Help, please! "Stability" of Lapis Lazuli

T

Thor I am

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Oct 20, 2005
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Hello folks.

Even though I have tried my best to keep up reading on the Custom Knives forum over the last couple of months, I have not had a chance to actively participate.

But now I am in some need of the knowledgeable folks that "live" on these here pages.

I am close to ordering a knife where I am down to choosing the handle material. One of those materials is lapis lazuli and I am leaning towards using it.

I don't know much about it though.

I know that there are several members here who don't purchase fossilized ivory or elephant ivory because in climates like California they have a possibility to "move" and thereby crack.

Does lapis lazuli have any such "stability" issues? (Stability may be the wrong word, but it's all I could come up with at this time).

Any other issues to this material?
(I am not looking for comments related to taste but rather to remaining the same / undamaged over the years).

The maker who would use it is very reputable and knows how to handle the stuff. He has used it many times before. The only reason I am not asking him these questions is because it would be a difficult discussion at best as his communication ability in English is very limited and I would have a hard time trying to explain in simple terms what my concerns are.

Thanks much in advance for anyone who can provide knowledgeable advice on this matter.

Thor
 
You might also check and find out if it is reconstituted lapis or not. I know many knifemakers use that instead of the actual stone. The reconstituted stone will hold up a bit better. I don't think that the natural lapis would necessarily crack just because of the environment. When I use stone I am more worried about will it crack the first time it is dropped. I love the look of lapis, but in general do not like stone handles on blades I will be using all of the time. I would definitely take into consideration how much you plan on using the blade.
 
Hello Peter,
Yes, it is rock, but one website I looked at (can't remember which) also said it is soft. Not sure how that isn't a paradox, but it is what originally made me wonder if there could be any 'stability' issues.

Hello raythebigfoot,
This definitely will be a safe queen :o.
I wouldn't consider a stone for a user either. Thanks for the info. If I drop this knife, I'll drop myself right afterwards (just kidding, but that would be a major party foul).
 
No problems with this Lapis being unstable! It is an amazing inlay material.

With that said, it would not be my first choice to ever drop it, but I don't think weather or environment will ever affect it:

Mr. Bennica seems to agree that it is a great stone to work with....I have another piece on order with him that will also be Lapis inlay.

Most makers say it is getting harder and harder to find good examples, so get it while you can.

Nice photo from Coop eh?
8fvq8pi.jpg
 
Might ask Jay Fisher, I'm sure he has a lot of experience working with it as well since he uses stones a lot in his handles.
 
I think Peter has it right - there aren't the stability concerns with this material that you could have with ivories. As others have said, it can and will crack if dropped - but it's not going to shrink up on you the way ivories can.

Roger
 
Thor,

Lapis is totally stable in regards to shrinkage and such. It is not as delicate as you might think either. It is after all, a rock. It's not a micro crystalline quartz either, like tiger eye or jasper, which can be more brittle. I would liken it to the durability of pearl.

The key is making sure the piece doesn't have any "healed" cracks, or obvious inclusions. By a healed crack, I mean the stone can have what looks like a crack but not break when working it. The stone will display a line that is filled with usually calcite. While the stone will be stable during cutting and polishing, it is still weaker at that point and will not take any impact.

Also, if the stone will be used for an inlay, there should in my opinion not be fitted with zero gap into the frame. A couple of thousands gap will allow for a cushion so if the knife is dropped, and the frame is dinged it is less likely to push into the stone and chip the edge. It's hard to see a gap that small, but it makes a difference. I learned that the hard way.
 
Well Bailey was pretty through in his explanation but if you're looking for more information, try contacting David Broadwell. I have a sub-hilt fighter by him that is 15 years old - it hasn't moved, cracked or changed at all.

Come to think of it Les Robertson could give you some info as well.
 
here is a knife by Jose deBraga with both reconstituted Lapis and Ivory

standard.jpg


no movement of any of the components
 
Thanks a lot everyone.

I contacted the maker and gave him the go ahead to proceed with Lapis.

Now, as with all custom knives - the wait begins (or rather - continues).
 
Hi, I used to cut stones years ago and Lapis was always one of my favorites. Stable and reasonably hard and durable but don't drop it on anything hard it will fracture. Another softer stone with similar color would be Sodalite. You would not want a knife with this on it. You might want to double check that it is in fact Lapis and not Sodalite. Reconstituted stones are ground up then held together with Epoxy resins which will discolor with time. Again not the ideal material to use.
 
kenhills said:
You might want to double check that it is in fact Lapis and not Sodalite. Reconstituted stones are ground up then held together with Epoxy resins which will discolor with time. Again not the ideal material to use.
Click to expand...

I trust the maker. He has a very good reputation and he couldn't afford to use anything but what he says that he uses.

I appreciate the info and warning though.
 
Back to the top...

I'm in the same situation Thor was. The maker is interested in doing a handle with lapis inlay but isn't sure how to work it and where to get it.

Does anyone know of a reliable source for quality inlay material?

Thanks,

JD
 
The best lapis comes from Afghanistan and has been harder to find since all the fighting began in that part of the world. The higher grade is deep blue without the calcite inclusions.

If you do a search on ebay you will see a lot of variety.

Peter
 
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