Help Id this knife (George Wostenholm)

M

Militarytorch

Joined
Apr 15, 2021
Messages
18
This knife belongs to my father in law.
He asked me to research it but after spending time online I can't seem to find anything like it.

The unusual to me is that it was made without a crossguard?
Perhaps, it is a custom job but I can't see how the pommel could have been taken apart.
Is there a way to date it based on the logo?

I hope someone knows what it is.

All of your comments are welcome.

(Pictures few posts below)
 
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Militarytorch said:
This knife belongs to my father in law.
He asked me to research it but after spending time online I can't seem to find anything like it.

The unusual to me is that it was made without a crossguard?
Perhaps, it is a custom job but I can't see how the pommel could have been taken apart.
Is there a way to date it based on the logo?
Click to expand...
Why would no cross guard be unusual?
Militarytorch said:
I can't attach pictures, that section is greyed out for me.
Click to expand...
Read here....

Uploading images

Hello, I joined this forum a while ago. I have not posted anything because I have not figured out how to post pictures. How do you load up images? I click on the image icon and it wants me to insert a URL Thank, Chip
www.bladeforums.com www.bladeforums.com
 
Militarytorch said:
This knife belongs to my father in law.
He asked me to research it but after spending time online I can't seem to find anything like it.

The unusual to me is that it was made without a crossguard?
Perhaps, it is a custom job but I can't see how the pommel could have been taken apart.
Is there a way to date it based on the logo?

I hope someone knows what it is.

All of your comments are welcome.

I can't attach pictures, that section is greyed out for me.
Click to expand...
As a registered user, you can post pictures using a picture hosting site. I use Imgur, but there are others. Once you have uploaded a picture to the hosting site, copy the web address of the picture. Note: picture web addresses must end in .jpg or .gif

Then go to your post and click the image tool on the toolbar next to the smiley tool. Click the link icon in the popup. (Looks like a chain.) Paste the picture address into the window. Then click the INSERT button.
 
knarfeng said:
As a registered user, you can post pictures using a picture hosting site. I use Imgur, but there are others. Once you have uploaded a picture to the hosting site, copy the web address of the picture. Note: picture web addresses must end in .jpg or .gif

Then go to your post and click the image tool on the toolbar next to the smiley tool. Click the link icon in the popup. (Looks like a chain.) Paste the picture address into the window. Then click the INSERT button.
Click to expand...
.PNG also works.
A bit easier way is to copy the URL (image address) from the image host, then paste it here in the response box, making sure to use the proper IMG tags. Using Imgur, use the BBCode option.

The proper url formating with HTML IMG tags for in-line pics will look something like this -
[img]https://i.imgur.com/MZCqqrHm.png[/img]

which will produce an in-line picture

MZCqqrHm.png
 
There is George Wostenholm, and then there is George Wosternholm apparently. I have never heard of Wosternholm, which is stamped on your knife.

Perhaps this is a copy/knock-off of a Wostenholm knife.
 
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tltt said:
I don't think it's fake at all, just rough.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that Wostenholm Knives knows how to spell their name correctly. While maybe not a fake (in the sense that there very well might be a George Wosternholm knife maker who made this one), it is NOT a Wostenholm knife from Sheffield England.
 
shane45-1911 said:
I'm pretty sure that Wostenholm Knives knows how to spell their name correctly. While maybe not a fake (in the sense that there very well might be a George Wosternholm knife maker who made this one), it is NOT a Wostenholm knife from Sheffield England.
Click to expand...

Wostenholm wasn't forging the blades anymore. A company named FE Hopkinson was handling it for a ton of Sheffield companies blade forging by the late 60's. It's possible that this is a second or they used the stamp till it was caught.

The blade matches others Hopinson was doing for Nowill label -

https://portal-images.azureedge.net...ages/d55071b1-539d-4a6d-b06f-ac8700e2233a.jpg .

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/10-8-john-nowill-sons-ltd-sheffield-1905324763 .
 
Thank you very much for your knowledgeable comments.
Something didn't look right to me, even the spacers in the handle look don't look uniform.
I missed the misspell. No wonder I couldn't find it online.

I will tell my father-in-law to keep it.
 
tltt said:
Wostenholm wasn't forging the blades anymore. A company named FE Hopkinson was handling it for a ton of Sheffield companies blade forging by the late 60's. It's possible that this is a second or they used the stamp till it was caught.

The blade matches others Hopinson was doing for Nowill label -

https://portal-images.azureedge.net...ages/d55071b1-539d-4a6d-b06f-ac8700e2233a.jpg .

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/10-8-john-nowill-sons-ltd-sheffield-1905324763 .
Click to expand...

I understand that. I am saying that I find it highly unlikely a mis-spelled stamp would be used, let alone not caught if it was.
 
tltt said:
A Hopkinson era Nowill with the same hex nut assembly -
Click to expand...
That Nowill stamp was applied prior to heat treating the blade, as is proper. The Wolsternholm stamp was stamped after the heat treat, is mis-spelled, and is in the wrong font. This is not a Wolstenholm knife.
 
eisman said:
That Nowill stamp was applied prior to heat treating the blade, as is proper. The Wolsternholm stamp was stamped after the heat treat, is mis-spelled, and is in the wrong font. This is not a Wolstenholm knife.
Click to expand...

I know what a cold stamp is, what I am saying is that it is one of the blades done by FE Hopkinson who was the supplier to at least a dozen post war Sheffield makers.. Now whether it's a second, a "lunch box knife", a simple mistake, or just a sloppy job I do not know, but it will be a Hopkinson product. Hopkinson owned or supplied/supplies Nowill, J Adams, Joseph Rodgers, William Rodgers, William Rodgers, Wilkinson Sword, Ibberson, Wostenholm, etc.... with blades as a subcontractor and have for years.

It has a matching blade to the Nowill line, the hex nut assembly is the same, and Hopkinson was/is a subcontractor to all involved, so it stands a better chance to be simple an odd ball mistake than a counterfeit.
 
eisman said:
That Nowill stamp was applied prior to heat treating the blade, as is proper. The Wolsternholm stamp was stamped after the heat treat, is mis-spelled, and is in the wrong font. This is not a Wolstenholm knife.
Click to expand...

Absolutely correct. 👍
 
1971 Seth Birdwell Cutlery pages (taken from here - https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/vintage-knife-catalogs-ads-images-links-only.755317/post-8543523) showing off some of the IXL knives for sale, look at the bottom knife, same profile and buttcap -

scan114.jpg
.
scan116.jpg


Edit - Bottom knife might actually be a Christopher Johnson Western Works, but it's of little consequence, because IXL / Wostenholm bought CJ Western Works in 1955, and Wostenholm was bought out by Joseph Rodgers in 1970/71, and then a bit later Imperial Schrade, Egginton, and a few others had them at various times.
 
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tltt said:
it stands a better chance to be simple an odd ball mistake than a counterfeit.
Click to expand...
Definition of Counterfeit -"transitive verb : to imitate or feign especially with intent to deceive. also : to make a fraudulent replica of"

A "mistake" is a wrong judgement. This is not a mistake.

There's absolutely no valid reason to stamp a knife (or any other product) with a false name other than to attempt to deceive and thereby profit in some manner. If you believe that someone would go through the effort to create a stamp and then mark a single (or however many) otherwise unmarked products without intent to commit fraud that would be a mistake. To suggest that a company like Wolstenholm would use a stamp with the company name spelled incorrectly that would be an error. To suggest they would subvert their production process to mark a product after it should have been would be ridiculous.

When you stamp a product with a name that's not what that product is, you are committing fraud. A watch made with parts from a Rolex supplier is not a Rolex, no matter what name is on it.
 
That is assuming that it was made to be a counterfeit. It could be a simple "Oh @#$%, someone put an R in the Wostenholm stamp! Go pull those. How many got out? Who knows?" situation.

That Birdwell ad shows Wostenholm was offering a similar pattern.
FE Hopkinson is a known subcontractor to them.
FE Hopkinson offers a similar under their house brand "John Nowill".

Now which is more likely a) a simple stamp mistake somewhere along the line or b) counterfeiting a modest priced knife? Also if you were counterfeiting Wostenholm knives, why counter fit a modest pattern? And why aren't there more Wosternholms if it's a fake? Google shows that while Wosternholm is a slightly common spelling mistake, there aren't any stamped knives but this one noted yet.

Stamping mistakes happen, Marble's had the Marblr misprint on a handful of knives years ago, so it's not an unknown thing -

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/marbles-knife-misprint-143092772 .

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/marblr-factory-misprint-marbles-1927450778 .

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/1-long-vintage-marblrs-gladstone-479073196 .

https://www.ebth.com/items/3424505-9-marbles-misspelled-hunting-knife-and-case-sheath.
 
tltt said:
Now which is more likely a) a simple stamp mistake somewhere along the line or b) counterfeiting a modest priced knife? Also if you were counterfeiting Wostenholm knives, why counter fit a modest pattern?
Click to expand...
Well, I suppose that depends on where it was made, doesn't it? Makers in Pakistan and India have produced lots of stuff like this just because they can.........
Why a modest pattern? Why not? Rare and expensive knives are more likely to be questioned, but inexpensive and fairly common? Nope, slap what seems to be a well known name on it and somebody will buy it. Whoever made this was counting on brand recognition to carry a sale....
 
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