How do you freehand? Need advice!

Bladenoobie1

Bladenoobie1

Joined
Jul 20, 2012
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I recently began to practice free handing with an old aluminum oxide stone I have. I'm able to get phonebook paper slicing results on the coarse (grey stone) but when I move to the fine (brown stone) it gets duller! I always make a burr and remove it too. Any ideas why it is like so? Also what are some good free hand videos for technique or techniques you do yourself? I have an arkansas tri-hone, soft, hard, surgical black, coming from Knifearts so I want to make sure I use it to the best of its ability. I'm having trouble maintaining a consistent scratch pattern. The edge is refined with a strop, shaves hair like a beast, and slices through newspaper, but is just not as consistent as I'd like it to be. Also I have trouble sharpening the tip. For reference, this is the knife I'm sharpening:
IMG_1690.jpg

- Bladenoobie1
 
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It all about feel, the more you can feel the more you can correct. With freehand you constantly make micro adjustments correcting the angle as the blade glides down the stone, this also is the reason you find some convexity to the bevel with freehand. I found pressure points within my own technique and discovered that it was universal between blade types, shapes, and sizes.

I talk about it more here,
[video=youtube;bYyUDeqjgx8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYyUDeqjgx8[/video]
 
I'm having trouble sharpening one side of the edge. Since I'm left handed, the right face of the blade always gets a better grind, but when I turn the blade around, its hard for me to be as consistent. Also when I get my finer arkansas stones, should I be making a burr on each stone?
 
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Typically you need to raise the spine. It's hard to judge angle when the edge is coming at you because you can't see the distance from spine to stone so you end up using a much lower angle thinking its the same. Sometimes facing the side of the stone while sharpening can help to understand this little grinding flaw.
 
I'll try that next time I sharpen my knife. As for raising a burr is it essential to do so at every stone?
 
It's essential when setting a edge though it will "follow" the edge through the stone progression. Your goal for a dull knife is to reach the apex on the bevel planes, once reached a burr will form from excessive metal being ground away. No need to form it again though through grinding with finer stones it will appear again only smaller, this time its not a burr from the slopes intersecting but a lump of debris that was the old scratch pattern.
 
Do you have any idea why when I moved to the fine side of the aluminum oxide stone my knife became duller? After removing burr and all? This stone is pretty beat up and I had to lap both sides prior to use. Also before I didn't know how to use an oil stone right and used water, soap, and various oils for lubrication. Would this have ruined the fine side or is my technique bad? I'll be receiving the tri-hone arkansas stone tomorrow in soft, hard, and surgical-black so I hope the issue isn't in my technique.
 
My guess is that when you go to the finer stone your angle changes and you are basically rounding off your edge. Always feel your edges every step because sooner or later with enough experience you can just feel the edge and know how to adjust your technique to get the edge you want. Also test the whole length of my blade because sometimes one part will be hair popping sharp and another won't shave at all. You then adjust your technique to fix the error.
You are not going to get perfect bevels on each side or from the heel to the tip free handing. As a right hander the right side of my blade is always has a little more of a bevel than the left especially on the belly of the blade because it is harder to be consistent making that curve but a couple of degrees difference is not that big of deal. Re-curve blades are the hardest and wharncliff or sheep foots blades are the easiest to sharpen.
Also technique is good for the beginner because you don't have enough experience or practice yet but in the future don't let technique get in the way of your goal of a sharp knife. I have used and still use to an extent about every technique out there but the goal is removing metal from the edge of the knife and depending on the size and type of stone and the size and type of the knife or the blade shape or steel the knife uses you may have to adjust your technique but that comes with experience.
 
Perhaps I am. I don't change my form or position when sharpening on a finer stone though. I do the exact same thing which is to make a burr and remove it. Would simply refining the scratch pattern be enough when going to the finer stone or should I still make a burr? My arkansas stones come tomorrow so I'm pretty excited to get to use them.
 
For me when I get to the fine stones it is more about polishing the edge than creating and removing a burr. I establish my edge with a courser stone by creating a burr and removing it and then polish it on the fine and extra fine stones followed by leather stropping with a red compound I use diamond stones and I use no lubrication.I use DMT stones I use the Blue,Red,Green and Tan. They call the red a fine stone but to me it is medium at best I usually go to at least the green.On the Green I don't worry about a burr it is more about refining the edge with the strop to give the final polish.
A sharpie marker and a magnifying glass are good tools for a beginner,use the sharpie on the edge to see exactly what you are removing and the magnifying glass to really get a good look at what the stones are doing to the edge and see if maybe you have any inconsistent spots.
 
knifenut1013 said:
Typically you need to raise the spine. It's hard to judge angle when the edge is coming at you because you can't see the distance from spine to stone so you end up using a much lower angle thinking its the same. Sometimes facing the side of the stone while sharpening can help to understand this little grinding flaw.
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I've never been able to get the hang of sharpening with just one hand, I think for just this reason. The technique I've developed is to face the stone sideways and hold the knife in my left hand to work the bevel on the left side of the blade, then switch the knife over to my right hand to do the right side bevel. My edges really improved once I started doing it this way. I've not seen anyone else doing this is any vids, so I guess it's a rather unconventional method, but it works for me.

Anyway, to the op, you might want to try switching hands for each side of the blade and see if it works for you.
 
I used to switch hands but there were defects in my technique with the left (non-dominant) hand that would not consistently go away. It took some time to switch to a dominant hand only, left hand for pressure and control, right hand for pitch. It was well worth the effort.

Something else to consider - you margin of error is equal to the size of your abrasive. Eg at 320 grit your pitch can be off that much and your plane will appear flat. As you progress down in grit size your pitch control needs to be that much better. Planes that appeared flat at lower grit will appear quite convexed and getting proper treatment of the apex becomes difficult. Not a problem except when it goes past a certain point and you're making your apex larger than it should be. At that point your finer edges will feel overly smooth and lack 'bite'.
 
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I can't offer any of my own advice on the subject.I'm pretty bad at freehand sharpening myself,but So-Lo made a good thread with vids on the subject HERE.
 
HeavyHanded said:
you margin of error is equal to the size of your abrasive.
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So true. My freehand "kit" consists of 2 8x3 Norton Crystolons, a coarse and a fine (+ homemade strop). When I get done on the coarse the bevels look completely flat and even. When I'm finished with the fine, all the minor variations in angle can be easily seen on the resulting bevel. They still get sharp, so I don't have the issue Bladenoobie described, but it's still a shock to see the diff. between the bevels done on coarse and fine.
 
sharpies are your friend, mark the whole bevel and edge with one, do 3-4 strokes and make sure its coming off, make 4 more and check again, i work one side of the knife then the other always tell burr and a better scratch pattern then remove the burr with alternating strokes tell its gone then i move up a grit set, i do this all the way up tell a mirror polish and then strop on 1 micron diamond paste on leather, makes a heck of an edge!.
 
I think it may actually be the aluminum oxide stone. Despite lapping I think the stone is damaged because when using my arkansas stones that arrived yesterday, I get fantastic results--starting from coarse alum. oxide, soft, hard, surgical black arkansas.
 
There you go. If technique is consistent, then the medium isn't suitable for it (or bad medium).

I do swicthing hand, always with edge facing away. Ok result, though slightly asymmetrical ;)
 
Bladenoobie1 said:
I think it may actually be the aluminum oxide stone. Despite lapping I think the stone is damaged because when using my arkansas stones that arrived yesterday, I get fantastic results--starting from coarse alum. oxide, soft, hard, surgical black arkansas.
Click to expand...

Were you using any kind of lube on the AlumOx stone, and are you using anything on the Arkansas stones? I ask because using them dry will increase the likelihood of glazing or loading up - they'll work with less efficiency and need to be scrubbed to remove the impacted swarf and stone debris. Lapping should have fixed the AlumOx stone. Always use plenty of water when lapping any stone or it can glaze. Congrats on the Arkies, good ones are nice to have.
 
i'm just about ok now when it comes to free-handing my zdp endura. it stays at 15 degrees per side which, while it can split hair in both directions, isn't really that sharp for shaving regularly. maybe i could try bringing the angle down and just give a 15 degree micro per side. any tips? i use various water stones, starting with the fine side of an ordinary carborandum for initial profiling. i finish off with fine aluminum powder with oil on a glass slab.
 
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