Heat treat on RAT series?

[19-3ben]

I've been interested in a RAT-3 for a little while, as I love smaller fixed blade knives. I've never actually seen one in the flesh, so all I have to go by are internet reviews. Most reviews seem positive, but with the caveat that Ontario's heat treat is inconsistent, and you can get a blade that is so brittle it chips out if you look at it wrong, or one that is marshmallow soft.
Another fairly common criticism I've read is that scale-tang fit is not always perfect.

Since the group here seems to be more reliable and more up to day than random reviews scattered throughout the interwebz, figured I'd ask here. Was there a problem with the heat treatments at Ontario or is this all just internet rumor? If so, has the issue been rectified? Is this all just internet

Obviously there's the very very similar (for obvious reasons) ESEE-3 that gets flawless reviews and has the advantage of Rowen's near legendary heat treating. I have held an ESEE-3 and the fit/finish were impeccable too. But if the RAT-3 is basically the same thing but for 60% of the price, then it makes it awfully tempting.

So what say you?

 

[19-3ben]

So... 14 hours since posting, and over 60 views, and no replies.
Either nobody knows (seems unlikely), or I perhaps asked a question that touches a nerve?

I understand this is the manufacturer's forum here, so if this is something where I'm out of line asking such a thing, please let me know. I'm still pretty new here and willing to learn.

 

[GrReaper]

That Ontario's heat treat is somewhat inconsistent is certainly true, as there are many reports of blades too hard or too soft. But the chance that you'll get a dud is pretty low. The only way to tell is by hard using it. If it is a bad heat treat, Ontario's customer service is reportedly excellent, they will replace the knife. Esee makes basically the same knives but with much better quality control, better f/f, and better sheaths (from what I hear), hence you'll pay a lot more. So it's up to you and your budget. If you're looking for savings and bang for the buck, get the Ontario. If you're rich, can afford it, or don't ever want to deal with anyone's customer service, by all means, get the ESEE. I'd personally recommend the Ontario. Why waste money? And even if you don't like the sheath, you can always order a bit of leather or kydex from knifemaking suppliers and make your own sheath.

 

[buckfynn]

I own both the RAT-3 and ESEE-3. (Actually I have two of each.) The RAT-3 measures 0.140" and the ESEE-3 0.120" where the blade meets the scales. The RAT-3 has a bit shorter handle than the ESEE-3. The overall length of the RAT-3 is 7-7/8" while the ESEE-3 is 8-5/16". The blade cutting length of the RAT-3 is 3-1/2" and the ESEE-3 3-3/8". The handle width on the RAT-3 is 0.515" and the ESEE-3 is 0.502".

I have purchased 15 various ESEE knives. Not all ESEE knives have quality fit and finishes. My last ESSE purchased was an Izula 2. The Izula had an extremely off centered and irregular grind on the blade. Plus the Izula had problems with hardware on the scales not staying tight even after using something similar to loctite on them. Contacted ESEE concerning the issues with knife and they had me send the knife back to Rowen for a "fix" to correct to problems. Anyways the knife came back from Rowen with a grind that can only be described as sloppy and pathetic. After more email communication with ESEE they chose to issue me a refund instead of replacing the Izula 2. If ESEE would have replaced the Izula, I would have purchased several more ESEE models. As it stands now I have no confidence in ESEE knives, their so called "No Questions Asked Warranty," nor do I believe they always stand behind their knives.

I have 10 Ontario knives which all have been of decent quality both concerning fit & finish. The heat treatment seems good and consistent on all of my Ontario knives. I will definitely be purchasing more Ontario knives in the near future.

This is what the RAT-3 looks like today along with a TAK-1.

 

[bore]

I've used my Rat7 pretty hard. Limbing poles for fence, chopping small brush an inch or so thick for the goats, decapitated 15 chickens. Took a close look the other day and found one barely visible minute chip. No complaints