How Custom is Custom?

[Boats]

About a year ago, I came to possess a Custom NS 110FG in BG-42 and water buff that I like so much I just ordered its twin.

I have never really thought about it, but just how "custom" are these pieces?

What I guess I am driving at is who knows the process? I know that when I ordered my own, there is a quote:

"I have been with Buck Knives for over 25 years, learning every facet of knife-making. I will build your custom knife to your specifications, and you have my personal assurance that I will make your knife to the highest quality standards. Whether the knife is intended for regular use or as a personal collectible, may the pride of ownership be as strong as our knives and our 4-Ever Warranty. With the knife, you will receive a Certificate of Authenticity. I look forward to creating a great custom knife just for you."
Sincerely, Richard Rishel
Custom Knife Maker

Not to diss Mr. Rishel, but what are the "highest quality standards" at the Buck Custom Shop? Does this mean that every tolerance for each part is checked and rechecked and rejected if not perfect? Does it mean that the lockup and smoothness of the action will rival the blast door at NORAD where the run of the mill 110 will at times in certain examples suggest blade wiggle? My current one suggests that's the case, but maybe the odds were with me?

Does it mean that scales were matched to the best ability of the human eye, rather unlike the mildly mismatched scales on my 419?

I know that "custom" can also mean "made to order out of a common parts bin," because I am paying nowhere near "actual" custom prices for a folder.

However, since I am paying about four times as much as I would for a standard 110 and one of those times is for blade steel and scale choices, what are the extra steps taken to earn that "Certificate of Authenticity?

Is it any more than Mr. Rishel ensuring that no one who pays the freight gets a Monday morning or Friday afternoon special?

I'd love to think so, but who can give me the straight dope on the extra processes, and/or skill and labor that goes into a Buck Custom?

 

[gd526]

The two you have are exemplary in the promised regards, Boats? Doesn't that tell you something? Well, add mine and every one else's to the 'highest standards' and there is your answer......110 Custom Design knives from Buck ARE the Standard! I don't recall any one being disappointed on this forum or among my other friends either. When my CS 110 showed up it displaced my micarta 501 as my right front pocket EDC and that is after carrying the 501 since I was in junior high school, thirty years ago! The 501 isn't going anywhere but the pride in ownership the CS 110 has given to me.....welll, I just would not leave it at home gathering dust. In my suggestions, the CS 110s are easily worth the price and it would appear from my view, most of us Buck fans have already, or will, posess more then one. Money where the mouth is, for sure! BTW- mine is sambar, N/S, engraved personalized bolsters, f/g, bg-42. Try one of those and report back!

Dave

 

[Richard Matheny]

Custom from the current "Custom Shop" means you have a limited selection of materials to select from in specifying your own knife. I'm sure Richard was picked to work on these knives because he exhibits the care in craftsmanship an off production line knife deserves given the premium cost involved. Further, he has the experience to deal with the material variations he finds with the materials involved such as matching stag inlay halves.

On a related topic, us old timers do not think of the current "Custom Shop" to be THE custom shop. When we think of Buck Customs we think of the 900 series knives and the modified production knives that came from the 1982 to 1992 "Custom Shop". When you placed an order with that shop you could literally design your own knife if you wanted to or you could "build" a knife from the custom catalog. It was a shame when this function shut down at Buck. To Joe Houser's credit he feels Buck customers should be able to obtain custom knives from Buck. The current activity is a compromise Joe has created that seems to fit into the current Buck high volume focus. We are all lucky that the limited customs we are currently able to purchase are still available. I doubt that this is a highly profitable aspect of Buck's business.

 

[Evil Eye Earl]

We are all lucky that the limited customs we are currently able to purchase are still available. I doubt that this is a highly profitable aspect of Buck's business.

This is my reason for supporting Buck Knives by buying a few new production knives each year....to thank them for having a Custom shop and the limited editions......besides loving Buck knives We are indeed lucky.:thumbup:

 

[Buckaholic]

... We are all lucky that the limited customs we are currently able to purchase are still available. I doubt that this is a highly profitable aspect of Buck's business.

Good post Richard.

Yep, I consider myself extremely lucky when I take out one of my Custom 110 knives. My EDC is my 2007 NS Damascus Koa. It's a knife you can depend on and looks good doing it.

Hope that at a minimum, the Custom Shop never goes away. While I would like to see more options/models, it is quite understandable that this is a niche market for a few of us knife knuts and cost of doing business certainly has to be considered.

Thank you Buck and Joe for keeping it going.
Thanks also to Richard for his workmanship.

This is my reason for supporting Buck Knives by buying a few new production knives each year....to thank them for having a Custom shop and the limited editions......besides loving Buck knives We are indeed lucky.:thumbup:

Yeah, what E3 said.

Not to totally jack the thread, but has anyone ordered one of the Alpha Damascus knives from the Custom Shop? A pic or two would be cool :thumbup:

 

[Hawkeye5]

Not to totally jack the thread, but has anyone ordered one of the Alpha Damascus knives from the Custom Shop? A pic or two would be cool :thumbup:[/QUOTE]
Hey Goose I aint sure but didn't J.B. Have one a while back.
Hawkeye

 

[110 Dave]

wow some very good questions ... i reserve the right to comment further when i have more them 60 sec b efore i get kicked off the dile up con

 

[chickentrax]

However, since I am paying about four times as much as I would for a standard 110 and one of those times is for blade steel and scale choices, what are the extra steps taken to earn that "Certificate of Authenticity?

IMO, the CoA is your guarantee that Buck did the work on that custom, not some basement mangler selling them on eBay as "Buck Customs"...

Some of the aftermarket "customs" are very good, but they're not done by Buck...and not covered by the Buck lifetime warranty...

 

[DarrylS]

Custom from the current "Custom Shop" means you have a limited selection of materials to select from in specifying your own knife. The current activity is a compromise Joe has created that seems to fit into the current Buck high volume focus. We are all lucky that the limited customs we are currently able to purchase are still available. I doubt that this is a highly profitable aspect of Buck's business.

...I think Richard may have hit it right on the head with these excerpted comments from his post. Be they "custom" or if you want to call them something like "special order"...these knives are put together using a variety of parts Buck has made available that we the customer have decided we want in our knives. Because they are not made on the mass production floor we can expect to see a well put together knife and that is what Buck delivers. The fact that the materials used in the parts we are allowed to choose from are premium materials...we can expect to receive a premium knife...and we do. To Joe and to Buck...Thanks for giving us this option when we want a special Buck...:thumbup:

 

[Tin Sue]

IMO, the CoA is your guarantee that Buck did the work on that custom, not some basement mangler selling them on eBay as "Buck Customs"...

Some of the aftermarket "customs" are very good, but they're not done by Buck...and not covered by the Buck lifetime warranty...

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

 

[Stainz]

In my vast collection of regular 110s, perhaps six, and custom shops, two, and similar, a 560XLT Ti, only the latter is not top drawer in fit and function. I attribute that to the Ti handles - it really 'galls' me, so to speak. I guess we have to face the harsh reality of 'What else can you do to make it work better?' re the custom shop goodies. The answer is usually very little, except offer a choice of materials whose inclusion in the normal production process would keep them out of Wally World, etc. I, for one, really love my two custom shops - and can't find a fault with any of my 'regular' 110s, as to fit & function. I have been spoiled - the basic 110 is a great EDC - the customs are for 'dress-up'. I'll get more customs...

Stainz

 

[Hawkeye5]

Where is J.B. anyway?

 

[jb4570]

Not to totally jack the thread, but has anyone ordered one of the Alpha Damascus knives from the Custom Shop? A pic or two would be cool :thumbup:

Hey Goose I aint sure but didn't J.B. Have one a while back.
Hawkeye (Where is J.B. anyway?)[/QUOTE]

Hi Jeff,

This old man is still around....just been working my .ss off.....to help pay for all the new Buck knives I want...LOL. Oh and dealing with some family issues. Nope brother....I don't have one of the Alpha custom shop job's...yet. The knife you are thinking of is the 196 Mini Alpha I have that is a stag chipflint Timberlake. I have not yet convinced myself to pull the trigger on a Dammy 193....it would cost me about 350 bones.

Now that brother Goose and Hawkeye Jeff have posed the question to jack this thread.....has anyone got a custom shop 193? This was asked a while back and only one guy showed us a photo of an Elk CS 193. So....anyone got some to show off???? That just might get us to pull the trigger.

jb4570

 

[110 Dave]

BUCK CUSTOM - wow that is hard to define for sure!
there has been a lot of conflict as to what is a custom from BKI..
i have resorted to calling mine= Standard Issues or Non-Standard
here is why...
i own some of the old custom shop knives. they are .. well sweet is mild..
and on the new customs i own some of them and they are sweet also..
BKI on closing the true custom shop did at least leave a door open were we could order a knife from bin parts in a configuration we wanted..
but any number of any type can be ordered if available..
so what is a custom... of what bki sold...i have seen the same design on a blade and it marked and sold as :
custom stamped... some times with a serial number some time none..
year marked as a limited edition with and with out a number
so of the issues there can be 4 ways it comes that it is a collectable..
and ok lets address the really odd knives..
many knives were made that were never sold to some one not with the company… these include custom made for a buddy on the working floor or distributor or some one on the 2ed floor in the business offices...
this included a LOT of knives that were maybe one off sales samples / art test blades / or standard blades put in other handles as a "lets see or some thing different knife" or what are called proto type by most..

either way we- as the public- could not order a knife like that..
i have given up on trying to classify all these knives into neat definitions as buck never used set out any definitions and
so i have the following for my own use and labeling…
Standard Issues = this would include the current custom shop knives and any past catalog limited editions that the public can order…
Non-Standard = any thing not in the above category...
which would would include the old true custom shop and award knives and also includes: sales man samples or demo knives.. art test knives or a re-blade of a older frame with a new issue blade or like a etched blade that normanly came in a brass frame only… but that some employee got in a nickel frame
Or a drop point blade in a frame that was not normal to find that way..
one example= Bucksway has a centennial issue frame with a centennial anvil stamped drop point 112 blade !! now that really is non-standard ! ( i had never seen one )…

Buck has not done as Case knives (owned by Zippo) and took legal action to make the non buck people stop making “buck customs” ..
i feel horrible for those that order a "custom " from ebay...
they are many times subject to disappointment on getting it and if there is ever a issue with it they are stuck...
Joe gets lots of knives that bki wont fix.
I feel BKI should at least make them say they are “ xyz company customs of a buck knife not a xyz custom buck…such as the David Yellowhorse or Wild Bill Cody issues… buck should have a way control the quality of what has the Buck Brand on it…
i have said enught now ...thanks for reading ...
feel free to carry on i do not mean to hijack the thread..

 

[A.P.F.]

Thanks for the education, Dave, always welcome. :thumbup:

 

[chickentrax]

I pretty much agree with 334dave...But...

How about a "former Buck Custom shop employee" selling a Custom Buck??? How would you tell if it was a "factory custom" or a custom "custom"???

How about one of navajoprincess2b's "custom bucks"??? They're not all Yellowhorse customs...

I have one of each...I consider them "Custom Bucks", whether Buck Inc will admit to sponsoring them or not...(doesn't really matter to me)...

 

[Boats]

There is no hijack of this thread possible. When all of the BKI website contains one paragraph about what the CS is, or isn't, and no history or processes are defined, folks like me wonder about it and ask questions learned fans seem to like answering.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[chickentrax]

When all of the BKI website contains one paragraph about what the CS is, or isn't, and no history or processes are defined, folks like me wonder about it...

We all wonder about it...Even some of the Buck managers who post here wonder about it...

 

[110 Dave]

well this is one thead worth bringing up again..
currently the buck custom 110 and alphas that we order were made on the custom line the same line were the knives of limited editions for larger orders ...
like some of the high dollar hunting stores sell...
this caused some noticable delays at times in shiping you your custom 110 ...

Joe [being the good knife nut he is] steped up to the plate and started haveing the shop he runs help with the back log!
he was able to reduce the time by over half to get your 'buck' to you!
as of now the custom line is still so bussy that
Joe is now doing all the custom shop 110's and alphas...
AND you can STILL order one by phone or email !!!
{{tell the web site gets the bugs worked out }}

many times he has gotten the turn around time down to less then a week!!
[[depending of course on parts being on hand...]]
and some times less then two days being bult!
unless they are swamped there is still jest
one crafts person working on your knife!
and if they are right bussy at
Joe's Kustom Knife Shack....:thumbup:
{humm ... now dont that jest sound marvlous!!!}
well you lucky dog ...
you will have a good chance that
Joe HIS self will help with or make your knife!!!
now how KooL is that?
the only thing better would be if Buck got
Leroy to come back on board and work with Joe at the
Buck Kustom Knife Shack
hay what are dreams made of?

 

[chickentrax]

the only thing better would be if Buck got
Leroy to come back on board and work with Joe at the
Buck Kustom Knife Shack
hay what are dreams made of?

Er...Would Buck have to pay for all Leroy's family to move out with him???

(Assuming he wants to leave SoCal)