How can you get through to somebody?

A

averageguy

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About 10 years ago I dated a woman who had a newborn baby. We were together a couple of years and I became very attached to the child.
By often swallowing my pride and kissing a lot of a**, I have managed to
continue to see the boy every so often.
I love him like my own and so does my family. He is 10 years old.

She went through a very bad experience (male perpetrator) a year ago and has been different ever since - especially in how she treats her son.

She severely restricts his movements and is overly punitive.

For example, she just informed me he's grounded from electronics for two weeks - admittedly, not the end of the world.
But, I'm not clear there was any offense; apparently he spilled a drink on her laptop - an accident.

It's difficult for me to recall being punished for this type of accident when I was a child and it seems harsh to me.
If I am wrong here - fine.

If not, I would welcome ideas on how to communicate with her.

I tried once to point out how harsh she's being and it just got loud and she insists it's up to her to raise as she sees fit - which is true.

I think it's difficult for the boy and I think his personality is changing.
He's such a good boy, it breaks my heart.

This type of question may be beyond the scope of this forum but I've been surprised by the depth of knowledge that resides here so I thought I'd give it a shot.
 
It depends on her motives...if it is out of anger, I believe it is wrong. However, if she is trying to get him to be more careful, that might be a little different. He is probably hurting because of the bad experience and is taking it out on the little guy. I'm sorry man, I really don't know. Try to be there for the little guy?
 
You didn't go into detail about what happened with the male perpetrator. If it was an extremely tramatic experience for her, and especially if it involved her son in any way, she could be dealing with the after effects of that experience.

If she will listen to you and if you can talk to her in a non-threatening manner and in a way that she will feel that you are not judging her, etc., I think she could probably benefit from some professional counseling. People who have been victims of violence or other traumatic events often have difficulty resuming their normal routine and possibly could over react to instances that previous would have not been a major issue.

That being said, I don't know enough about the situation to offer more than that. Sometimes just talking to a good therapist a few times really works wonders and helps people see things from a different perspective.

Best of luck.

TJ
 
Rough situation. The details don't really matter, but she is unhappy about her life right now, and that makes it hard for her to deal with people, even her son.

But she is still talking to you. So don't focus on the specific problem about her grounding him. Just try to encourage her to "accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative" and make the most of her opportunities.

If she gets her self-confidence up, she won't find it so hard to communicate with her son.
 
I agree with Judy, she would benefit from continuing contact with a good proffessional counselor. A good counselor can help her deal with all the feelings she's having, to understand them and to help her learn how to control them. Not allow them to control her. I'm with you, it would be a shame for the boy to suffer permanently from his mother's bad experience.
 
Just don't do or say anything that will make her tell you to take a hike. If you're cut of from the kid then you cant try to help or even just be there for the kid. If you aren't related then I doubt there is anything you can do if she cuts you off.
 
Not to sound uncaring, but it sounds to me like a hopeless situation. You can't save her, you can't save her kid, you can only save yourself. Walk away.
 
averageguy said:
For example, she just informed me he's grounded from electronics for two weeks - admittedly, not the end of the world.
But, I'm not clear there was any offense; apparently he spilled a drink on her laptop - an accident.
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10 yr old boy was grounded from videogames for 2 weeks? Oh, the horror! When I was in Jr. High and I got a D on my report card, my Da took away my Atari 2600, my board games, my comic books, and every other thing in my room that looked like it might distract me from my schoolwork -- UNTIL THE NEXT REPORT CARD!!! (I think that was 2 months).

If we had something like a THOUSAND DOLLAR LAPTOP COMPUTER NEEDED FOR WORK and I SPILLED A SODA ON IT . . . I seriously believe he would've beat me with the belt until I died.

Kid got off EASY.
 
I don't know the specifics, but if my son spilled something on my lap top, and the lap top suffered any damamge, he would be punished. But my son is a confirmed serial spiller and doesn't ay attention sometimes.
If he was using her laptop at the time, the punishment doesn't seem inappropriate.

But there is nothing that will get you in hot water, or is more dangerous than getting involved in the way a woman raises her sons. Happened to me with my ex wife and step sons. Definite contributing factor to the ex part.
 
averageguy said:
She went through a very bad experience (male perpetrator) a year ago and has been different ever since...
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"She... has been different ever since." That's the key. There was a turning point. Something triggered a dramatic change in her behavior.

I suspect from the very limited description of that something that you've given us that it was tramatic to her. I suspect that she has not shared all of the details of that experience with you or with anyone else. I suspect that she has lied to you and to others about the experience -- not that it took place but the details of and lied in a way that actually minimizes the experience. I suspect that the experience was worst than she's told anyone. I suspect that she's not only traumatized by the experience but humiliated by it too. And all of that is eating away at her.

If my suspecions are correct, then you have to be careful here because she has told lies to you (and keep in mind that when I say she has told lies, what I suspect is not that she's exagerated the situation but quite the opposite, that she has tried to minimize and cover up the situation to protect her own ego) you are now a risk to her. If she thinks that you might learn the truth and learn that she has lied to you, she may try to sever her relationship with you so that she doesn't have to confront that problem. But you're not the only one. Everyone who knows her is in this situation. She may actually try to flea the situation physically, pack herself and her son up and move to the other side of the country where nobody will know about her "bad experience" and she can start over again. That would not be good because that would only be burying the problem deeper.

If my suspecions are correct, then Judy is correct, your friend needs professional counseling and needs it ASAP and needs it from someone who is an expert in this sort of thing. BUT, your friend -- and her son who is along for the ride -- also needs you. She needs you to help her get that counseling.
 
averageguy said:
it's up to her to raise as she sees fit - which is true.
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That pretty much sums it up right there.

She took away his video games for 2 weeks for gods sake, she didn't put bamboo shoots under his nails.

Unless you see her actually abuse her child, or she asks for your opinion on how she raises him, you will save yourself a lot of stress by MYOB.
 
My best suggestion would be to pray for her and her son!! I know that isn't the answer you are looking for. But, never underestimate the power of prayer!
 
Pretty much since he isn't your kid, your say means absolutely zero. Sorry. I also agree that getting video games taken away for a couple weeks is basically a free ride. Actually, it'll probably do the kid some good. There's a whole WORLD outside the house. A lot of kids don't know that these days. I would suggest very strongly against trying to play armchair therapist and/or asserting any sort of parental-like judgment over a child you have no right to assert it with. Just my 2 cents.
 
Averageguy,

Without going into details, I've had some experience interacting with women who've been abused by male perpetrators, although this experience has been through everyday life, not as a trained professional. That being said, you've received some sound advice thus far. Here is my take -

Re-read Gollnick's post. He hit the nail on the head by saying the woman is most likely in denial about the event, to some extent. However, the fact that she has openly admitted she was perpetrated by a man is the single most important step to her recovery - she's not denying the experience itself, which is huge.

The next step from there is her coping with it. This is done in several ways, one primary method being smaller forms of denial, as Gollnick mentioned. In all likelihood, she's telling herself that it wasn't as bad as she makes it out to be; that she should be over it, it's been a whole year and it was only a single incident; yet these self-protestations that are aimed at keeping her own fear and horror at bay do not heal her internally. They are normal, but they're not where she needs to spend the rest of her life.

She probably feels completely humiliated and degraded as a human and especially a woman. She's most likely ridden with self-denigration about how she should've suspected that guy, how she shouldn't have gotten involved in the situation that led to the perpetration, how she should've done anything at all to alter the situation. But she also recognizes that she was ultimately powerless, and that is the most terrifying situation of all for a woman to be in.

She was victimized and is struggling under her victimhood. The smaller forms of denial are a coping method by which she's trying to regain power in her own life and body. Her not divulging full information to key individuals is another self-chosen step towards regaining power. And, truthfully, she now has a larger, more accurate view of the world. Evil does exist and it does happen to us. Of course, right now, she's hyper-sensitive to this. Her strict treatment of her son is another expression of the new perspective she's acquired.

She's willing to talk to you and remain friends. You do not know how amazingly big that is. It says that she truly wants to continue having a life. In many ways, she has more fight and hope in her than other women would have. As her friend, though, the single most important thing you can give her is a strong shoulder with an open, nonjudgmental ear.

This woman and her son are in serious need of counseling. You cannot make them do this - she must decide it for herself. If given the opportunity in conversation, though, you can drop casual suggestions. Be forewarned, though - not all counselors are created equal. Some are a true God-send. Others wreck havoc. I would look through listings and find counselors who specialize in post-perpetrator, traumatized women. Then, talk to various counselors/psycholigists and get a feel for them. Gentle understanding, reinforced by personal strength, are traits that help. Odds are, your friend will feel more at ease with a female counselor.

Know that your friend has been traumatized and does see the world differently. She's currently more paranoid and hypersensitive than she will be after she's fully healed, but the fact that she's retained former social contacts and is still parenting her son in a non-loose manner is some evidence that she's coping instead of being destroyed. A good counselor could enable her to regain her self and her life, while also helping her process and incorporate the new knowledge that she's unfortunately received.

Unless she's abusive to her son, don't get onto her about her new strictness. For you, the most important thing is to keep communication open and nonjudgmental. Be willing to listen to all she'll tell you, but don't push hard for revelation.

Good luck and keep us posted on the situation.

Zack
 
Dont push it or she will most likely keep you away from the boy alltogether.
You mentioned she was getting restrictive of his movements, and if he enjoys seeing you, taking that privilidge away could be a form of punishment as well.
Soon he will be old enough to make his own decisions and possibly be able to go out with you alone, provided the mother trusts you, so try not to invade her domain too much when it doesn't seem like she needs aggravation at the moment.
 
Good GAUD you need to stay out of the mother's way when she is raiseing her child alone!.....

Say, NOTHING.....Have no advice to offer,,,,
Dont say a peep to anyone else about the topic...
It's truly none of anyone else's concern....
 
The best you can do is try to steady her and be there for the child. Take them both out for a good time when you can. Good luck.
 
The best you can do is try to steady her and be there for the child. Take them both out for a good time when you can. Good luck.
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Very concise. That's the best nutshell advice yet, IMO.
 
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