How do people learn to sharpen a knife?

B

byteblock

Joined
Jul 13, 2012
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I've watched probably every youtue video on the subject and I own...........let me count them real quick because they are laying around every where............12 different sharpening stones. Some are made of diamond, some are ceramic, some are arkansas and some are waterstones and I made sure each was a different grit from the other. After working on one knife for several weeks sometimes for a couple hours a day, an old Kershaw Blackout from like 2001 when I believe they were made 440A which I consider a mediocre steel so I don't care about ruining the knife, I still have yet to be able to shave hair or slice paper..........

So......what's next?
 
A sharpie is your best friend while sharpening. It let's you know that you have fully reprofiled the edge. Strops are also a great asset.
 
Perhaps the problem is that "They are laying around everywhere" and not being used? (Light hearted remark) Get you one and an old 1095 steel blade and go to work on it and learn how to use it. The videos are good, but only if you learn something from them, and then put to practice what you have learned. Basically, grind an even bevel on both sides until you get a Burr, then turn over and get the burr to show up on the other side, and then slowly and with light strokes work the burr off. Easy peasy, right? Try it until it "clicks" in your head what needs to happen. Success is yours for the taking. (RE: practice)

Blessings,

Omar
 
Whats next is to thoroughly examine your procedure because you are most definitely doing something wrong. A properly apexed and deburred 220 grit edge will cut paper and shave at least few hairs, tell us more about your process with as much detail as possible.
 
I learned by watching my father use his old dished-out Arkansas stone in the early '70s. He soon turned over all sharpening responsibilities to me.

The best thing would be if you could have personal instruction from someone who has it figured out. The videos can be good, but live is best.

Consistent angle control is critical. Make sure that you are actually hitting the edge (I like to sharpen at about 14-15 degrees/side, and many factory edges come more obtuse, which means I have to knock the shoulder back at 14-15 degrees before I actually hit the edge). And finally, if you are pressing too hard at the final stages you will only create a huge burr.
 
First thing I learned when sharpening by hand was to not put any pressure on the blade. Use nothing but the weight of the blade. Start at the base of the blade and move toward the tip while at the same time crossing the stone. By that I mean you should start with the base at one side and smoothly end with the tip at the other. Then flip it and bring the edge back toward you in the same manner with the other side of the knife. The best guideline for the right angle is to look at the very edge of the blade. If it is laying flat against the stone, you're at about the right angle, and a little shifting is ok until you get a firm hand at it. No one has to sharpen quickly, so take your time and develop a technique. Once you get the basics, you'll get better at it. I recommend some DMT Diafold pocket sharpeners. Diamond stones are the easiest to get a result with.
 
Im not good at sharpening by hand................thats what strops are for. I can get a good working edge on a knife with stones and ceramic cups but to get a shaving edge i use a strop from stropman.
 
I got a Spyderco Sharpmaker yesterday. Today in less than 10 minutes I resurrected one of my old Victorinox knives from when I was in scouts. This was used for whittling and to use with my firestarter. Now it is factory sharp again. I think that says enough
 
As someone else said, a marker is a great indicator for if you're actually making contact with the stone all the way to the cutting edge. Mark both sides of the edge with a marker and try sharpening. The stone will remove the marker as you sharpen so repeat as necessary to make sure you're actually hitting all the way to the edge.

Watch out for using too much pressure while sharpening. As you go up in stone grit, you really don't need too much pressure to get a good cutting edge from my experience with a sharpmaker. I only use extra force if the knife is really dull and I need to remove more steel using the coarser grits.

Maybe this video will help: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MHe_8wTHmg

Good luck.
 
I took the cheesy way out and had my bro CNC a sharpener that works just like the Wicked Edge. Then we bought Wicked Edge stones. All I do is set the angle I want. The jig keeps everything consistent. It doesn't look as nice as a Wicked Edge, but it functions just as well. If you have a little know how, you can mock one up on CAD software, take the code to a CNC machinist, and probably get one made on the cheap. The only real expense is buying the sharpening stones.

Even reprofiling on a jig type sharpener is easy. It's just time consuming.

Two of the knives I sharpened recently showing mirror polished edges.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B23NJwYqOwmnVENRemNHUmE0OHM/edit?usp=sharing

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B23NJwYqOwmnd2p4ZUlRSkQ4dE0/edit?usp=sharing

This video shows my sharpener. I took a video of this for my friend that I was sharpening the knives for. So if you don't want to hear commentary, just mute. ;) This is the knife in the second video above. It was in the early stages of being sharpened. Sorry about my finger in the way of the lens. It was kinda hard to hold my camera phone while videotaping.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B23NJwYqOwmnYlMzWUl6X01WVEU/edit?usp=sharing
 
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I am not really interested in buying a new sharpening system considering I have like $500+ in various stones right now. The way I figure it is if I can't sharpen a knife using a flat stone which can be used in the field then I shouldn't even try. I don't like the idea of having to use something the requires jigs and flat bench rests etc etc because I think of them as cheating. If people were sharpening knives 200 years ago using flat stones then I should be able to do the same with all the crazy materials available today that weren't available back then.
 
"Perhaps the problem is that "They are laying around everywhere" and not being used? (Light hearted remark) Get you one and an old 1095 steel blade and go to work on it and learn how to use it. The videos are good, but only if you learn something from them, and then put to practice what you have learned. Basically, grind an even bevel on both sides until you get a Burr, then turn over and get the burr to show up on the other side, and then slowly and with light strokes work the burr off. Easy peasy, right? Try it until it "clicks" in your head what needs to happen. Success is yours for the taking. (RE: practice)

Blessings,

Omar "








they are being used which is why I posted this to begin with.
 
Ah. Wasn't aware you meant on the field. I guess I have nothing for you then, since I don't sharpen on the field. I will say though that if you you have a burr on the edge, it will be a lot less sharp until you remove that burr.
 
I suppose you could start with the one stone you're going to have with you in the field, if we go by your own restrictions.

Which stone will that be exactly ?
 
I got a lot better once I realized its not some careful art, its just evenly removing metal from both sides at an angle till they meet in the middle then taking the bur off and convexing the edge a bit on a strop. I spent too much time trying to do identical strokes in just one direction and flipping non stop. You don't do that till you're putting on the final touches.
 
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byteblock said:
I've watched probably every youtue video on the subject and I own...........let me count them real quick because they are laying around every where............12 different sharpening stones. Some are made of diamond, some are ceramic, some are arkansas and some are waterstones and I made sure each was a different grit from the other. After working on one knife for several weeks sometimes for a couple hours a day, an old Kershaw Blackout from like 2001 when I believe they were made 440A which I consider a mediocre steel so I don't care about ruining the knife, I still have yet to be able to shave hair or slice paper..........

So......what's next?
Click to expand...

It's possible that the whole bevel is not being scratched evenly and thus the apex (the very edge) might not be getting hit. If that's so, it might be because of uneven angles, wrist control, and/or pressure. It shouldn't take hours, given all the quality stones you have to choose from--not even if it's D2 and you need to fully reprofile--it shouldn't take hours over several days, especially given your simple goal of just getting it to slice paper. What's probably happening is that your sharpening technique is improper (I'm just guessing and I'm certainly not criticizing, but I really think that's probably it), and thus no amount of sharpening (improperly) will get the knife sharp, because you might be overshooting the apex and then undershooting it (or never reaching the apex, at all), and that leads the an edge that is permanently dull.

My advice is to choose one stone--and working on that 440A steel, I might go with the Arkansas or a water stone, medium grit (1000 or so), and only that. If your technique is good, you *will* slice paper after sharpening. Watch the videos (again) by knifenut (MrEdgy81). HeavyHanded and CrimsonTideShooter have vids on YouTube worth watching (Neuman2010 and JDavis882 respectively). When watching, you should pay special attention to the hands and wrists: the way the knife is held, the way pressure is applied to it on the stones, and the way the blade is swept, because I suspect that that's where your problems lie.

Good luck and don't get frustrated, just keep working on improving technique. Just my dos pesos.
 
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+1 on the Sharpie - it really does help you identify when you've sharpened all the way to the edge. I would also recommend picking up a small 10x handheld magnifying glass or jeweler's loupe. It helps you to see what the edge looks like up close. My favorite is the Belomo Triplet 10x - which you can find at several Internet retailers.

Practice makes perfect!

TedP
 
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