Help with canned powder damascus forging

DanGraves

DanGraves

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Mar 5, 2006
Messages
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Well as the title says. I tried last week and here is what happened. I first packed the 1/8 inch steel can (lined with stainless steel heat treat foil) with 1084 powder and 4600KC from Kelly Cupples with other weldable steel rods etc. Packed the powder and vibrated and packed some more. Welded can on rebar for handle. Let soak for 1 hr at 2350 to 2400 then slowly pressed can and started to reduce size. I have read that a 60% reduction is needed to assure good weld. I placed back in forge and repeated and the can started to buckle. continued to re-heat and press and can split. I then had a block of steel that had some cracks in it but after removing from the can I continued to heat at welding temp and press. I slowly worked it down to an 1 1/8 inch square bar. Was hard to work it because I was using tongs to try to hold this chunk of steel and was concerned about stopping to try to weld a handle on it. The ends had bad welds but after cutting them back it looks fine. I ground all sides and it looks like I made weld all with out flux. Will know more as I forge out to flat bar. Is this the way its done? Is can always going to buckle and is 1/8 inch thick steel right for can? Any tips would be appreciated. Thanks.
 
Unless you leave out the stainless wrap the can will buckle. Depending on what you are intending to do with the billet you can do this with little effect. I have left it on before knowing I was going to mill the surface to get it clean and flat for re-stacking. I make sure I get below the can into the pattern before moving on. One thing you could do if you press is large enough is make a top and bottom die set. It has a hole in the middle of the bottom die to fit your handle. Put the heated billet with the handle into the hole and press the top and bottom along with the sides. I learned this trick from Tom Ferry. I gives you another couple of inches of material. That is enough for one or 2 more knives or tiles for mosaic.
 
AC, great tip. Makes so much sense as the can will weld to it. I have a press from Uncle Al and it is not big enough for the hole set up. Will I have to cut the handle off and re position it to reduce in that direction? Thanks for the answer as I can see it will make a big difference.
 
Dan you also need to reduce the size in very small amounts for the first 1/2 to 3/4s of an inch like <1/16th inch squeeze at a time. also when welding the ends on your can weld a bead from corner to corner diagonally and the side to side across the can so it looks like you welded a star on the ends.
 
Bill, I assume that you mean 1/16 squeeze then back in forge for 5 minutes? Repeat until reduced 3/4 of an inch? Great tip on the star also. What thickness is the can steel? Thanks so much.
 
I use 1/8 inch can but 3/8 ends. This helps reduce the end splitting in addition to working the ends down.
 
If you can't set up a rig to press the can ends, start off welding a 3 inch length of thick walled 1 1/4" angle to the corner of the can then weld your handle to it.

This give you two benifits,
as you are reducing the can side to side one leg of the angle will be getting thicker as the other gets thinner, which keeps your handle from getting reduced below the usable size

Also this allows you to turn your billet on end and get most of both ends between the press cross bars so you can press the ends back into the can.

Hope this helps.

Jim Arbuckle ABS JS
 
If you can't set up a rig to press the can ends, start off welding a 3 inch length of thick walled 1 1/4" angle to the corner of the can then weld your handle to it.

This give you two benifits,
as you are reducing the can side to side one leg of the angle will be getting thicker as the other gets thinner, which keeps your handle from getting reduced below the usable size

Also this allows you to turn your billet on end and get most of both ends between the press cross bars so you can press the ends back into the can.

Hope this helps.

Jim Arbuckle ABS JS
 
Jim, Thanks, I will try that. I am sure this will help. I love this forum for all the good folks who help.
 
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