Have you gotten a Kershaw with a bad bevel?

[iandh]

The first few Kershaws I've purchased were all near perfect, and that is what I had previously come to expect from them. I recently purchased a Rake Composite Blem from Kershawguy, and the bevel was BAD. I'm talking like the standard 17-20 degrees on one side, and like 35-40 degrees on the other. Completely asymmetrical.

Long story short, I paid a local sharpener to fix the bevel, and they toasted the knife. Lesson learned.

Now, I can't really comment on this particular knife as a representative of Kershaw, because it was a Blem. That wouldn't be fair.

What scared me, was that I was reading some Zero Tolerance threads, and noticed comments from users stating that it wasn't uncommon for Kershaws to have uneven bevels that often had to be corrected by return to Kershaw, or by the user. Some of these guys were taking their $200-300 knives to the belt sander, which is just something I can't abide by.




Now I'm starting to wonder if Kershaws were really as wonderful as I'd thought... here I am talking about how I've been dissapointed in the Benchmades I've seen lately, and this Kershaw is absolutely pitiful, as far as the blade finishing goes.

 

[knivesandguns]

I don't think that the people with ZT's had as great an uneven bevel as you. IIRC, if you wanted Kershaw to sharpen the knife, I believe you could always ask nicely

warrantyinfo@kai-usa.com

Alternatively, there are many excellent sharpeners on this board who would be more than happy to get your knife scary sharp with perfect bevels.

Remember this is a blem we're talking about. There is some form of a small gamble with each one you purchase I suppose.

-M

EDIT: and no, out of the hundreds of Kershaws that have passed through my hands via ownership or trade, I have not seen a bad bevel as you are describing; definitely uncharacteristic.

 

[iandh]

I don't think that the people with ZT's had as great an uneven bevel as you. IIRC, if you wanted Kershaw to sharpen the knife, I believe you could always ask nicely

warrantyinfo@kai-usa.com

Alternatively, there are many excellent sharpeners on this board who would be more than happy to get your knife scary sharp with perfect bevels.

Remember this is a blem we're talking about. There is some form of a small gamble with each one you purchase I suppose.

-M

EDIT: and no, out of the hundreds of Kershaws that have passed through my hands via ownership or trade, I have not seen a bad bevel as you are describing; definitely uncharacteristic.

I did mention it was a blem, but I was more concerned with the posts I had read. I really need a solid knife for work, but I can't afford another dud. The shop that botched my knife has offered to help pay for a replacement, but I don't want to end up in the same boat.

It's also a time thing... I waited weeks to buy the Rake, and I don't want to have to wait for more weeks to get the proper knife that I should have had in the first place.

This is no affront to Kershawguy whatsoever, but a blade with a bevel that bad should not be called a blem... it should be called trash.

I know that some may think, "Well, that's what you get for buying a blem and expecting perfection". The thing is, what I expected was a knife similar to what I first purchased from Kershawguy... my Skyline blem was perfect in every way besides a cosmetic scratch. A bad bevel is a functionality thing. I really wish I had taken a picture of the bevel before I had it reground.

 

[Joshua J.]

Uneven edge bevels are industry standard. If you have a factory made knife with even edge bevels, you either got lucky or bought a CRK.

 

[iandh]

Uneven edge bevels are industry standard. If you have a factory made knife with even edge bevels, you either got lucky or bought a CRK.

This is beyond uneven. I made an mspaint to try and approximate just how uneven... FYI this is NOT exagerrated.

 

[Jason B.]

Factory bevels or factory sharp should not be a standard by which you judge a knife or company. Sharpening is part of knife ownership and is something you should want to learn to keep your tool functioning properly.

What constitutes a good bevel will vary in opinion from person to person. From my point of view very few factory edges are evenly ground or sharp.

 

[iandh]

Factory bevels or factory sharp should not be a standard by which you judge a knife or company. Sharpening is part of knife ownership and is something you should want to learn to keep your tool functioning properly.

What constitutes a good bevel will vary in opinion from person to person. From my point of view very few factory edges are evenly ground or sharp.

I don't really think this applies in this situation.

I've owned around 30 knives over the years, the lowest quality of them being perhaps a victorinox. I've probably held at least ten times that or more. Never have I seen a bevel mismatched this badly, unless it was on a knife sharpened by an amateur.

As for sharpening, I'm betting that I'm more experienced in sharpening steel and carbide than 9 out of 10 people on this forum. I've been a machinist by trade for nearly two decades, and hand grind and sharpen tool steels and carbide cutting tools every day. I've sharpened literally thousands of blades and tools. Not only am I better at sharpening than most average joes, I'm better than most machinists that have also been doing it for decades. I regularly get compliments on my sharpening and tool grinding skills.

That said, I can hand sharpen a bevel within several degrees of target due to my experience in the machining world. Cutter rake angles are critical in machining, and are something you learn very quickly if you want to produce quality parts.

The reason I sent this blade to a shop is that I know my limitations, and know that a jig sharpened blade will always be more accurate than a hand sharpened one, period, no matter how good the person hand sharpening is. My main problem was 1) Not just asking for a different knife from Kershawguy instead of taking things into my own hands 2) Mistakenly placing trust in this knife shop based only upon their word

I could have invested in a proper sharpening setup, but I didn't want to spend as much as I just paid for a knife that should have been properly (or at least half-decently) beveled in the first place. Also, I could have made a proper sharpening jig, but once again, time is money.



edit: just to clarify the above so folks don't think I'm trying to be a cocky jerk, I didn't mean that I can make edges sharper or somehow better than any other given person who is adept at blade sharpening. What I was trying to get to is that due to my career, I have extremely good hand control and sense of angle. I'm also experienced with sharpening very hard materials to very fine edges, because that is what you have to do to machine certain materials.

I've actually re-beveled quite a few blades very successfully and accurately by hand, but due to the interface of the hollow grind and blade base on this particular knife, the tolerance for hand grinding was way too close, which is the exact reason I think the shop I gave this to messed it up in the same exact spot I was afraid of messing it up on. I was assuming they would use a jig.

I've actually intended to fabricate a really nice sharpening jig for knife blades, but it just isn't something I've gotten around to. I don't really have the time at the moment, which is why I took a chance on having someone else do it for me.

 

[The Mastiff]

There's a lot that I'm not getting apparently. You bought a blem. The only thing wrong with it that you mentioned is the edges.

OK, sounds pretty good to me.

You send it out to be resharpened and it got ruined by the guy who did it.

How exactly is this causing you to question Kershaw's quality? There's something I'm not getting.

I'm not even going to get into the whole super machinist who doesn't resharpen his own knives despite being so much better than other machinists.

This thread belongs somewhere else.

 

[Poez]

That was a blem from the start - probably for exactly the reason.
I think it is not wright to pay for blem and expect a perfection in return.
Or bring this topic up here, questiouning manufacturers quality and standards - because of your experience with blelm.
If it turned out such a bad experience for you - just do not buy blem next time, thats all.

 

[Jason B.]

A bevel set by a jig is not something I would expect from a knife shop but I don't know their methods. Also a bevel set by a jig is not in any way going to make a edge perform better and often can make it perform worse. Hand sharpening creates a natural convex that can make a bevel stronger and better at cutting due to less friction of the material passing over the sharp shoulders of the edge bevel.

With your experience you should be fine to sharpen CPM-D2, its actually a very easy to sharpen steel and also polishes well. Even simple sandpaper over glass will make quick work of the edge. Just don't go too much below 15 per side, it will get chippy.

 

[kershawguy]

These blems are awesome knives and hundreds will agree with that. The first one you purchased was a blem as well and even with your eye it was perfect. Truth be told blems are not supposed to be perfect, they are blems, to make the statement that it should be trash is way overstated and it saddens me. You should have contacted me immediately upon your noticing a problem that you couldn't live with and I would have taken care of it right away, not a problem. People need to be kinder with their words and choose them wisely, people have taken offense by the things you have said, and honestly I don't think you should have posted this. Next time contact me before you do anything else, I take very good care of my customers.

Dave

 

[iandh]

There's a lot that I'm not getting apparently. You bought a blem. The only thing wrong with it that you mentioned is the edges.

OK, sounds pretty good to me.

You send it out to be resharpened and it got ruined by the guy who did it.

How exactly is this causing you to question Kershaw's quality? There's something I'm not getting.

I'm not even going to get into the whole super machinist who doesn't resharpen his own knives despite being so much better than other machinists.
This thread belongs somewhere else.

edit:Further comment on your post... by your same logic, I should use a hand saw to do the job of a table saw, just because I know how to use a table saw but don't happen to have one.

I'm wondering whether you read my OP... I mentioned that I had read experiences with other BF members that had recieved non blem knives that also had significantly inaccurate bevel angles. The purpose of this thread was to find out whether the inaccurate bevel angle was due to this knife being a blem, or whether it was something that could be found from time to time on all Kershaw knives, and did not have to do with this knife being a blem.

A bevel set by a jig is not something I would expect from a knife shop but I don't know their methods. Also a bevel set by a jig is not in any way going to make a edge perform better and often can make it perform worse. Hand sharpening creates a natural convex that can make a bevel stronger and better at cutting due to less friction of the material passing over the sharp shoulders of the edge bevel.

With your experience you should be fine to sharpen CPM-D2, its actually a very easy to sharpen steel and also polishes well. Even simple sandpaper over glass will make quick work of the edge. Just don't go too much below 15 per side, it will get chippy.

Jig beveling is necesarry in certain instances where there is a very small margin of error due to the geometry of the blade's main grind. That is the specific reason I meant for this knife to be jig beveled, which was the impression I got when I spoke to the shop I took it to.

Hand beveling by a skilled craftsman is sufficient in the majority of cases.

These blems are awesome knives and hundreds will agree with that. The first one you purchased was a blem as well and even with your eye it was perfect. Truth be told blems are not supposed to be perfect, they are blems, to make the statement that it should be trash is way overstated and it saddens me. You should have contacted me immediately upon your noticing a problem that you couldn't live with and I would have taken care of it right away, not a problem. People need to be kinder with their words and choose them wisely, people have taken offense by the things you have said, and honestly I don't think you should have posted this. Next time contact me before you do anything else, I take very good care of my customers.

Dave

I specifically said this is no affront to you. You in no way did me wrong, and you aren't at fault in any way. In fact, I went out of my way in my posts to say that it was MY fault, in fact I mentioned that it was my fault repeatedly.

I made the incorrect assumption that since the several new Kershaw purchases I made had near perfect bevel, and the first blem that I bought from you had near perfect bevel, that the second would as well.

The knife you sent me looked perfect at a glance, and I even posted as such in your sale thread. The true error of the bevel angle wasn't really evident until you got right down on the blade and looked straight down the edge.



I'm not sure why anyone would take offense by what I've said... a member said that it would be good for me to learn to sharpen, when in fact I pretty much sharpen for a living. It's something I'm extremely skilled at.

I did notice that my original wording probably came off cocky, so I added an edit so it wouldn't be misinterpreted.

 

[Dorito Monk]

So you're basically saying that you bought a blemished knife, knowing full well that the knife was flawed, and now you're expressing how shocked you were when you found out that it had a flaw.

Are you for real? Is this some kind of a joke? You said it yourself: "That's what you get for buying a blem and expecting perfection." If you're picky enough that such a tiny flaw bothers you, you should have spent the extra couple of bucks and bought a non-blem kershaw; it's as simple as that. I don't see why this vexes you so. Just learn from the experience and don't buy blems if they're not to your standards.

Also, I've never had a Kershaw with a factory edge like you described. I've yet to find a knife company that sharpens their knives better than Kershaw, although Spyderco is just about as good, come to think of it.

 

[frontline29]

I'm not even going to get into the whole super machinist who doesn't resharpen his own knives despite being so much better than other machinists.

This thread belongs somewhere else.

:thumbup:

I paid a local sharpener to fix the bevel, and they toasted the knife.

when in fact I pretty much sharpen for a living. It's something I'm extremely skilled at.

 

[knivesandguns]

Eh, before all of the drama starts, OP, just sharpen the knife and enjoy it. The Rake is a terrific knife.

-M

 

[iandh]

:thumbup:

Sharpens for a living...

Are you aware just how much a professional machinist is required to sharpen tools? I'll give you a hint... at least as much as a bladesmith, if not more.

So you're basically saying that you bought a blemished knife, knowing full well that the knife was flawed, and now you're expressing how shocked you were when you found out that it had a flaw.

Are you for real? Is this some kind of a joke? You said it yourself: "That's what you get for buying a blem and expecting perfection." If you're picky enough that such a tiny flaw bothers you, you should have spent the extra couple of bucks and bought a non-blem kershaw; it's as simple as that. I don't see why this vexes you so. Just learn from the experience and don't buy blems if they're not to your standards.

Also, I've never had a Kershaw with a factory edge like you described. I've yet to find a knife company that sharpens their knives better than Kershaw, although Spyderco is just about as good, come to think of it.

No, I'm saying that this is the first Kershaw I've bought with a bad edge, and I was trying to figure out whether it being a blem was a factor, or whether it was a random occurance as has been seen by other non blem Kershaw purchasers.

:thumbup:

Did you even bother reading any of my posts? There is a specific reason that I wanted this knife jig beveled instead of hand-beveled.

 

[Dorito Monk]

No, I'm saying that this is the first Kershaw I've bought with a bad edge, and I was trying to figure out whether it being a blem was a factor

Oh, in that case, the answer is YES. Now that that's been resolved, do you have any other questions, queries, or other forms of inquisition?

 

[iandh]

Oh, in that case, the answer is YES. Now that that's been resolved, do you have any other questions, queries, or other forms of inquisition?

Do you know that for a fact? Because evidently, other non-blem Kershaw purchasers have recieved poorly beveled knives, on more than one occasion.

So either Kershaw sells some blem knives as new, or some non-blem knives with bad bevels.

 

[knivesandguns]

Do you know that for a fact? Because evidently, other non-blem Kershaw purchasers have recieved poorly beveled knives, on more than one occasion.

So either Kershaw sells some blem knives as new, or some non-blem knives with bad bevels.

I dunno about "bad" bevels. Off bevels, sure, it happens. If it's really that bad, Kershaw will fix it up to the user's liking.

-M

 

[frontline29]

Oh, in that case, the answer is YES. Now that that's been resolved, do you have any other questions, queries, or other forms of inquisition?

LOL :thumbup:

were talking about a 65$ blem knife here, not a finely tuned 700$ Sebenza.
I'm sorry but I have never heard such things coming from someone who is "extremely skilled" at sharpening.