Help identifying a pattern or what do you call it?

T. Erdelyi

T. Erdelyi

Joined
Feb 3, 2001
Messages
32,359
Alright now, I've been collectin' for around 40 years, 25 seriously and I am by no means an expert in any given aspect of knives or collectin' but I do consider myself an educated user/collector/ hobbyist maker. So you can imagine my surprise when I discovered that a particular manufacturer had made a particular pattern that I had seen but never knew they made before.

Follow me so far?

Now as it turns out, I'm not sure what to call the pattern in order to look them up on the internet and auction sites for info and pricing. I know what I think it should be called, it should be called a Lobster pattern but when I try to look the pattern up that way I get very little feedback, actually I get better luck looking up "Money Clip" as a pattern but of all the examples I have, only two are actually money clips. One is a Victorinox and the other is very similar in configuration except it's made in Italy by Latama.

Have you figured out what style of knife I'm talkin' about? I bet you most everyone over the age of 40 has seen one and most likely had one themselves.... and that knife is...., I don't know what to call it so I'll just show you. ;) :)

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The three shown, starting at the bottom are Colonial, (betcha didn't know Colonial made these did ya?) Zippo, (which is the manufacturer I usually associate with this type of knife) and Latama which is almost identical to the SAK aluminum version which is understandable considering they're both made in Europe. ;)

Also if I woulda looked at the the knife was made I woulda noticed that the knife was made with Colonial's typical tin shell construction. Unfortunately that still doesn't help me with the pattern. If you can come up with something better than a Stainless Lobster pattern I'd really appreciate it or is that all it really is, a stainless steel Lobster? Thanks for any help in solving a mystery I didn't know existed till this afternoon when I decided to look up some pics of the pattern to see who else makes them. :)
 
Only one is a money clip in the picture and technically I don't think any of them fit the definition of "pen knife" and if it does it a very loose interpretation of the definition. I've been wrong before but I believe it's more Lobster than Pen Knife, let's see who else weighs in.

fishcakes, I'm a transplant myself, originally from Exit 11 off the Parkway, 129 off the Turnpike, I job shopped my way around most of Jersey for a good 10+ years, ever consider movin' west, it's a lot friendlier at least as far as knives and guns go. :)
 
I think it's a Lobster Ted :thumbup:
 
I have a Japanese made one with file and pen blade. I'm away to university, so I can't post a photo of mine, but it's pretty much the same as the one below, only that the plastic front plate says Hyster. I'd have thought it's called a lobster, but I found many ones similar to mine under the term "money clip", which mine also is.

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(source: internet)
 
I still have both of those, actually everything you sent :) the Turtle Lobster is in a basket on my night stand and the Pearl Pen get carried quite often. In fact there it is right above the Case Cracked Ice Pen and under the William Henry Lancet. :) It takes and holds a very nice edge too. :)

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I'm trying to find a definitive definition of a Lobster, most sources either lump it with a multi blade work or they just add it to a list of additional diverse patterns. There's a section of the history lookin' to be written. There was a "Show your Lobster" thread, I'll see if I can find it, it had some gorgeous pics. Ah here it isVintage Lobsters, Show 'em
 
I think you're right it's a lobster, and it's the double-sidedness that makes it one, but most people wouldn't know that.
Most of mine are money clips, incidentally, except for a couple of longer slimmer older ones.
If I were searching for one I might try square rectangular lobster double-sided ambidextrous pen pocket gent's knife file scissors.
 
Thank you for linking the vintage lobster thread, Mr Erdelyi, I haven't noticed it before and I enjoy it very much! :)
 
ISKRA said:
I have a Japanese made one with file and pen blade. I'm away to university, so I can't post a photo of mine, but it's pretty much the same as the one below, only that the plastic front plate says Hyster. I'd have thought it's called a lobster, but I found many ones similar to mine under the term "money clip", which mine also is.

il_570xN.614819265_5dgb.jpg

(source: internet)
Click to expand...

I never thought about it much but I presume that every civilized industrial nation that makes knives would have a version of this, thanks for sharing and I'd be interested in seeing some more if anyone else has one, I'm sure Jack could come up with a Sheffield version. :)
 
T. Erdelyi said:
Only one is a money clip in the picture and technically I don't think any of them fit the definition of "pen knife" and if it does it a very loose interpretation of the definition. I've been wrong before but I believe it's more Lobster than Pen Knife, let's see who else weighs in.

fishcakes, I'm a transplant myself, originally from Exit 11 off the Parkway, 129 off the Turnpike, I job shopped my way around most of Jersey for a good 10+ years, ever consider movin' west, it's a lot friendlier at least as far as knives and guns go. :)
Click to expand...

I actually just got back from a cross country road trip about a month ago. Theres some awesome places around the country. Ive got my family in nj though and being the only man, moving away from my family just isnt an option.
 
Don't Lobsters have internal springs? Aren't the multi-bladed SAKs technically Lobsters? It's essentially the same concept and configuration as one of these.

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T. Erdelyi said:
I still have both of those, actually everything you sent :) the Turtle Lobster is in a basket on my night stand and the Pearl Pen get carried quite often. In fact there it is right above the Case Cracked Ice Pen and under the William Henry Lancet. :) It takes and holds a very nice edge too. :)

ZfDaEGo.jpg
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Click to expand...

I was glad to discover that my memory still works sometimes Ted! :D

T. Erdelyi said:
I never thought about it much but I presume that every civilized industrial nation that makes knives would have a version of this, thanks for sharing and I'd be interested in seeing some more if anyone else has one, I'm sure Jack could come up with a Sheffield version. :)
Click to expand...

Late here, but here we go :) ;) :thumbup:



Sheffield excelled at making Lobsters, but this is what became known as a Sheffield Pattern Lobster, it has a nail-file the full width of the knife.





T. Erdelyi said:
Don't Lobsters have internal springs? Aren't the multi-bladed SAKs technically Lobsters?
Click to expand...

They are indeed Ted :thumbup: The older 'true' Lobsters have a split central spring, whereas the modern ones, and SAKs, generally have two springs back to back :thumbup:

Have to hit the hay now, but happy to post more tomorrow :)
 
Levine's Guide puts that knife and similar Swiss army knives in the large category of "sportsman's knives". That seems like a good fit. I would call the small classic SD a lobster but I think sportsman's knife is probably best suited for the knife in your photo.

T. Erdelyi said:
Aren't the multi-bladed SAKs technically Lobsters? It's essentially the same concept and configuration as one of these.

jVcms60.jpg
Click to expand...
 
The Lobster was invented by Sheffield cutler James Crawshaw in the early 19th century. Crawshaw specialised in the finest pocket cutlery, and rose from humble beginnings to become Master Cutler in 1828. Writing in 1829, Sir Richard Phillips said of Crawshaw's knives, "His lobster knives, with four or more blades on slit-springs, with pearl and tortoise-shell handles, are the most perfect production of British manufacture." Crawshaw did not patent his invention, but made it available for others to make use of, which they readily did. Phillips tells us, "To this gentleman the trade is indebted for what is called the lobster knife, consisting of a spring, which, instead of forming the back, as in the old method, is placed along the middle of the handle, and between the scales or sides of the handle, so that it works, on each side, and hence admits of blades at each end, and even of any number of them. The mode of slitting the spring gave rise to many bladed knives in all their varieties."

Smaller Lobster knives are classified as Penknives (with a variety of sub-genre), the larger multi-bladed knives which make use of the Crawshaw's mechanism have their own pattern names, and collectively, they are Jack Knives.
 
I always just called them "Gentlemen's Pen" knives out of ignorance. ( I know know the case doesn't belong in this photo but it's so pretty I just left it.
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It's these 3 knives that made me realize I was actually collecting something! I was drawn to the skill it must have taken to design and build them...and I think they are beautiful.
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Thank you all for once again teaching me so much about my beloved knives. This place is great.

Oh and I've got to ask...is Jack Black actually a computer?


Clay
 
I thought they were just called money clip knives.

I know that they're technically lobsters too because they have springs in the middle and blades on both sides, but a trapper has two blades on the same end, so it's technically a jackknife, but we still call it a trapper because that's the word that paints the most accurate picture in our minds.

If you call it a lobster, we'd all think you were talking about one of these little guys with a nail file on the backside.
If you call it a money clip knife, we get a more accurate idea of what it is.
 
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