Guard fitting?

[Crag the Brewer]

A goal of mine as a newer knifemaker is to work on some guarded blades this year.

I Really like the looks of Bob Dozier's Bare Bones Buffalo Skinner.
I'm not sure if he was the original designer of this knife, I see that he does Loveless and some Randal looking blades too?

For better researching, what is the style of the slip on half guard called? Loveless design/influence?
Also if anybody has some tips, or drawings, Or if you own or held the knife I mentioned above I'd love to hear about it.... It just speaks to me and my own style.
Mine is going to be a simpler design, full tang, not tapered right away

I wish more of them were for sale, or popped up more often.


Thanks.

 

[eric brinkerhoff]

For that type of guard there will be a notch in the blade down by the ricasso. The guard is slotted and slips up into the notch. One pin hole is drilled through the guard and blade.

 

[Crag the Brewer]

For that type of guard there will be a notch in the blade down by the ricasso. The guard is slotted and slips up into the notch. One pin hole is drilled through the guard and blade.

Yup, That part I understood.

How easy is it to do? Is there tricks for that long slot, and not having the legs spread?
Drill the pin hole and the guard hole at the same time, pre heat treating....
In woodworking, you offset the holes so when you pound the pin in, it draws the assembly tight. Do they do that here too?

*And is there a name for that style of guard?

Some are doing micarta ones now, they look pretty nice too

 

[eric brinkerhoff]

It's pretty easy to do you can actually buy pre-slotted guard blanks that are nothing more than a rectangular piece of brass or nickel silver or whatever with the slot pre cut in. I don't regard using those as cheating any more than using a Corby bolt other type of fastener. I make my own on the milling machine. Making the notch in the knife blank is no big deal either if you make it a bit too wide for your brass guard you can do a little hammering and peening to get it to look nice and snug . As far as that woodworkers trick of drilling the holes slightly offset I don't think that's necessary in fact it might backfire when you go to fit it up for final assembly.

 

[lawp]

You should be aware that a guarded Loveless or Dozier knife would have the blade-guard joint soldered. The solder fillet would cover or fill any gaps in the fit. Not to say these masters would tolerate a less than perfect fit, but you might. I consider the solder joint essential to the sanitary condition of a hunter, to prevent bacteria from growing in the joint.
Tip: Nickel-silver guard material, being fairly soft, you can peen the slot for a tight fit.

 

[Crag the Brewer]

You should be aware that a guarded Loveless or Dozier knife would have the blade-guard joint soldered. The solder fillet would cover or fill any gaps in the fit. Not to say these masters would tolerate a less than perfect fit, but you might. I consider the solder joint essential to the sanitary condition of a hunter, to prevent bacteria from growing in the joint.
Tip: Nickel-silver guard material, being fairly soft, you can peen the slot for a tight fit.

I was wondering if the purest was going to scoff at epoxy?

I'm not opposed to trying silver solder, if I can find the right stuff?

I know "homebrewers" with sometimes solder ferules and whatnot onto kegs.

I, learned how to tig weld stainless to avoid that.


Are people grinding or filing the curves, especially the under, finger area?

Thanks.

 

[Lorien]

I'm just finishing up this knife, which was my first try at a slotted guard. I put the notch at the top, since it's less of a stress riser in that location for a knife like this.
Here's how I did it;

-drill the hole and cut the notch on the steel before heat treating. Make sure there are no sharp angles at the bottom of the notch since it's possible cracks could develop during quenching
-square up the guard material
-turn the drill press table parallel to the drill bit and mount the guard to the table with a clamp and drill through your centerline about where the hole in the tang is. Make sure there's enough material at the ends so you don't run short when it comes time to shape the guard
-drill a hole a little ways in from where the top of the slot in the guard's gonna be
-saw out the slot up to the hole and leave a little material on both sides
-mount the guard to the file guide and gradually widen the slot until it fits perfectly over the tang
-file out the top of the slot until the hole in the guard lines up with the hole in the tang
-once it fits and the pin will go through, grind out the rough profile of the guard, staying pretty close to its final profile
-chamfer the pin hole with a rotary tool
-cut the pin to length, so it's a little proud from the guard
-epoxy it all up. I was thinking about soldering, but my tolerances were pretty tight and I didn't feel like the gaps were significant enough to require hiding
-before epoxy is dry, peen the ends of the pin so they fill the chamfers. NOTE- it's way easier to do this when you can rest your pin on a square surface. In my case I had to rig up a contraption so that I could have an anvil surface on the side of the pin I wasn't peening. It was a huge pain in the ass

 

[eric brinkerhoff]

The notch in Lorien's upside down slotted guard is radiused on the inside corners and that's a good thing so as not to develop stress risers. As far as soldering I don't see a whole lot of soldering going on in today's knife making world and I feel like epoxy is good enough to do the job. If epoxy is good enough to seal bolsterless and guardless handle scales and why wouldn't it seal that guard. One mistake I've made when doing a slotted guard of this type is to not plan ahead where the radius for the curvature of the finger area is going to be located sometimes it's possible to grind through into the notch that you made in the knife blank so make sure the notch is deep enough and located properly corresponding to where the radius of the finger guard is going to be grown if you get what I'm saying you don't want to grind away the metal of the Tang where it meets the guard

 

[Alex Topfer]

My advice is just start doing some. It takes a lot of practice to learn the processes.
I like soldered for the strength and lack of plastic, but epoxy seems fine. The fit and design is more vital IMO

Micarta is easier to work with, but less forgiving since it's not ductile. Good practice option

 

[eric brinkerhoff]

Yes micarta is less ductile and therefore the slot needs to be much more exact. Brass, nickel silver, and even stainless steel will usually respond to a little bit of peening.

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

A lot of makers fit guards with JB Weld. It is a good gap filler/sealer, cleans up with alcohol before curing (acetone after curing) and looks good.
Mixing some silvering powder in a good epoxy does the same thing. You can find silvering powder at craft and art stores. It is actually super-fine aluminum powder, Pearl-Ex is a good and cheap brand of paint and resin pigment powders.

 

[Bühlmann]

I have more silver solder than I can use in two lifetimes. You have my contact info if you’d like to try some out.

 

[Crag the Brewer]

I have more silver solder than I can use in two lifetimes. You have my contact info if you’d like to try some out.

Haha...That's Awesome, Thank You...... I have a Different project that I'm going to bug you on, later this Summer...... ;P
I don't wanna wear out my welcome

 

[Natlek]

A lot of makers fit guards with JB Weld. It is a good gap filler/sealer, cleans up with alcohol before curing (acetone after curing) and looks good.
Mixing some silvering powder in a good epoxy does the same thing. You can find silvering powder at craft and art stores. It is actually super-fine aluminum powder, Pearl-Ex is a good and cheap brand of paint and resin pigment powders.

Nothing is more disgusting/uglier on knife than a gap in the guard I would like to see picture how you fill *gap* in guard with JB weld , and with silver powder too.

Do it right and there is no gap ...........................just line

 

[Natlek]

Yup, That part I understood.

How easy is it to do? Is there tricks for that long slot, and not having the legs spread?
Drill the pin hole and the guard hole at the same time, pre heat treating....
In woodworking, you offset the holes so when you pound the pin in, it draws the assembly tight. Do they do that here too?

*And is there a name for that style of guard?

Some are doing micarta ones now, they look pretty nice too

Usain Bolt runs 100 meters under ten seconds, easy. ........... Me ? Unattainable
Ok, it's a little different with the guard. It depends on which tool you use and skill you have .Good thing is that if you overdo it you can use that guard on little thicker knife , if you are patient ......................