Half stops and pinchable blades

quattromori

quattromori

Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
3,426
Hi guys,
I'm starting another another late night (for me) thread...and I know you guys will enlighten me.
So, as most of you know, I recently acquired my first GEC, and I do like it alot. I still need to refine its edge, but everything in the knife is nice.
I had never seen elk, and it's very beautiful and elegant, and the whole knife is very solid and has no play, no flaws, in one word, I love it.
Still, there is one thing I still have to get used to.
Half stops.
This is the first knife I own with half stops, and it still feels weird to me. I guess it will take some time till I get used to it. Every time I open the blade, the half stop finds me unprepared somehow :D
My question is very simple.
What are half stops for? Why some knives have them, and others don't? Do you like this feature in a knife? And if you do, why?
I know this might sound silly to many of you...but, actually, I can't find a good reason for having half stops in a knife...I'm not going to cut anything with the blade folded at 90° :rolleyes:
Looking forward to see you points on this.

Fausto
:cool:
 
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quattromori said:
I know this might sound silly to many of you...but, actually, I can't find a good reason for having half stops in a knife...I'm not going to cut anything with the blade folded at 90° :rolleyes:

Fausto
:cool:
Click to expand...

I have never heard it put quite like that before, Fausto.:) I think most folks consider half stops to be a safety feature more than anything else. It helps to keep the blade from accidentally closing on fingers. Personally, I think they can be either safe or unsafe depending on how the user opens and closes the blade.

I used to have a very slight preference for knives without half stops. Nowadays I have a very strong preference for half stops. My preference for half stops has nothing to do with safety. I like knives with good snap and the half stop gives me an extra snap to enjoy.
 
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I think its a safety feature however I have bled more from knives with half stops (I own two) than others. But in defense of the half stop knives, only one time was because of the before mentioned safety feature. It was Christmas morning and I was unused to half stops, i went to close it felt the stop and then closed my fingers on the knife. Well it snapped again and i bled a lot (blade went through the nail and a good chunk of flesh).


Sorry that wasn't helpful, there are actually two "schools" of thought one the the safety feature, the other is that is is a pattern thing. Some have them and others don't....
 
I think half stops are supposed to be a safety feature - to keep the blade from closing all the way if you somehow accidentally start to close the blade and have your fingers or hand in the way. As to why some knives have them and others don't, I think it's a tradition based upon the particular pattern of the knife. I think some makers use them to show their skill, of which it takes a considerable amount to get the back spring(s) perfectly flush in all three positions.

I don't hate them by any means, but all things considered, given a choice I'd opt not to have them. Once I've carried a knife with half stops for a few days, it then starts to feel "natural" and I'm fine with it. The hard thing, for me anyway, is switching between knives with them and knives without them. YMMV.
 
I've heard that the corners on the the tang help clear debris from the contact area of the spring.
 
David, thanks for the reference.
Honestly, I never saw the half stop as a safety feature. I had never owned a knife with half stops before my GEC, so I admit it's a new thing to me...but I never really thought it would improve safety in any way. I just couldn't see how. I'm glad there is another explanation that makes sense.
Apart from construction details, it does feel odd to me, and I'm glad I'm not the only one. Of course, it's not something that could keep me from buying a knife...

Fausto
:cool:
 
I think it's a safety feature on opening. A really strong spring can be easier to open to the
half stop, rather than trying to open all the way at once. You open it halfway, then tug on it
the rest of the way. Seems that way to me, at least.
 
I was just thinking about this subject today.

I love half stops, I am not sure why, I just do. I assumed they were there as an added safety feature, but I never truly knew why.
This is an interesting subject, I wonder if there is a real reason for it all.
 
I can take or leave half stops, so the lack of them or the presence of them makes little difference to me. My old stockman didn't have them, but the TL-29's I carries in the army did have them. On a small knife like a peanut, I think it's good to have them. Lets you have an extra moment when closing to make sure your fingers are out of the way of the thin sharp little blades when they snap shut. That may be a good thing.:D

Carl.
 
I can understand what is said about the safety feature.

I really like the trapper patterns I have, they all have half stops. Sometimes that half stop makes my nail slip especially with a stout draw and a small nail nick. My Queen trapper #51 has a pretty stout draw, small nick, with a half stop. It can slip easily.

But .... Stockmans are my favorite pattern without half stops. Maybe I am biased. :)
 
Excellent question Fausto!!
It led down a rabbit hole we would never have taken otherwise. Now I know the difference between flush and clean/clean and square and a flush joint

I have a few knives with half stops. The first time I found one with them, I thought how cool it this, half stops. They are great for posing knives for photos and give the extra cool factor, I guess. More stops along the way:cool:
 
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I've learned something new too :)
I guess my doubts about the "safety matter" on half stops is due to the fact that I grew up with friction folders. To me, a spring (or at least a strong backspring) is mainly a risk, since if you use the knife properly it won't fold, and I rather avoid having a spring that snaps the blade closed. But that's just me of course. :)

Fausto
:cool:
 
trey999 said:
A really strong spring can be easier to open to the
half stop, rather than trying to open all the way at once. You open it halfway, then tug on it
the rest of the way. Seems that way to me, at least.
Click to expand...

I feel the same way about half-stops. I don't like half-stops on blades that can be "pinch" opened, but I do appreciate them on small nail-nick knives.
 
I have become a fan of smooth pulls. It is never a deal breaker to have half stops though.

To me, it just feels marginally safer than a knife with half stops (only slightly). A smooth pull allows me to open a knife with more finesse, rather than a clumsy/jerky opening. A jerky opening, even if it is planned, does not seem as safe a smooth one.

Regarding accidental closing, a smooth pull can close pretty far without snapping shut (in many cases). In some cases a smooth pull can be pushed farther than a half stop can before closing, so what really is the advantage of the half stop in terms of safety? A hard spine wack has to push any slip joint past half way to close on a fanger, and in that case, no matter what the pull is, you are probably going to have the same effect.

Again, it is never a deal breaker, but half stops really don't feel any safer to me (and it is probably best looked at on a case to case basis). YMMV
 
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I changed the title to add another feature that I would like to talk about: pinchable blades.
Again, it's a matter of where I come from. In Sardinia, traditional knives don't have a nail nick. They're friction folders, and they open pinching them (all handles have space enough to pinch them comfortably). In American knives, it seems that the nail nick is the main way to open a folder...still I've found out (in my GEC EO #25) that even though I use the nail nick, when the blade opens a bit I kinda change my grab on it and actually pinch it open (no matter if my nail stays on the nick or not).
This comes along with the fact that I prefer a very mild pull on the blade...although I know I belong to a minority here :D

Fausto
:cool:
 
I like half stops because I figure a little more work went into the knife. Plus the older knives I collect often have them. I love tl-29s for instance. And I pretty much never use the nick unless the blade is unpinchable. And that's usually an issue of size (peanut pen for example)...I have played guitar for over half my life and make a living typing. My fingers are pretty strong.

Half stops definitely aren't a deal breaker, but I do enjoy them. Rather authoritative. :)
 
Regarding the nail nicks Fausto, the style of some particular blades and/or the presence of multiple blades makes them a necessity in certain cases. Think of a stockman. Even though in most instances the large clip and the sheepsfoot blade will have enough area sticking out above the liner that could be pinched the fact that they're set right next to each other doesn't really allow you to pinch only one of them effectively. The nick will let you get just the blade you want. On a muskrat where the blades are narrow from spine to edge there's no way you can pinch them because of how low they sit when closed. Other patterns with a single blade and a lot of steel sticking out above the handle, like a rope knife, may not absolutely need a nick but pinching isn't always easy if it's against a strong spring or with compromised grip so a nick can help in some circumstances.
 
Nate,
you have a point on multiblades, I can't think of a Stockman or Congress in which I could pinch every blade. I was referring more to single bladed knives, since apparently the pinchable ones are not many.
I know that a stiff backspring can make pinching difficult, especially in the first 30 degrees from the closed position...and that's where a nail nick is indeed helpful. Also, not all nail nicks are equally comfy. Or maybe it's just me :D

Fausto
:cool:
 
quattromori said:
Also, not all nail nicks are equally comfy. Or maybe it's just me
Click to expand...

It's not just you. I returned a knife this week because the combination of very heavy spring and placement of the nail nick made it almost impossible for me to open.

I too prefer a pinchable blade, but I also tend to prefer single blade knives. On my SAKs I need the nicks to get to various tools, just like getting to the smaller blades on my Schrade Serpentine Jack and Böker Stockman.

I would also rather have a smooth opening than a half stop, but three of mine have half stops (John Lloyd, two Cases), so I won't stay away from a knife for that reason.
 
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