Handle Holes

M

metacarpels

Joined
Jan 16, 2001
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156
a question based on a conversation with Bgoode in another thread, if im glueing handle slabs on my first knife, does drilling holes at random intervals on the handles help the epoxy adhere better? im asking because im not planning on using pins, just glue. any thoughts?
 
metacarpels said:
im asking because im not planning on using pins, just glue. any thoughts?
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Not a good idea. Glue is only a sealer. Its function is not to allow any moisture between the scales and the tang. Adding to teh strength of the handle is only a side-effect, and shoudl never be relied-upon to hold the scales in place. Handles should, with rare exception, always be mechanically fastened to the blade.
 
I agree with what Higgy said. Any epoxy used acts only as a sealant. On full tang knives pins, screws or bolts are a must.
Scott
 
Any way to nail brads to one slab (with glue) and have an internal pin once its all clamped up? RLinger has made handles with no pins before. He made internal pockets of some kind and when glued up the glue held the pins....Hard to explaine.
 
cool cool... where does one get the pins to use (stainless i assume is best) and how are they put on? never done that before.... do i drill the holes before the heat treat?
 
how I do my holes.

After the blade's profile is done and I made sure its a keeper, I trace the knife on a piece of paper.. Draw my handle shape and place the pins wher I want them to be. Then I drill 1/8" holes for the pin placement. Deburr, and clamp my handle material (with enough extra on all 4 sides) and using the knife as a guide I drill through the tang into the handle material. Then with my paper pattern I draw the front of the handle. Repeat with otherside. Then I use 1/8" rod to pin the 2 handle materials together (without knife) and shape the front. After that is done, I cut the excess from the last 3 sides and drill all my holes to fit the pin that will be used. Then its ready for gluing up and glueing in th pins all at one time. The I sand back to flat (sides) and grind the profile to match the tang. Time to shape after that. Thats really all there is to it for full tang knives. IF you have a bolster just add about hrs and a few (repeated) steps just like you did with the bolsterless handles.

I got my mosaic pins from texas knifmakers supply. Once your ready to glue up, rough up teh inside of the scales, drill the correct size holes for the pins, debur the inside and the outside holes in the scales (just a touch so that there isnt material to prevent the slab from lying flat against the tang.
GEt gloves and epoxy remover( to clean up the blade from all the squished out glue that gets on the actual blade and slab front. Dont worry about the excess around the handle.
Hope that helped a little :p
 
Brian, what do you use for your patterns? And do you put punch guide holes in the pattern? Because people are always going, "I want one of those" I finally learned to make an acrylic pattern of everything - before I commit it to steel. It goes from paper to plastic, then I trace the plastic pattern on paper again several times and spend the next few increments of time (minutes, hours, weeks - whatever) playing with bolster shapes and pin placement. Once i figure out how I think I'm going to do the pins forever after, I make holes in the pattern for my punch. Just eliminates one more variable. I have a couple of patterns with two or three pin layouts in them though, and that can get a little confusing! :D My drawer of patterns is getting kinda full - that's cool! Who'd have thought I'd ever make that many knives? I'm really starting to like this.
 
Well...most of my patterns are manila files (office files), but I do have acrylic patterns for the companion and a thin lexan type pattern for the SideKick. I also need to convert all my patterns to acrylic. I do have the patterns with pin hole placement but I find that I need to adjust them a little depending on how the profiling went.
My backup is a master line drawing of EVERY knife I have made. If I need to remake a pattern I just pull my little book out and trace :D
I have even used a pizza box for a bolster pattern but I like the plex for its durability!!
 
Well, as long as this is a topic- do you stock removers just epoxy in the pins? And, if you do brad the ends, how?

Another thing- you can hide pins, right? If so, how?
thanks, just thought that I might take advantage of this thread.
 
Most of the time I do not peen the pins. I simply use a hacksaw to notch them a bit in a couple of places to hold the epoxy and slide them in. For hidden pins you can use allthread; just drill blind holes in the scales and make the pins short enough to go just to the end of the hole in each scale. The threads give good traction for the epoxy. Always clean everything compulsively with acetone. ;)
 
I have done quite a few "hidden pin " knives. I drill and tap the tang for a 6-32 set screw and then drill corresponding holes into the scale materials.I use a Dremel with a small burr to "T" shape the hole or make it look like a mushroom cap.When epoxied the bond between the set screw threads and the "T" shaped hole are very strong and I have had great luck with them.Dave

Here is one I did this on using Water Buffalo for bolsters and Sambar stag for scales.
36ronfl1.jpg
 
alright, again forgive me if i sound like a moron, but lets see anway. So the pins you use are just straight with no shoulder on the end? just straight? and then the epoxy is what serves to hold them in place.. is this correct? if so, do they have pins that are larger such as 1/4" in diameter? i appreciate it!
 
Check out http://www.engnath.com/ looking the manual under handles scroll down th epoxy nails. This site has most if not all the answers to knife making questions and more ideas many of us ever have had, Good reading for beginners and established makers. Gib
 
Yes on the threaded hidden pins. I just off the head of a brass screw and use it for a hidden pin, or use any handy threaded material. I hate pins that show, usually. Yep on the hollowed out anchor cavities for the epoxy in the handle scales, too. As you all know, you gotta degrease all the material to be glued, as Dave says. Threaded pins will work even though you might not get the pins perfectly steril of oil, and will certainly hold much better than smooth ones. I have used smooth pin material and usually just nicked them up with a pair of sidecutters, or dikes, as some of us refer to them. I don't just use cheepo 2 part epoxy, as y'all already know. Brownells Acra Glas Gel, all the way! Wear throw away rubber gloves, or the nitral type disposable sanitary gloves when using tha 'glas. That stuff is in a sticky class all it's own, really messy. By the time I have a handle glued up, I have the entire handle smeared with the stuff, usually. One good thing about the 'glas, you have an hour working time, and it cleans up pretty easy with alcohol or most thinners. I heard that vinegar is a good cleanup medium, too. One question on the quarter inch pins. Why do you want to use that large of a pin, unless you are using exposed pins?
 
Gib Guignard said:
Check out http://www.engnath.com/ looking the manual under handles scroll down th epoxy nails. This site has most if not all the answers to knife making questions and more ideas many of us ever have had, Good reading for beginners and established makers. Gib
Click to expand...
We should all thank Mr. Engath's family for preserving that fantastic work for us. One of the first things I did when I started making was print the whole site. I still use it. Good reminder Gib.
 
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