Hand sanding to make a higher shine on non reflective blades. What grits? Good ?

MTHall720

MTHall720

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Sep 21, 2010
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I confess. I have used my Dremel with white compound, and with polish embedded bits, but with results I usually am not totally satisfied with.My next step is usually to start with 600 grit wet paper using a small palm sander. Then I go to 800, then 1200 grit. Now, I have some knives I like except for the finish and do not want to mess them up at all. Questions. 1] Is using a hand block sander a good way to go, and with series of grit?
2] Should I rub back and forth with the sanding block, or just move slowly in one direction?
3] When I get closer to a mirror finish, is there ANY kind of polish, wax, etc I can hand apply which will reduce the appearance of fingerprints everytime I touch the blade?

Thanks very much for all ideas.
 
Hi, sorry I am pretty clueless about the sanding process, but I have had good luck with Renwax (renaissance wax) to protect against fingerprints, rust, etc.
 
geargeek said:
Hi, sorry I am pretty clueless about the sanding process, but I have had good luck with Renwax (renaissance wax) to protect against fingerprints, rust, etc.
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Thanks. That is one thing I have not tried but have heard about. I will get some of that.
 
Well, I've really never heard much of a way to shortcut the polishing process, honestly. Hand sanding is the best way I've found, aside from a buffer for higher levels of polish. If you do use a buffer, BE CAREFUL, that sucker can grab a knife out of your hand and hurl it across the room so fast you'll never even know it's gone from your hand.

I'd start with a medium-soft block, say a stiff mouse pad backed with wood, and 600-grit or so sandpaper. Sand along whatever marks are already in the blade, usually perpendicular to the spine, it makes it a bit easier. Once you have an even scratch pattern with ALL the previous grit marks gone, it's time to change up to the next smoother grit. Make sure you clean things off well between grits so you don't end up dragging a bigger piece of grit back into the mix and leaving nasty scratches that take time to remove. Take it up through whatever finish you like, 2500 grit is easy to get from your local auto-parts store, sometimes even higher, and that will leave a very nice finish indeed. Finish off with Flitz or something similar on a cotton cloth for a good shine.

It's mostly just a matter of how much time you are willing to invest. The longer you spend, the brighter it'll shine (for the most part, anyway, some steels just don't LIKE to buff shiny).
 
Thanks to all. I have never thought about some steels being extra hard to buff to a shine.
Which steels will most easily buff?
 
MTHall720 said:
Thanks to all. I have never thought about some steels being extra hard to buff to a shine.
Which steels will most easily buff?
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Basic carbon steel, like 1095 really shines up. I've also noticed 440A & 440C take a high polish relatively easily. ATS-34/154CM seem to, and VG-10 as well. S30V, on the other hand, really seems to 'resist' polishing, which fits hand-in-hand, I suppose, with it's big reputation as an 'abrasion resistant' steel. In the majority of these cases, I've noticed this when sharpening & polishing edge bevels on blades. Haven't done too many entire blades yet.
 
Plain carbon steels buff nicely, and as I recall pretty much anything with a high chromium content will also buff well. VG-10 looks awesome, and 154CM seems to look good as well, as OWE mentioned. It's a tad tougher to buff, if I recall correctly, given the increased abrasion resistance compared to 440C or so.

You can buff more or less anything, just a matter of how much time and exactly what method. I mean, Mythbusters managed to polish cow chips, as I recall. :D
 
Use the crosshatch method. Start with the grit you need, working only in one direction. When you are happy and the marks are uniform, you switch grits and work in another direction. Work your way up to a finer grit using this method.

It's really a pain in the ass to do it, but there are no shortcuts. The devil is in the details and if you skip some scratches they won't come out with the finer grits later, so you'll have to go back and lose the finer work that you've done.

I too have noticed that carbon steel is quite easy to work with, Sandvik stainless is quite a bit harder, but CPM S-30V is incredibly difficult to work with! Even VG-10 and 154CM are tough to work with, as they take forever to wear down.
 
stoffi said:
Use the crosshatch method. Start with the grit you need, working only in one direction. When you are happy and the marks are uniform, you switch grits and work in another direction. Work your way up to a finer grit using this method.

It's really a pain in the ass to do it, but there are no shortcuts. The devil is in the details and if you skip some scratches they won't come out with the finer grits later, so you'll have to go back and lose the finer work that you've done.

I too have noticed that carbon steel is quite easy to work with, Sandvik stainless is quite a bit harder, but CPM S-30V is incredibly difficult to work with! Even VG-10 and 154CM are tough to work with, as they take forever to wear down.
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Good ideas! First time i have heard of that but I will try that method doing in one direction at a time, and then switching the other way. For example, do you mean if I use 300 grit to start and sand in one direction on both sides of the blade, then sand in the other direction when I switch to 500 grit? I was thinking about 300 - 500 - 800 -1200 and then evaluate how it looks at that point.
 
MTHall720 said:
Good ideas! First time i have heard of that but I will try that method doing in one direction at a time, and then switching the other way. For example, do you mean if I use 300 grit to start and sand in one direction on both sides of the blade, then sand in the other direction when I switch to 500 grit? I was thinking about 300 - 500 - 800 -1200 and then evaluate how it looks at that point.
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That's the general idea. Sand in one direction, with one grit, until you have a uniform scratch pattern. Then move to the next grit, sanding in a different direction (perhaps perpendicular to the previous direction). Again, look for uniformity in the (new) scratch pattern, with no remaining evidence of the previous pattern's scratches. Then step to the next grit and repeat the process in a new direction (again, perpendicular to the previous step).

A tip:
For your finishing grit, you might have a preference as to which direction the final scratch pattern assumes (such as running from spine to edge), so this might dictate which direction you begin with, at the starting grit. If you're using an odd number of sanding grits (3 or 5 or 7, etc.), the finished scratch pattern will be in the same direction as the starting grit's pattern. With an even number (2 or 4 or 6, etc.), your finishing step will be perpendicular to the starting grit's scratch pattern. Otherwise, you might find you need to sand twice with the finishing grit, with the final sanding in the preferred direction.

If you're looking for high polish, I think you'll find you'll need to go to at least 2000 grit or higher, plus polishing afterwards with metal polish like Flitz/Simichrome, IF you do a decent job removing scratches in each step, as described above. 1200 grit will likely leave something akin to a very fine satin finish, perhaps seeing some slight reflectivity in the scratch pattern.
 
Thanks very much David. I tried for quite a while to find a DVD which showed things like this, along with basics of disassembly but never did. My own experimenting left a lot to be desired so I really appreciate all the help I am getting here.
 
Wish there was a knife club within 20 miles of me where I could watch someone who is good at modding, etc. So far the only club I know of is quite a bit further from where I am in Frederick, MD
 
MTHall720 said:
Thanks very much David. I tried for quite a while to find a DVD which showed things like this, along with basics of disassembly but never did. My own experimenting left a lot to be desired so I really appreciate all the help I am getting here.
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Don't know if there's any easy (or quick) way to do this by hand, without powered tools. Having said that, I would still recommend experimenting, even with a cheap blade. It's a great way to get a real feel for the character of a particular steel, which is invaluable for choosing a good method or abrasive for sharpening that particular steel, too. And generally speaking, the tighter and more complete your grit sequence is, the better the result will ultimately be (more grits, spaced narrowly apart, like 220/320/400/600/800/1200/1500/2000, plus Flitz/Simichrome polish afterwards). And gradually lightening pressure with each successive grit makes a big difference. A rubber drafting-type eraser has made a pretty good 'sanding block' for me, to wrap a piece of sandpaper around. It's flexible and soft enough to more evenly distribute pressure, which makes the sanding pattern more uniform. It's especially useful for conforming to the contours of the blade.

To get a feel for the 'cross-hatch' sanding technique, a relatively painless way to do that is to use it on a brass-bolstered knife (like a Buck 110, for instance). Brass is soft enough (compared to a hardened steel blade), so it won't take long to go through the steps/grits and see how changing sanding direction affects the previous scratch pattern. Use the rubber eraser, as mentioned above, as a block for the sandpaper. And the soft character of brass will also dictate using light pressure (the abrasive cuts much deeper & faster on it), which will demonstrate the additional polishing benefit of a light touch. Keep in mind, steel will take much more time than brass, but the same fundamental principles still apply.
 
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I actually tried another method than I recommended, which was a bit faster. What I did was simple: I only sanded in one direction. You see, when you crosshatch you can immediately tell when you can switch to the next grit, but since I just wanted to buff up one of my users, I figured I'd just do it a bit faster, but with maximum results. OK, so: in sanding all the grits in the same direction one gets a uniform scratch pattern which looks very shiny and especially tidy. If you crosshatch, you'll immediately have to do a lot of work in order to tidy up the crosshatching, so doing it all in the same direction is a lot quicker if all you wanna do is to quickly make it look nice and clean, but with a sort of brushed/shiny finish. Don't do this for mirror polishing, as it will make it hard to tell when you need to switch grits.
 
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