Has anybody heard of this steel?

J

jryan76

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Nov 20, 2005
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What is Duratech 20CV?:confused: I have heard this mentioned as a new steel for knives. Its suppose to be comparable to BG-42 is what I've heard. I was hoping to find out a little bit more about it as I might possibly be having a knife blade made out of this on a custom. Anybody out there know anything. Any help much appreciated.

Sorry if this isnt the right forum section for this, if its not, please move it where it belongs:o

Thanks all
 
20CV has been around for quite awhile. I don't see anybody using it for knives, but there likely are some knives out there made from this steel.

It is nothing like BG-42. Below is a link to a page with the chemical composition of Duratech 20CV.

Duratech 20CV
 
Devin Thomas uses it in damascus with BG-42 which may be why they were linked. 20CV scores very high on CATRA tests, it has twice the improvement of S30V over 440C for example.

-Cliff
 
Cliff Stamp said:
Devin Thomas uses it in damascus with BG-42 which may be why they were linked. 20CV scores very high on CATRA tests, it has twice the improvement of S30V over 440C for example.

-Cliff
Click to expand...

Cliff,
Thanks for your response. I have read many of your reviews here on BF and would value your opinion very highly. Would you recommend the 20CV steel for a knife over the S30V. I would most likely have my choice of what steel I could have my knife made in.

Thanks to all for the input....keep em coming
 
What kind of knife, what do you plan on doing with it, what aspects of performance do you value highly and which do you care little for?

-Cliff
 
Cliff Stamp said:
What kind of knife, what do you plan on doing with it, what aspects of performance do you value highly and which do you care little for?

-Cliff
Click to expand...

Cliff,
Thanks. The knife would be of the tactical folder type. I will likely use it as my edc knife and whats in my pocket when camping and hiking(I also carry a fixed blade in my pack) It will see everything from opening mail and cardboard boxes daily to use at home in the kitchen and in the woods cutting various foods(steaks, veggies, fruit, anything really) for food prep. I will use it when hiking and camping for gathering kindling and whittling, cutting rope here and there and any other task that requires me to have a knife readily available. I value the ability of the blade to hold an edge well, I dont want to have to resharpen it that often, not that I mind, but the longer it holds an edge the better obvioulsy. I havent had any real experience with any chipping in S30V, but I would definately not want any of that.
I guess I was wondering what your experiences with this steel are and if you could elaborate on some of the pros and cons of 20CV vs. S30V.

Thanks
 
3V is a lopsided comparison as 3V has far greater impact toughness with far less wear resistance and corrosion resistance. I would like to see it compared to S90V.

jryan76 said:
I will likely use it as my edc knife and whats in my pocket when camping and hiking(I also carry a fixed blade in my pack) It will see everything from opening mail and cardboard boxes daily to use at home in the kitchen and in the woods cutting various foods(steaks, veggies, fruit, anything really) for food prep. I will use it when hiking and camping for gathering kindling and whittling, cutting rope here and there and any other task that requires me to have a knife readily available. I value the ability of the blade to hold an edge well, I dont want to have to resharpen it that often, not that I mind, but the longer it holds an edge the better obvioulsy. I havent had any real experience with any chipping in S30V, but I would definately not want any of that.
Click to expand...

I have not used it, but based on the materials properties that Timken listed, it looks like a higher wear version of S30V, inbetween S30V and S90V so expect an advantage slicing cardboard and other abrasive materials. It is however very difficult to make concrete comparisons of this type because interpolating from one manufacturers spec sheets to another is problematic when they use different baselines.

Neither of those steels offer a significant advantage in push cutting cutting woods because there you tend to see blunting mainly by deformation and you are looking at hardness mainly and other issues depending on your edge angle criteria. While there has been a very high frequency of reports of chipping with S30V and I have personally seen some blades with very low durability, but when done right it is fairly solid as high carbon stainless steels go and I would expect 20CV to be similar.

I would suggest strongly though, if you are interested in optimal edge retention to really take some time and consider edge angles and grit finishes. It is readily possible that by adjusting these you can influence performance even more so than rather dramatic differences in steels. See Joe's "How to make a Benchmade Axis Peform" post as a critical example of the effect of reprofling and grit adjustment.

-Cliff
 
Duratech nine is the same as CPM-9V. Not overly attractive as a knife steel due to the low hardness.

-Cliff
 
jrayan76,

I have a kitchen paring knife made from 3V. While I use it often, it holds an edge well. But the finish of this blade has turned dark grey color and has pitted with use. Looking just like a old carbon steel kitchen knife. I believe the steel had a HRC of 56-58 after it was heat treated, which allowed the blade to flex with out chipping. The very well used 3V knife has a disappointing finish.

These steels CPM 3V, DuraTech 9, 20CV and A11 are not used by many knifemakers. So I think you might find it difficult to have a folder made from one of these steels. $$$.00
Just my two cents worth.
I have an avid friend who hunts California deer and wild hogs, J.P. Holmes let him field test two knives, one made from A11 and the other from 20CV. Hands down the A11 was a better cutting knife, which is no surpise with the information stated from the Timken data sheet. More vanadium and higher hardness.
More hogs were dressed out with the A11 and the unsharpened knife was returned to the knifemaker. Comparing the two knives cutting edges, the A11 came back sharper after testing. The pattern of the blades were close, but the A11 was longer by .750 in length. The thickness of the blade steel was about the same and both were flat grinds. A11 was used to dress out three hogs and the 20CV dresses out two. But both steels performed well. And both knives still had a bright finish when returned. No chopping, hacking or prying.
 
Jeff,

Thanks for your comments. I appreciate you chiming in. This is really what I have been looking for; some hard use experience with this steel. Your advice dosnt sound to positive. I have already been leaning toward the S30V just because I have experience with this steel andI like the performance of it. That and I havent really seen anyone talking about how great 20CV is. Anyhow, Thanks very much

jryan
 
Note many of these steels are the same materials under different names as pretty much all the manufacturers refer to steels under trademarked names. CPM-10V for example is AISI A11. Phil Wilson has used many of these steels and compared the edge retention on ropes as well as field trials with repeated tests to check for consistency. He is pretty open about the information he has obtained.

-Cliff
 
Microtech made a few of their knife models in 20C-V when S30V supplies were low. Myself I have to LCCs in 20C-V (one a user). Great steel. Sharp, takes a fine edge, holds it a long time, etc. In my own usage it seems to be a slight be easier to sharpen than S30V, and holds an edge a slight bit less. But that's from a sample size of one without a direct comparison (like a S30V LCC).
 
I personally prefer S30V. Have several users from MT, and Spyderco and find them to make excellent EDC's and field knives. I use them for hunting, camping and EDC and have yet to have one chip. Edges last a long time before blunting. Good luck.:D
 
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