Handle Question #675839er

Operator1975

Operator1975

Joined
Sep 24, 2010
Messages
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So Skog got some good discussion going on handles and the process, especially if we are talking about wedge-ing

What if no wedge is needed?

What about this scenario -

You have a haft, that when you introduce it to the eye, fits like a glove - no wedge. The haft is in the eye tight, doesn't seem to wiggle or move. (not field tested) Now what? Length is correct. Head is right size for haft, etc. All the metrics add up, just the typical gap for the wooden wedge is not there....?

So whats the train of thought on this? What now? I have a scenario like this currently, and I am interested in feedback. Not a hey you are right, or hey you are wrong, but what would you do, etc. Lets hear it.

Thanks!
 
You mean you drove the neck into the eye my hammering method, but did it real tight?

If so I guess it might work for a short while right, but probably loosen from the stress.

If we are improvising I guess you could always go the tomahawk route and drive the handle through the top.
 
I agree with Skogkniv - it'll come loose. if you got it in there, and you don't do something to slightly expand it, it'll come out when you use it. *some* sort of wedge is necessary. metal wedges are not an absolute necessity, while we're on the subject. it is tough to get it to fit perfectly, but when you do, a wood wedge is all that's needed.

of course, YMMV.

-ben
 
operator, i can help you my axe friend:)
the handle on my 9# sledge is fit just like that. i drove it in very tight and there was no way i was going to get a wooden wedge in there.
so...i just drove a 1" metal wedge in the handle crosswise. that was two years ago and i have pounded and pounded on my woodsplitting wedge and it is still tight as hell.
(i heat with wood, so i split alot of wood each year) it hasent given me any trouble what-so-ever...
 
bearhunter said:
operator, i can help you my axe friend:)
the handle on my 9# sledge is fit just like that. i drove it in very tight and there was no way i was going to get a wooden wedge in there.
so...i just drove a 1" metal wedge in the handle crosswise. that was two years ago and i have pounded and pounded on my woodsplitting wedge and it is still tight as hell.
(i heat with wood, so i split alot of wood each year) it hasent given me any trouble what-so-ever...
Click to expand...
That is a lie!

Just kiddin. You think that would work on an axe?

i've got a reply but i'm on my phone and typing sucks...
 
If it's a typical axe head, with a flared or tapered eye hole that's bigger on top than on the bottom, then I think that without some kind of wedge in top to expand the wood, it will eventually work itself loose.
 
Take cord and wrap it till it's tight and use a saw to remove some more wood from it, then a wedge can be driven. Cord is better than a clamp or vice because I wouldn't want any excess marring, but a clamp with something between it and the wood would probably work.

That's my two cents.

Reasoning, it's tight but there's nothing causing the wood in the eyelet to maintain the friction, for an emergency if you didn't have a saw, you could soak it with water, but that would only be a temporary fix.
 
M3mphis said:
That is a lie!

Just kiddin. You think that would work on an axe?

i've got a reply but i'm on my phone and typing sucks...
Click to expand...
its no damn lie;) im going into town tomarrow, so i can't put a pic up. i'll try to get one up thursday.
(i've been meaning to put up several pics of different things, just been busy hunting and cutting wood)
i dont know if it would work on an axe. i dont see why it wouldnt. if it holds with my sledge, why wouldnt it with an axe?
its not very pretty though...
 
I had one of my double bits where the handle fit very tight, similar to what your are describing. I rasped off a bunch of wood so that I would be able to fit in a wedge. If you were able to force it on, I'm sure a little hard use can force it back off.
 
bearhunter said:
i dont know if it would work on an axe. i dont see why it wouldnt. if it holds with my sledge, why wouldnt it with an axe?
Click to expand...

I was thinking...I don't know if I've ever had a sledge head come loose. Generally with a sledge or a splitting maul you are more or less just lifting and dropping the weight of the head onto the target. This would create much less stress on the handle and handle/head connection than if you are slamming it down (like with an axe) where you are creating a lot of force upon the connection between handle and head. Also, when you swing an axe the centrifugal force is much greater than when you drop a sledge or maul. Centrifugal force would like to "pull" the head right off your axe. Coincidentally, the properties of centrifugal force are why the way tomahawks are hung works at all. Basically, I would guess that an axe experiences much more stress in the connection. Notice that maul and sledge eyes tend to be much smaller than the same on axes.

It's late and I'm pretty well spent for the day, so I hope that didn't come out like a big steamy pile of bear scat...which is only pleasant to run across when you are "bearhunter!" ;)
 
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Skimo is on the right track. I would remove the handle and put in my vise and tighten it until the gap where the wooden wedge goes is closed, you don't have to CRUSH IT in the vise. Now take a hand saw, hack saw, vow saw, or a sawzall if your careful and cut down the line, this will make the kerf a tad wider, from a 1/32 to an 1/8 of an inch depending on the width of the blade you use. If you have too, cut it , re-clamp it and cut again, depending on thickness of saw blade and how much room you need to start the wedge. And now we are to the part of the story where we set the wedge or wedges and that is a whole 'nother discussion. But here is one way it might be done. Place the handle in the eye of the axe and I take a rubber or dead blow hammer and tap on other end of the handle and draw the axe head down and tight upon the handle. Some will thump the end of the handle on a block of wood or concrete, but you could more likely damage the handle. Now start your wooden wedge and drive it in, tap on other end of handle, drive wedge, tap end of handle. repeating these action will draw the handle on tightly and you will sink the wedge in deep and tight. Now it is up to you if you glue or use wood sweller on the wood wedge and if you then drive in a metal wedge.

Pat
 
I like these ideas and suggestions. I wanted to see what others would do, so thanks.

Here is what I did last night, in case anyone cares.

So as a couple stated, I figured even though it felt good and looked like a good fit, it would probably eventually come loose, or be one of those axes where the head slightly wiggles free and you are in the woods pissin with it more than you are chopping. So, I figured I could cut the slit in the haft wider, or take some wood off the sides to make room for a wedge. So I went option 2.

So I tried to carefully sand away enough so I could get a good size gap for a wooden wedge. I also worked on the shoulder a little bit, so the head would sit lower on the should and expose haft up through the eye, on top of the head. I then had to sand down one of my wedge for proper size. I then oiled up the haft, and oiled up the wedge, and proceeded to pound her home. Overall it worked out ok. Took some time though, was trying to be careful with the sanding - you can take it off but can't put it back on.

I have another axe, a boys axe where the haft is really snug with no wedge. I think I will take it out chopping and see how it performs. If it gets loose, if the head is sloppy, etc, then go from there.

I would agree though, that I would think you have to have a wooden wedge in there to make it hold correctly.

Thanks guys!
 
On an old head where the poll has been used for lots of hammering, I've seen the eye deformed so that inside the eye, about halfway up, narrows tighter than the bottom of the eye (instead of continuing to taper larger toward the top of the eye). This hourglass shape will close the sawn slit in the handle and get real tight, even though this part of the handle fits through the bottom of the eye.

I have this problem now with an old Gransfors 5-pound head, which is otherwise shaping up nicely. The solution seems to be to file away the bottleneck to get a nice tapered eye, which I am doing, but it's taking some time.
 
bjp said:
I agree with Skogkniv - it'll come loose. if you got it in there, and you don't do something to slightly expand it, it'll come out when you use it. *some* sort of wedge is necessary. metal wedges are not an absolute necessity, while we're on the subject. it is tough to get it to fit perfectly, but when you do, a wood wedge is all that's needed.

of course, YMMV.

-ben
Click to expand...

Agree. If the kerf closes up when putting the axe head on, I would remove the axe head and sand / rasp more wood from the handle. The high spots show up on the handle after you take the head off. Sometimes you need to carve the wedge down a bit to get the majority of the wedge in the wood.

This is a good traditional primer video on hanging an axe from the Forest Service (An Axe to Grind), which I've found helpful.

http://youtu.be/2B7Wy7iskVE
 
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