the modification of the platen assembly.

What you said about the crowned platen wheels makes me worried, also the wheels in question are made of plastic so I am not sure how they could be flattened out.

Quebec is not a separate country even though some would like to see it become one, it's giving a headache to all Canadians who live in this otherwise beautiful province.


Thanks.

Henrik
 
I am sure you could find a machinist or even a home shop machinist who could either turn your wheels to make them flat or even potentially make the wheels for you.

I can give you a few names near you if you would like. Just need to know where you are.
 
Brekfast said:
Mike,

I have read Rashid's posts. I think he had access to a lathe and was able to modify those caster wheels to suit his purposes. Unfortunately I don't have a lathe (even if I did I have never used one), and would prefer to use wheels that are well made to minimize the chances of something going wrong.

.
.
What you said about the crowned platen wheels makes me worried, also the wheels in question are made of plastic so I am not sure how they could be flattened out.

Quebec is not a separate country even though some would like to see it become one, it's giving a headache to all Canadians who live in this otherwise beautiful province.


Thanks.

Henrik
Click to expand...

Henrik, somewhere there will be a source for those wheels in Canada. Have you queried an "industrial supply" house in the Montreal area? Have you contacted the Canadian Knifemakers Guild through their website? How about "Rob!" Ridley, who frequents this forum? (Sorry to be spitting so much at you. Just things coming off the flat spot on top of my pointed head.) Heck, you might even be able to drive south of the border and have a packege sent to you care of General Delivery or something like "Will Call" at a US Post Office.

Yes, Rashid has a lathe and modified some of his wheels. My thought was to check sources like Surplus Center and see what they have currently. They may ship to Canada. that Sunray company may be a source for wheel, too. They were mentioned again recently.

The plastic wheels could be flattened on a lathe by a machine shop, if need be. Many machinists routinely cut plastics and get wonderful finishes.

The only reason I mentioned the nation thing and Quebec was because of this recent development in Canada:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061128.wnation28/BNStory/National/home
 
I will see if such arrangement could be made with a US post office, the border is only about 1 hour from where I live so it would be doable. There is a small machine shop near where I live and I asked them how much it would take to machine these wheels, they will get back to me on that.

I am grateful that you are spitting all these ideas at me, it helps :)

THanks.

Henrik
 
You're welcome.

How much of a PITA is it to get something like these platen wheels through Customs if shipped by a private party from the US? How large is the chance it won't make it to you shipped without "mis-declaration" through UPS or the US Postal Service? How willing are you to take that chance?
 
Cont'd:

What I'm saying is I would be willing to re-address a package shipped to me from Rob, take it to USPS or UPS and send it to you. You would have to prepay Rob's charges obviously, and you would have to tell me exactly what to put onto the paperwork (has to be honest, though vague would work for me. :D).

In return, you could send me one of those really cute McGill coeds from down on Rue St Denis with that really nice French accent! ;):D

(With my luck, Nanc'll read this!)

I would be willing to trust you to reimburse me the shipping costs.
 
Mike,

I REALLY appreciate your offer !

If at all possible I'd prefer not to impose on you. I called Fedex to find out if there is a way to ship it that would make life easier for the folks at Beaumont. Fedex said I can open a shipping account with them and basically I could handle the whole shippng frolm here, they would just go and pick up the package frolm Beaumont. So I called them and asked if it would be ok to do it this way. The person I spoke to kindly agreed, so it may just work out after all. I payed for the goods and now I will set this account up with Fedex.

I will keep you posted on how it goes !

As for the cute McGill coeds...

I am afraid Canada's and the State's finest may take a dim view on my shipping them up your way. Trafficking with women or something they call it ?

If you are ever up here in my neck of the woods then something could be arranged though :P


Henrik
 
I'm really glad it looks llike things may work out to get you exactly the components you wanted, Henrik!

I understand about the co-ed, too.:o Ah, well. A younger woman would kill me, anyway. I hadn't thought about it enough to consider that the authorities would take offense. I had been more concerned with how to keep a mistress in a closet out of view of my wife. ;) I realized neither would like it very much. So, I guess it was a bad idea all the way around. :D

We visited Montreal once about 15 years ago for a scientific conference. It's a beautiful city. Full of history and fun, both. Not to mention all the clothing boutiques for a woman with a credit card!

Good luck with the wheels. My offer will stand if you need it. :)
 
conestoga contact wheel can solve any wheel issues you might have. They are located in cambridge ontario, and mfg. contact wheels. Ph. # 1-519-624-4601. They coat all of my wheels and also do the resurfacing when I can't. They are a small family operation and give good service.
Paul
www.savageknives.ca
savageknives@golden.net
 
Henrik

Montreal is not that far from the border. Find a PO Box place in a border town on the US side that will receive stuff for you. You can combine it with a cross-border shopping trip. I used to do that when I lived in Vancouver.

Phil
 
Hi Phil,

Beaumont does not ship to PO boxes, neither does Grizzly. Grizzly has a 10" contact wheel for $65 or so which is a great price - if they would ship here that is.

Paul,

I called conestoga contact wheel. They do have the 10" wheel for about $240, which is basicaly the same as the wheel from Grizly only 4 times the price. I understand them, they are a smaller outfit and they make it there from scratch, I'd still prefer paying say $130 shipping included than $240 plus shipping.

Told a friend of mine about how difficult it is getting the parts for the grinder together, he was consoling me and said "why don't you take up woodworking instead ? There is a superb selection of woodworking supplies in Canada."

YEAH :grumpy:

Mike,

Fedex, when I called them to open an account told me that I was misinformed
earlier and there is no option that would allow me to handle all the shipping from here, so scratch that too.

I may have to take you up on your offer .. god knows I tried.

Henrik
 
Henrik, my offer stands. There is USPS, UPS, and Fedex nearby. The important thing will be you finding out exactly what forms I need to fill out and exactly what you want me to say on the forms. There have been a number of stories here about Canadian Customs "losing" packages, nodnodwinkwink. I successfully sent some L6 to a Canadian maker once labeling it "metal samples." i don't know how to appraoch finished items.

I'd be willing to split it up and send a single wheel to "test the waters" so to speak.

Just what the hell is "free trade" supposed to mean, anyway? Sure doesn't seem that way. :grumpy:
 
I just had another thought. Check out the Canadian reg's for "Christmas presents". Maybe the restrictions are looser and would allow this. I could remove the invoices from the boxes and mail them too you. How could they prove a knifemaker wouldn't want to give a friend idler wheels for a present? :p
 
I aml emailing you my tel# and other details, if there is a number where I could reach you I could maybe give you a call.

Thanks.

Henrik
 
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