Harpy or Moran?

C

Clay Kesting

Joined
Oct 10, 1998
Messages
648
Regretably I have had to make a difficult decision to pass on the Matriarch
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. Not that I don't think it is a great knife but I think I could very easily run foul of our knife laws especially since the places I would most want to carry it are the very places where I would stand the greatest chance of being searched.

I had already intended to buy a Merlin but am wondering if I should get a G10 Harpy instead. Especially since, IIRC, they are to be discontinued and I have saved some money on the Matriarch
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.

As I see it the advantages of the Harpy are:
*More robust construction
*Slightly thicker blade
*Tip down carry, more suited to a Spydie drop in an emegency

The advantages of the Merlin are:
*Lower cost, I won't be as concerned if I loose it overboard
*Lighter weight, I want to carry it in a neck sheath at least some of the time
*Ambidexterous clip, so I could set it up for off-side carry.

I want to be prepared for all types of emergency situations including "social" events, so which should I order? And, before anyone suggests that I buy both, remember that it will cost me almost twice as much as the US price by the time I get it here.

Thanks for your help.

------------------
Take care,
Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.



[This message has been edited by Clay Kesting (edited 18 September 1999).]
 
I personally would pick the Merlin for the following reasons:

- Lower-cost
- Lighter-weight
- Excellent ergonomics with the Delica handle
- Very nice balance

As much as I like the higher-end Spydies, the plastic-handled ones typically find their way into my pockets. I guess low replacement cost, no worries about abusing a collector piece, and performance/ruggedness are the main reasons why.

Although not specifically designed for defensive purposes (ala the Matriarch), I would rate the Merlin as quite capable for any unwanted "social" encounters. The tip of the blade is thicker than the Civilian/Matriarch. While obviously good for slicing, I think you'll be surprised at how well the blade can also be used for thrusting.

Joel
 
Clay,

I'm going to second Joel's reasoning on the choice of the Merlin. However, I know a mail order company that has the G-10 Harpys on closeout for about $20 less than the price of the Merlin. Either will serve you well for self-defense, but I'd give the Harpy a slight edge in that department because it's more robust. I've done some self-defense cutting drills with one at a couple of seminars, and people's eyes go wide at the amount of damage it can inflict
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. Email me if you want more details.

Mike
 
I like Joel's reasoning, too, but I'm going to tell you to get the Harpy cuz I've loved that knife since the first time I laid eyes on one. It just looks sooo much better to me, the G10 is very grippy and I like the thicker blade. If you get the Harpy I don't think you'll wish you had opted for the Merlin, but if you get the Merlin you may always wonder about the Harpy. Or maybe not.
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Jack
 
Sorry...double post in edit


[This message has been edited by Sal Glesser (edited 19 September 1999).]
 
When we first tested the G-10 Harpy prototype, (the one with the single liner), I was very pleased with the results.

It is a no nonsense, tough piece of equipment. Good grip, good strength. I personally thought that this model would just take over. In fact, I planned to drop the stainless version.

sal

However, research in the market showed that the marketplace preferred the Stainless version, so we're going to drop the G-10 version. At least for now. (I've got mine).

The Merlin is one of those "close to perfect; size, shape, weight, price, highly adaptable pieces". All in all, hard to beat.

The Merlin is closer to the "No more than necessary, no less than perfect" Spyderco goal.

[This message has been edited by Sal Glesser (edited 18 September 1999).]
 
Speaking as one who has (and does) carry both the Merlin and Harpy G-10 at different times, if forced to choose one, would go for the G-10 Harpy especially if you can acquire one at the currently ridiculous clearance prices to be found per Mike's post.
The Merlin is a very good choice, too. Same blade on either of the latest prod. models. Good luck deciding!
 
Sal,

As one who has and does use this knife in all its variations, I find it curious that the stainless version got the nod over the G-10. The stainless was my first (still have it) and I've used it as a work knife for years, but the gripping surface of the G-10 is much, much better than the stainless, particularly when wet. The G-10 also has less of a tendency to slip out of the pocket accidently. Other active users of this knife that I've talked to share this opinion.

Mike
 
Mike - 'tis a mystery to me. I agree with you. Naturally we'll keep market testing.

sal
 
LOL Thanks a lot fellas, so this is supposed to help me decide
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. Talk about having an each way bet
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.

Seriously, thanks for the responses, they have certainly given me lots to think about. At the moment the Merlin is ahead because of its weight (it will be in a neck sheath most of the time) but, by the time I get home from work, who knows......

------------------
Take care,
Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.



[This message has been edited by Clay Kesting (edited 19 September 1999).]
 
Clay:

Just an additional comment about neck sheaths to further muddy the water for you:
I carry the G-10 Harpy in one of Mike Sastre's excellent neck sheaths, and find the weight to be no burden.

 
Well, I am on the boat with Hawkbill. Mike Sastre is a REAL bad influence when it comes to making people aware of the G-10 Harpys. He gave me the info and I picked some up at a GREAT price. This Harpy actually replaced my trusty Delica as my 'backup'. The G-10 Harpy which is TIP DOWN sits lower (end of handle doesn leave me with bruising on my sides), and I forget it is there
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. I had owned two stainless steel Harpys before and found them way too slippery. I would go for the G-10 Harpy w/ a Sastre neck sheath (let me tell you it looks like someone dipped the knife in wax, and cut it off - sheath fits like a latex glove).

I own the old style Moran, and I love it as a general utility knife
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Utimately if you can afford it, get BOTH.

Sorry to hear you passed on the Matriarch - it is SWEET.
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Ray 'md2020'
 
Thanks again for all the input. I decided on the Harpy. Seemed to make sense to get one before they disappear, especially at the low prices currently available. The Merlin should be around for a while so I can always get one later, gives me a good excuse to get a plain edge Merlin
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. After wearing my BF Native in its sheath all day today, I'm really looking forward to getting the sheath for the Harpy. For anyone who still needs convincing, Mike's sheaths are very comfortable and convenient, makes your favourite folder into your favourite neck knife.

BTW I've only just noticed that I wrote Moran instead of Merlin in the title of this thread
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. Must have had a "senior moment"
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.

------------------
Take care,
Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.



[This message has been edited by Clay Kesting (edited 26 September 1999).]
 
Ha! I was wondering what the Moran had to do with all this.
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I don' t have one yet but I plan to get the Harpy soon. I prefer the G10 over FRN (?)as it provides a much more secure grip and it can be altered (checkered, blasted, grooved, etc.) to your own taste. Also, because of its slightly more substantial weight, one can do more effective pommel strikes if called for.

L8r,
Nakano

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"To earn a million is easy, a real friend is not."

[This message has been edited by Nakano 2 (edited 26 September 1999).]
 
Whooopppeeee
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My Harpy arrived today, just in time for my birthday next week. What a bonza little knife. I can't understand why it was not more successful in the market place.

Thanks again to everybody who guided me in the right direction
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.

------------------
Take care,
Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.

 
My new G-10 Harpy arrived Saturday. At the closeout prices that were alluded to earlier, it was a great deal. Something I noticed immediately was how much it reminds me of my Wegner. The blades are obviously different but the handles are very similiar. The G-10 is the same color and similiar texture. Both handles have full stainless steel liners down the left side and on the bottom. Of course the Harpy is a lock back which makes it feel different but the overall impression of "solid" that I get from my Wegner (full size) is there. As mentioned earlier the black clip is fastened with three screws above the pivot which results in a really deep pocket carry. It is ATS 55 steel. And yes, it is sharp! I cut some wild rose bushes down with it yesterday and it did a great job.

I do have a tip down carry question though. I understand how the drop works. I can even see how drawing "with the hole" on a big knife like the Military would work. But this style of deployment just doesn't seem to work with the Harpy. If I put it in my right front pocket and attempt to deploy by withdrawing it by the hole, the blade starts to open before the clip disengages. I end up with a half open knife and a stuck one at that. OK I can deploy by gripping the G-10 and pulling and then shift to the hole once I'm clear of the pocket. I should then be able to do the drop to open. But it doesn't seem like the drop is ever going to work on this knife. Unless you just get a death grip on that hole in order to give a full arm, kind of circular snap, it aint coming open that way. It seems like 1) the knife is pretty small for this 2) the pivot is tight and 3) the lockback is exerting a lot of force on the blade. One of Mike's neck sheaths would solve the quick access problem but I'm still not sure I would trust quick opening. How are other people opening theirs quickly?
 
tulsamal.

Try a little more snap in your wrist to do the "drop" with the G-10 Harpy. You tighten the arc like cracking a whip. Most of the Harpies I've run into require this. Also helps if the knife is staight up and down when you "drop". hope this helps.

Mike
 
I also found the pivot was a little tight initially. However I put some TuffGlide on it and practised "the drop" while I was watching TV last night and it's loosening up nicely.
Of course my wife was giving me strange looks all night, but you get that
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.

Mike's right about the wrist action. I find I have to do that even with my Worker with its steel handle otherwise the lock-back action causes it to jam just before fully open. "Cracking a whip" is the best way to describe the motion, wish I'd thought of it though
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.

------------------
Take care,
Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow....in Australia it's tomorrow already.

 
Mike,

You're right, it does help if you hold it up straight up and down. I believe we are both talking about the same "up and down" i.e. turning it around so that it is tip up. That's the way it would come out of one of your sheaths so it would be possible (although it does take a pretty tight grip and a firm snap). But that doesn't address how you are supposed to open it out of your pocket. If you try to do a drop with it in the tip down position it doesn't even come close. About the best I have been able to come up with is to draw by grasping the G-10 sides (thumb on the inside), draw, and then to flip the knife forward with my thumb until it turns over in my hand and is then tip up. At that point the hole is right under my thumb and I can just open it normally.

The reason I asked in the first place is that I was concerned that my knife was just too tight. I'm holding my Blue Native in one hand right now and comparing it to the Harpy. There is NO comparison when it comes to ease of opening. The Harpy is much tighter. That is the only other Spyderco lockback I have for comparison (except for the necklace!). I can live with my Harpy if that is the way they all are. I have already opened and closed it hundreds of times. I've also given it a little Rem-Oil a couple times. I'm sure it will get easier but I don't think it has converted me into a tip down pocket carry type of guy!

Thanks for the reply,
Gregg Greenwood
Collinsville, OK
 
My G10 Harpy arrived today... less than a week from ordering it from Smokey Mountain to delivery across the Atlantic. Good service, good price, great knife.
Thanks to Mike for the info.


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Check Six...
Dennis

 
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