Guys, lets compose a cheatsheet about what to look for/avoid in a sword

K

Kmark

Joined
Mar 21, 2000
Messages
320
I recently received 2 emails from people wondering if that 'stainless steel katana' they were planning to buy is any good...oh and they asked if they can cut through small trees and rocks. I'm appalled at the amount of BS floating out there, and also by the willingness of some people to accept it at face value.

I propose a solution...make a FAQ of sorts that will establish SOME basic guidelines about what to look for in a sword, and which blades to avoid like the plague.

Tips on how to purchase a modern reproduction of a sword
-----------------------

1. Avoid stainless steel replicas like the plague.

2. Never buy any blade made in India or Pakistan...at least, until they get their act together and produce something that is even halfway decent.

3. Avoid swords that claim to cut through concrete, rocks, engine blocks, etc. Swords were made for killing people, not trees.

4. Companies that make production knives (sometimes of excellent quality) usually don't do as well when they start into swords. Cold Steel comes to mind.

5. There is a very good reason why some production swords are so dirt cheap.

6. Take the marketing language with a grain of salt. 'High carbon steel' can mean many things. The term 'battle ready swords' is an euphemism for junk made in third world countries.


 
While I respect custom makers and the love of making weapons for the sake of the craft above their own profit and the high level of honesty of the work many of them offer...

One thing a person has to remember is that anyone who is trying to sell a blade is TRYING to sell it. The things said can vary in honesty depending on the knowledge and conscience the salesman has. Marketing is marketing...the art of making something appealing. Given some time, I'm sure some genius could find a way to market a sword with a corndog for a handle and make it sound worthwhile to some some poor unlearned soul.

And while it sounds somewhat negative...some people who really don't give a damn about swords do not deserve better than some of the crap on the market. The plus side is that it weeds some out. If you are really curious about a blade, and are very interested in getting it...but are spending a lot of money...is it not worth a little time spent getting a second or third opinion?

Do not trust big words, complex-sounding phrases, buzz words, or prices. We have seen this crap before with the early Chen ads if any of you remember them. In marketjutsu, the customer is always uke.

Shinryû.

PS: Just want to reiterate, I'm not trying to degrade the integrity of makers in any way...

[This message has been edited by Robert Marotz (edited 02-18-2001).]
 
For persons already familiar with swords and their use, I think such a list will only be of limited value, for persons new to sword collecting or “using”, there is something more important: What do I want and what can I afford?
The latter part of the question is easy to answer, the first part, ehemm, not so easy. Many persons (I am not excluding myself here) started years ago with many, many misconceptions (basically: a sword is a kind of a multi-tool that cuts, chops, thrusts unlike anything else on Earth – it might even glow in the dark and will do things even McGuyver did not think of).
For this reason, I would not include stainless steel wallhangers in this list, because they are a very important part of the learning process (no, really, I am serious here). Some people will like them, because they are using them correctly (as wallhangers, doorstoppers, etc.), many will ruin them, trying to defend themselves against those treacherous backyard trees, and will throw the sword away. A few actually might learn from this and use an axe the next time, remembering that obviously, swords where constructed for a different purpose, and they might try to find out what purposes those were. Evolution is great!
wink.gif

So back to the list, maybe the simple question: “what will I use the sword for and what performance from the sword for this special use do (and can) I expect ?” might help.

anton
 
The question 'What kind of sword do I want, and what sort of performance do I demand from it' sounds innocent enough, but I disagree that it is sufficient protection for a new sword collector.

Case in point, look at Toledo swords (on google search). You can easily find swords well into the range of $200 US, sometimes even more, and they're not even 'real' swords (stainless steel).
 
Sorry for any misunderstandings, you are right that this phrase sounds “innocent”, but that it is no protection against mistaking a wallhanger for a sword. I meant it in such a way, that potential buyers should gather all information they are able to get their hands on before purchase (and your rule No. 1 “. Avoid stainless steel replicas like the plague” is a very valuable information covering the problem of “wallhangers vs. swords”). The baseline of my statement was, that mistakes could sometimes have a higher educative value than advices
 
NEW FOR 2001!!!

Introducing the NEW Ninja 2K! Featuring a superbly balanced, highly polished and sharpened high carbon steel blade, the <font color=red>NEW 2K1 Ninja</font> features the revolutionary new Bio/Bot(tm) grip system!
This new State Of The Art gripping system/user interface features a core of pure bio matter, refined, processed, and heat treated to perfection, covered with a layer of resilient, processed, oil quenched botanical foam, giving the <font color=red>2K1 Ninja</font> unparalled "grip-ability."
<font color=DC143C>For those times when nothing less will do.</font>

MSRP 149.95 (shipping and condiments not included)

Just to show it can be done!
wink.gif


------------------
Tráceme no sin la razón, envoltura mi no sin honor
Usual Suspect

[This message has been edited by Ken Cook (edited 02-19-2001).]
 
Speaking for the defence for a moment.
smile.gif
Generalizations are dangerous. "Usually" is about as far as you can safely go with knife talk since there are very important exceptions that you might not want to exclude from or include in your thinking. Likely the best advice you can get is "how well do you know what you're getting when you buy a sword?" The most dangerous aspect of advertising (I used to do it for a living so I know something about it) is not necessarily in what is said as in what is carefully not said. If you take your best description of the finest sword you know of and remove just a couple of the descriptors, you can easily describe a piece of junk with most of the same words.

And on the other side of the coin, some of the very toughest steels made in the world, like those used in the landing gears of carrier based fighter aircraft are stainless, and with novel heat treating *might* become amazingly good blade steels. Using proper steels and construction methods a hollow ground blade *might* be made to outperform traditional flat ground blades. The variables that *might* be applied to making high quality blades are many and growing, and the possible combinations of these are far from exhausted.

*Usually* though, you get what you pay for. As in Chateau Lafitte Roschild is *usually* better than Thunderbird.
smile.gif


------------------
Jerry Hossom
www.hossom.com
The New Tom & Jerry Show
 
Mr. Marotz,

"In Market-jutsu, the customer is always Uke" may be the most insightful comment I have read this year. I plan to steal it and use it liberally, Thanx. :-)
 
Thanks, I think! (unsure of whether to take it as a compliment to the statement or an insult to every other statement...glass is half full?)
 
Federico, you can buy any old Indian sword you wish...the cheatsheet is for modern reproductions. I have not yet seen any modern Indian made sword that even comes close to the quality of old Indian weapons.

And what does 'Uke' mean?
smile.gif
 
Kmark,

"Uke" is a "Dojo Japanese" word that means basically "loser."

The context is for example,
In a Judo class, when students are practicing being thrown, the one who is thrown is "Uke" the one who throws, is refered to as "Tori."

BTW,
Pronounced OO KEY and TOW REE
(The Americanized spelling of the Japanese language requires that every vowel be pronounced, there's no "silent e" for example.)

See?
Ask me what time it is, I'll tell you how to build a clock!
biggrin.gif


------------------
Tráceme no sin la razón, envoltura mi no sin honor
Usual Suspect
 
Ken,

What time is it?
smile.gif


Do we have any recommendations on how to properly fit a sword. How do you know if a sword is right for you. In the old days the blades were often custom fitted to the user (kind of like golf clubs today).

I can see someone having a though time on a technique because the sword they are using is too heavy, or long, or improperly balanced for them, or for what they are trying to do.

 
One who receives
smile.gif


PS: Not2sharp: I'd suggest starting a new thread with your question, since it isn't really on topic in this thread. Just a suggestion...

[This message has been edited by Robert Marotz (edited 02-20-2001).]
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top