Grinding the bevel on a blade???

S

SeanMK

Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
43
Im new at this, and also on this forum. LOTS of great info on here. I have been kind of playing around in my shop. How do you guys get the bevel on your blades so perfect?? Just practice? or jigs, or what?
 
Welcome To Blade forums,
I free hand the bevels. Some people get the hang of it fairly quickly some it takes a year of practice. Having somebody show you will reduce the learning curve.
Fill out your profile and you may find a knife maker near you.
 
Practice, practice and more practice. After a while it just becomes natural. Try and learn with sharp belts, cuts down on the frustration level quite substantially.
 
Ditto on the sharp belts. I thought dull belts would slow the mistakes that I made and save me money, but they just cause you to make more mistakes and maybe even develop bad habits. A fresh belt cuts clean and will respond much better to your inputs.

A couple of tips that I've found useful.... When I first started out, I thought that you could set the bevel angle from the beginning and grind it right in. This can be done to some extent using an external reference like a bubble jig Fred Rowe sells; however, most makers use some variation of the following method:

First, mark your desired edge width. I personally mark two lines along the edge about 1/32" apart. Next, I grind a roughly 45 degree bevel on each side that goes just shy of that line. This basically sets my pre-heat treat edge thickness for me. After that, it's just a matter of walking the top of the bevel grind up to the spine. It's a gradual process that as the flat becomes bigger, it becomes easier to feel the bevel when grinding. If you need to thin the edge more, you just place slightly more pressure on the edge side of the blade, keeping the bevel flat to the platen. If you need to work the grind up higher towards the spine, you place more pressure on the spine side of the bevel, keeping the bevel flat against the palten.

Griding edge up is helpful in that you can see where the edge meets the belt, and you can focus on this space to accomplish what you need to with your grinds.

Try and keep the sparks coming off the middle of the platen as opposed to the edges when you're first starting out.

Don't grind pissed off or frustrated. If you're starting to make mistakes, put it down and come back to it later.

Tuck your elbows in firmly to your sides and move your body rather than trying to do all your movement with your arms. You'll create a more stable and repeatable foundation to grind from using this kind of technique.

Also, I do most of my roughing work with a 36 grit belt. That means I need to leave a little bit of room to play with as I switch to 60, 120, 320, 400 grit belts. Sneak the bevel up to the spine gradually, and don't finish it off until after you heat treat, and then only with a higher grit belt like 400.


The bottom line is that it takes practice to develop the motor programs and control necessary to make those perfect grinds. Some of us may never reach the skill level as some of the master knifemakers here on these forums; however, you WILL improve with practice.

Also, be aware that you WILL make mistakes, and that's part of it. Many of the mistakes can be corrected with patience and a light touch. I remember starting out I would spend several hours getting a blade to where I wanted it only to screw up and have to spend even more time trying to correct it. That's how skills develop. You can't teach someone excatly how to make the little corrections to change the grind line just so, or how to listen for the exact sound you expect to hear when everything is grinding just where you want it. But time and experience and practice teaches those things. I use all my senses while grinding. I listen to the sound of the grind, see the look of the blade against the platen, and feel the location of the grind under my fingers. Go grind out 10 blades, making each to the absolute best of your ability, and I guarantee you'll have a better understanding of how things work at the end than what you started with and probably a better looking knife as well.

--nathan
 
Definately tons of practice!! Go slow and steady. keep your elbows locked against your side. Move your body side to side while grinding for a more steady movement.
 
silver_pilate said:
Ditto on the sharp belts. I thought dull belts would slow the mistakes that I made and save me money, but they just cause you to make more mistakes and maybe even develop bad habits. A fresh belt cuts clean and will respond much better to your inputs.

A couple of tips that I've found useful.... When I first started out, I thought that you could set the bevel angle from the beginning and grind it right in. This can be done to some extent using an external reference like a bubble jig Fred Rowe sells; however, most makers use some variation of the following method:

First, mark your desired edge width. I personally mark two lines along the edge about 1/32" apart. Next, I grind a roughly 45 degree bevel on each side that goes just shy of that line. This basically sets my pre-heat treat edge thickness for me. After that, it's just a matter of walking the top of the bevel grind up to the spine. It's a gradual process that as the flat becomes bigger, it becomes easier to feel the bevel when grinding. If you need to thin the edge more, you just place slightly more pressure on the edge side of the blade, keeping the bevel flat to the platen. If you need to work the grind up higher towards the spine, you place more pressure on the spine side of the bevel, keeping the bevel flat against the palten.

Griding edge up is helpful in that you can see where the edge meets the belt, and you can focus on this space to accomplish what you need to with your grinds.

Try and keep the sparks coming off the middle of the platen as opposed to the edges when you're first starting out.

Don't grind pissed off or frustrated. If you're starting to make mistakes, put it down and come back to it later.

Tuck your elbows in firmly to your sides and move your body rather than trying to do all your movement with your arms. You'll create a more stable and repeatable foundation to grind from using this kind of technique.

Also, I do most of my roughing work with a 36 grit belt. That means I need to leave a little bit of room to play with as I switch to 60, 120, 320, 400 grit belts. Sneak the bevel up to the spine gradually, and don't finish it off until after you heat treat, and then only with a higher grit belt like 400.


The bottom line is that it takes practice to develop the motor programs and control necessary to make those perfect grinds. Some of us may never reach the skill level as some of the master knifemakers here on these forums; however, you WILL improve with practice.

Also, be aware that you WILL make mistakes, and that's part of it. Many of the mistakes can be corrected with patience and a light touch. I remember starting out I would spend several hours getting a blade to where I wanted it only to screw up and have to spend even more time trying to correct it. That's how skills develop. You can't teach someone excatly how to make the little corrections to change the grind line just so, or how to listen for the exact sound you expect to hear when everything is grinding just where you want it. But time and experience and practice teaches those things. I use all my senses while grinding. I listen to the sound of the grind, see the look of the blade against the platen, and feel the location of the grind under my fingers. Go grind out 10 blades, making each to the absolute best of your ability, and I guarantee you'll have a better understanding of how things work at the end than what you started with and probably a better looking knife as well.

--nathan
Click to expand...


Quoted for excellence. :thumbup:


That's one of the best responses to this question I've seen in years.
 
Nathan is absolutely correct about grinding while pissed off. When you get to that stage STOP and go do something else. Come back when you cool off and you will do better. Learning what NOT to do is as much a part as learning what to do. Correcting mistakes is another big part of the learning process. Cheers.
 
nathan ,,, That was spot on my friend the best I have heard yet. might be a sticky if you ask me.
 
Also, don't quit on a mistake. The brain tends to remember the last thing you did. If the last thing you did was wrong, it'll be harder to re-learn it right.
 
I just make mistakes and correct them as the bevel walks up the width of the blade. With practice the mistakes have gotten smaller, but every pass usually still usually leaves something to correct on the next one. By the time I am at the finer grits on the grinder, the corrections are small enough to make by hand on the granite plate.
 
How quickly do you want to learn to grind blades? If you have the time to invest, learning to grind blades using only your hands and the grinder itself is a worthy endeavor.
If you want to learn in a weekend, pm me.

Regards, Fred
 
Golly gee...thanks fellas ;) :D.

BTW, Justin makes a great point. Don't sweat an ugly looking grind or goof-ups early on in the process of grinding a blade. As the bevel progresses, it will be easier to get it just right. Remember, at first, you're just going through the process of removing all that extra steel that's not a knife. It's purely stock removal. As it closer to being a finished bevel/knife, that's when you have to have a lighter touch and slow down a tad to get the bevel where you want it.

--nathan
 
Fred.Rowe said:
How quickly do you want to learn to grind blades? If you have the time to invest, learning to grind blades using only your hands and the grinder itself is a worthy endeavor.
If you want to learn in a weekend, pm me.

Regards, Fred
Click to expand...

BTW, Fred's jig is a neat little device. :thumbup::thumbup: It definitely takes out some of the learning curve until your body develops the consistency it needs. Remember, even if you're using the jig, develop good foundational skills that will serve you no matter what you're grinding and improve your results with and without the jig.

--nathan
 
silver_pilate said:
BTW, Fred's jig is a neat little device. :thumbup::thumbup: It definitely takes out some of the learning curve until your body develops the consistency it needs. Remember, even if you're using the jig, develop good foundational skills that will serve you no matter what you're grinding and improve your results with and without the jig.

--nathan
Click to expand...

Your comments on building good foundation skills is right on. It makes seance no matter what skill you are learning.


There was no teacher available to me when I started making knives ten years ago; so I invented a teacher and that is what my jig is, a good teacher and it doesn't talk too much either.:)

Also, without perseverance and desire, no jig or tool or piece of machinery can help you to become an accomplished maker.

Good advise that you posted on how to learn to grind free hand.

Regards, Fred
 
It always amazes me how great and helpful BF is... Great advice here from Experienced Makers!
 
As a newbie myself I give all the above a big +1. it won't be overnight but if you practice good habits it isn't too bad. Just don't expect to get exactly what you had in mind every time right off. I use Fred's jig to help me keep my bevels flat and at a predictable angle, big help. It still makes YOU do the work, but it gives an instant and repeatable reference point.
 
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